Clone Beer Founder's Breakfast Stout Clone

MoeIPA said:

anyone adding yeast to the bottling bucket for priming? Figure with a beer that has 2 weeks primary and 4 weeks secondary, is there enough yeast left?

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More than enough yeast left to carb

MoeIPA said:

anyone adding yeast to the bottling bucket for priming? Figure with a beer that has 2 weeks primary and 4 weeks secondary, is there enough yeast left?

Click to expand...

Mine have carbed fine.

JeepDiver said:

More than enough yeast left to carb

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This.

jeepdiver said:

more than enough yeast left to carb

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+1.

Brewed up the BYO AG recipe on Sept. 13, 2013 with a couple modifications. Bottled on Oct. 11, 2013.

Added chocolate with 2 min remaining in boil.
Used 2.0 oz of cocoa nibs.
Added 2.0oz of each coffee in steeping bags at flame-out simply for ease.
Fermented mid 60s to 70F at peak fermentation.

Of the half dozen or so clones I've attempted this one is by far the closest. I'm thrilled to have a bunch of this for fall/winter.


Appearance: Both are black with a light tan head--they look identical (will post a pic after I get them on the computer). The commercial head lasts much longer--I'm thinking this is due to oils from chocolate and perhaps coffee that are maybe removed the commercial example?

Aroma: Both are bittersweet, roasty malts, coffee and subtle, yet noticeable chocolate. The homebrew has more coffee in the nose--perhaps freshness is a culprit (commercial was bottled 8/22/13)?

Flavor: Roast, coffee, bittersweet malt and subtle chocolate. Moderate bitterness. The flavors are quite similar. The commercial is a bit smoother, slightly less bitter, and has less coffee in the finish.

Mouthfeel: Both are very similar--medium-low carbonation and moderate body. All categories are very similar but this is the closest. (Went for 2.1 vol CO2--given temp, volume--88g corn sugar).

Overall: I don't know that I'd change anything when I do it again. Certainly want to let this age another month or two and evaluate side-by-side again. This will certainly be popular at Thanksgiving and Christmas.

So after nearly two weeks, I'm down to 1.030 from 1.104. I was hoping to be further along, but from the airlock, it 'looks' like it's still trickling along.

Any advice other than letting it go another couple weeks and checking it? I think in a couple weeks if it's not making progress, I'll pitch more yeast to see what happens. It does taste effing awesome, even though every sip of my hydro sample had a coffee bean fragment in it I forgot to have the coffee ground when I bought it, so I just crushed it a bit myself.

m_stodd said:

So after nearly two weeks, I'm down to 1.030 from 1.104. I was hoping to be further along, but from the airlock, it 'looks' like it's still trickling along.

Any advice other than letting it go another couple weeks and checking it? I think in a couple weeks if it's not making progress, I'll pitch more yeast to see what happens. It does taste effing awesome, even though every sip of my hydro sample had a coffee bean fragment in it I forgot to have the coffee ground when I bought it, so I just crushed it a bit myself.

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you're at 71% attenuation (9.8% ABV). i doubt you're going to get a whole lot more out of that beer. adding more yeast won't do much - with that toxic amount of alcohol, new yeasts will just go dormant.

if you really want to attenuate more: try warming up the beer a few degrees and then gently rousing the yeast might get a few more points. if you're really serious, get a high-gravity yeast (like wlp099), make a starter with it, and pitch it a high krausen.

but personally, i wouldn't bother. getting a beer that big down 71% is quite impressive, especially if you used S-04. that beer is done.

sweetcell said:

you're at 71% attenuation (9.8% ABV). i doubt you're going to get a whole lot more out of that beer. adding more yeast won't do much - with that toxic amount of alcohol, new yeasts will just go dormant.

if you really want to attenuate more: try warming up the beer a few degrees and then gently rousing the yeast might get a few more points. if you're really serious, get a high-gravity yeast (like wlp099), make a starter with it, and pitch it a high krausen.

but personally, i wouldn't bother. getting a beer that big down 71% is quite impressive, especially if you used S-04. that beer is done.

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Thanks. Should have mentioned that I used S-05. I got confused at my LHBS and looked up the 'wrong' breakfast stout clone recipe. Not sure if that makes a difference. I'm really just concerned about bottle bombs.

How (I think) I made effective yeast:
1. Hydrated 2 packets of yeast in warm water.
2. Added some yeast nutrients.
3. Throughout the fermentation process, swirled the beer around a couple times a day, keeps yeast on their toes.

Subscribing .. this may be my next stout.

What I am brewing this weekend is an imperial porter with coffee and cacao. The 5.5 gallon batch calls for 8.5 oz. of coffee and nearly 6 oz. of cacao. It's a recipe for Pizza Port Coffee Monster. As the name implies, it is a coffee monster.

The coffee/cacao process from the brewer is:
After full primary fermentation, the beer is chilled over a number of days until cellar temp (32-34). Then it is transferred into a bright tank with coarse ground coffee and cacao nibs. The grounds and nibs are set in the tank before the beer is transferred. The grounds and nibs are tied up in straining bags in the tank. The beer is carbonated and while sitting cold on the grounds and nibs for 48 to 72 hours. Then the beer is pushed into another bright tank and is served from there.

Coffee and cacao is 3 lb. and 2 lb. per barrel (31 gallons). Coffee = 1.548 oz. per gallon and cacao = 1.032 oz. per gallon.

So this recipe looks delicious but.... I find my palate can't stand s-04. Like, *really* don't like it. What is a good alternative yeast for this recipe?

I have found I am a fan of London Wyeast 1028. Would that be OK?

I used Wyeast 1056. No issues with that.

But I would think you'd be fine with 1028 too.

What about WLP007?

WLP007 is good for big beers. Also try the rogue PAC man yeast if its available. I did a dry Irish stout and worked very well with this pacman.

WLP007 is a clumper, a fine flocculating yeast. Pacman on the other hand is real light and easily disturbed (like fine silt). When WLP007 drops, it's done and compacts hard. Pacman does not. Siphoning from a fermenter with a yeast cake of WLP007 is a dream while the same with Pacman is a problem (at least for me).

ultravista said:

WLP007 is a clumper, a fine flocculating yeast. Pacman on the other hand is real light and easily disturbed (like fine silt). When WLP007 drops, it's done and compacts hard. Pacman does not. Siphoning from a fermenter with a yeast cake of WLP007 is a dream while the same with Pacman is a problem (at least for me).

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I've not tried WLP 007 for a stout yet. I used in my AB clone. I used pacman in my last dry stout. I'm not really sure how the two compare in flavor profile, but the pacman landed itself rather well to a dry stout, with fairly neutral and clean characteristics.

I'm also wondering about San Diego super yeast. I've never tried that one before.

TD

Well s04 is an English ale yeast, as 007 is a dry English ale yeast. Some of the same profiles to them, one dries out more though. I don't know if s-04 is a good substitute. I would probably go with pacman.
I do personally like 007 and have thoroughly enjoyed it in a big stout, even one I have brewed myself.

After adding the coffee at flameout, do you guys let it steep for any certain amount of time before starting up your chiller, or pretty much just start the chilling right away?

You will hear many coffee lovers tell you to never boil coffee. The ideal temperature is 195-205F. The last time I added coffee, I turned on my immersion chiller for about 30 seconds to bring it down to 200F and then added the coffee. I waited about 5 minutes and then chilled all the way.

I've also added it at flameout as the recipe states and it was good. So is it worth the extra effort I did above? Not sure. They both tasted great.

Wow. Just kegged this recipe after 3 weeks in primary and the hydro sample is delicious. Still needs to age a bit and allow the flavors to meld, but is really close to the real deal. I backed off the 2-Row to 13Lbs as I wanted to stay around 7% ABV. Hit 1.072 OG and 1.019FG. Used 4Oz Cacao nibs and 4Oz Starbucks House coarsely ground at flameout. Also used Scottish Ale Wyeast 1728 washed from a previous brew. Will see how it ages over the coming weeks, but as of now would not change a thing. Thanks to the OP for posting a great recipe.

I brewed this tonight. Really excited about it. Cooled it down to 68 and pitched two packs of safale 04.

Also brewed yesterday, Helly. I'm excited but did have some issues.
- My Monster Mill acted up on me for some reason during the cracking of the last 1 lb of grains...no idea why. Just wouldn't grip the grains until I changed the gap. Odd.
- I managed to put the 2 min addition of hops in with my 15 minute additions (irish moss, nutrient, chocolates) - oh well
- Had more boil overs with this batch for some reason. Made no sense at all.

But altogether, I nailed a 1.088 OG @ 75* (haven't checked that efficiency yet) and the S-04 is working really well this AM. But, temp is at 68 even though the basement floor is 63 or so. Quite active!

Thanks for the recipe OP. It's been on my to-do list for 1.5 years!

pwortiz said:

Also brewed yesterday, Helly. I'm excited but did have some issues. - My Monster Mill acted up on me for some reason during the cracking of the last 1 lb of grains...no idea why. Just wouldn't grip the grains until I changed the gap. Odd. - I managed to put the 2 min addition of hops in with my 15 minute additions (irish moss, nutrient, chocolates) - oh well - Had more boil overs with this batch for some reason. Made no sense at all. But altogether, I nailed a 1.088 OG @ 75* (haven't checked that efficiency yet) and the S-04 is working really well this AM. But, temp is at 68 even though the basement floor is 63 or so. Quite active! Thanks for the recipe OP. It's been on my to-do list for 1.5 years!

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Mine is bubbling away like crazy. It got down to 59 in my swamp cooler the first night but once it raised to 60 or 61 it started bubbling pretty fast. Got it at about 63 right now. Hopefully that is a good temp for S-04. I haven't fermented that low with this one yet.

I had a stuck sparge with this one. Getting the last 1.5 gallons or so took forever. I also discovered that my HLT thermometer was off. Luckily I caught it in time to adjust. I hit about 1.079 so my efficiency is still lower than I'd like but all in all not a bad brew day.

The hop schedule on the first page appears to be calculated for 30.3 IBUs and the website lists Breakfast Stout at 60 IBUs. Has anyone tried this recipe with additional hops?

I brewed with the updated recipe, 60IBUs. My recipe used Magnum 1oz at 60min, 0.5 Centennial at 60 Min, 1oz Fuggles at 30 min, and 1 oz Fuggles at 5 min. Personally I am very happy and would not change anything.

I'm trying to understand the usage of Kona in a stout (or porter), especially in conjunction with Sumatra. Sumatra makes perfect sense because it's a full bodied coffee, even at city roast levels, with low acidity and a slight sweetness.

Kona, not unlike Jamaican Blue Mountain, tends towards a fruity and sweet flavor profile that would be overwhelmed in a stout or porter, but could possibly work well in a coffee IPA if you're using hops that impart tropical fruit flavors.

If you want an exotic coffee, I'd suggest something along the lines of Ethiopian Sidamo. The flavor profile is more complementary to a stout, being fuller bodied than the island coffees, while also (possibly) adding a slight fruit profile (berries, in this case).

I would like to do this recipe, but I'm confused as to the different versions. Is the BYO one or the one on the first page the generally "accepted" one? Or is there another variant buried somewhere ? I went through all the pages but I might have missed one.

I've done the BYO one twice and it turned out great. But the one in the first post isn't that different, so I bet they'd be similar.

So would White Labs 007 yeast be acceptable for this recipe? I've never used it in a big stout like this but I've heard if you ferment it around 65-66 degrees it will not impart many esters.

sabitu said:

So would White Labs 007 yeast be acceptable for this recipe? I've never used it in a big stout like this but I've heard if you ferment it around 65-66 degrees it will not impart many esters.

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i would think that 007, fermented cool, would be just fine. it attenuates a little lower than 002, so don't go out of your way to make a highly fermentable wort.

Wouldn't 007 leave it less malty vs. 002 or 001?

WLP007 (WY 1098)? Maybe, but... why bother?

This recipe is malty, English and calls for S-04. Seems like a no-brainer, considering S-04 is about half the price, delicious, and can be re-used just like anything else.

Just tested mine. It's at around 1.016 and tastes great. Going to secondary in a keg. Really excited for this.

I made this Saturday. Came in at 1.096 OG probably because I used 1.5lbs extra 2-row and got better eff than I thought I would. I hope with 2 packs of Safale 04 (rehydrated) that I'll be able to get the gravity all the way down. I'm in a temp controlled chamber at 62-63F and after 3 days the krausen has fallen although the blowoff bucket is still bubbling quite a bit.

I added about 3oz 100% baker's bar to the hop bag at around 10minutes. I've heard some things about adding chocolate affecting the head retention of the final product. Any thoughts or consensus on this?

I'm so excited about this beer!:fro:

It will have a little less but there is still some. No big deal to me. The excellent beer makes up for it.

my last batch of this has pretty bad head retention, doesn't last more than a minute. it is damn oily. it also has particulate (cacao from the chocolate?) that is still in suspension and that settles on the sides of the glass as you drink. luckily the beer is more than tasty enough to overcome these appearance flaws. i suspect it wouldn't do well in a competition.

Mine has been in primary for just under 2 weeks. Tested today at 1.028 vs 1.096 starting. It tastes divine. A bit too much on the alcohol I guess but I can only hope time will smooth that over. Maybe I should have diluted my post boil wort, ah well I can tell this is going to be a great beer.

I think I'm going to put it in the secondary this weekend (2 full weeks since brew) and let sit a couple more weeks before bottling. Can't decide yet if I want to add any cold brewed coffee at 2ary since it tastes so good as it is (I did add 2oz coffee post boil)

What a great hobby!!! My wife didn't know what she was getting into when she bought that first kit to get me started...

if you want to hit anything lower than 1.028, you should leave it in primary and raise the temp a few degrees. if you don't have temp control, moving the carboy to a warmer part of the house should work.

waiting a bit longer won't hurt. that's a big beer, give the yeast some extra time to do their thing.

sweetcell said:

if you want to hit anything lower than 1.028, you should leave it in primary and raise the temp a few degrees. if you don't have temp control, moving the carboy to a warmer part of the house should work.

waiting a bit longer won't hurt. that's a big beer, give the yeast some extra time to do their thing.

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I thought about it. I've been in a temp controlled chest freezer at around 64-66F for this whole two weeks. Actually I raised the temp on my controller 1° after 4 days and then another after 6 days so I'm closer to 66-68 (taking into account the play in the controller) I guess a third week in the primary wont hurt, plus then I'll be following the recipe!
I just figured that after 2wks I probably won't squeeze much more out of this high ABV baby. Considering that this bad boy will only get better with time I couldn't be more pleased.
Thanks for the feedback!

if i'm trying to drive down attenuation, i have no qualms about hitting 70 or even 72 as long as i'm 3-4 days (or more) into fermentation. temp control is essential during that initial growth phase but the reigns can be loosened once full active fermentation is achieved, IMO.

congrats on the great beer!

sweetcell said:

if i'm trying to drive down attenuation, i have no qualms about hitting 70 or even 72 as long as i'm 3-4 days (or more) into fermentation. temp control is essential during that initial growth phase but the reigns can be loosened once full active fermentation is achieved, IMO. congrats on the great beer!

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I would agree on this wholeheartedly.

Without having to re-read through the entire thread please, What's the deal with the second coffee addition?

I'd like to not end up infected. What is the best way to add the second coffee dose??

TD

TrickyDick said:

Without having to re-read through the entire thread please, What's the deal with the second coffee addition?

I'd like to not end up infected. What is the best way to add the second coffee dose??

TD

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cold steep the coffee. i don't think much can live on coffee and the pH and alcohol in the beer will kill off most bugs.