Wort to Primary - what to leave out?

I got my first issue of BYO magazine today and was reading something that an individual wrote in about siphoning the wort into the primary fermenter and then something about a "whirlpool" method to avoid drawing break material.

I am not yet an all-grain guy... is this something I need to worry about with extract brewing?

I was chilling my wort and just dumping it into the primary through a funnel as per a few directions I found. These directions also said nothing about aerating the wort before adding the yeast, so now I'm worried just what important step I might have missed.

My original brew, a port, did not turn out bad (although it had hints of a plastic taste initially) and my second batch of Alt has only been in the bottle for a week but is not very smooth... so I don't know yet if I'm ruining things or if I'm on the right track.

Whirlpooling means that you swirl the cooling wort and the trub will gather in the center of the kettle. If you siphon out of the kettle you can put it on the side and your final wort should be clearer. At least that is the way I interprete it.
Do a search for aeration as there are several threads full of methods and opinions.

gopherhockey said:

I was chilling my wort and just dumping it into the primary through a funnel as per a few directions I found. These directions also said nothing about aerating the wort before adding the yeast, so now I'm worried just what important step I might have missed.

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I think it depends on whether you're doing full or partial boils. Partial boils usually don't require aeration as the unboiled volume of water contains enough oxygen for the yeasties to be happy. Full boils remove the oxygen, so after it is cooled aeration is necessary.

Blender said:

Whirlpooling means that you swirl the cooling wort and the trub will gather in the center of the kettle. If you siphon out of the kettle you can put it on the side and your final wort should be clearer. At least that is the way I interprete it.
Do a search for aeration as there are several threads full of methods and opinions.

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That's pretty much how I understand it. By whirpooling you seperate the wort from the hot (and possibly cold) break as well as hops and other stuff. Is it necessary? Not really, but it will improve your beer.

Just found this thread. Up to now, I would brew, use a wort chiller to cool the wort to about 80 degrees, dump the whole kettle into a wort bucket with 2 gallons of cool water and then fill to the 5 gallon mark. I guess I just assumed that the sediment at the bottom of the kettle was needed for the process.

I'm now getting the feeling that I should try to leave as much of this sediment behind as possible. Is that true? I'm in the process of converting a keg to a boil kettle and will probably buy one of those hopstoppers but in the meantime, I'd like to clear up my confusion before I brew my next batch. Thanks!

Robbw said:

I'm now getting the feeling that I should try to leave as much of this sediment behind as possible. Is that true?

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Relax, don't worry...

It's nice if you can leave some of that trub behind in the kettle, but it's not imperative. You're going to leave a lot of it behind in the primary and in the secondary when you siphon into the bottling bucket.

I usually whirpool, siphon off the edge of the kettle, and then strain the last pint or so of wort through a fine strainer. It's too much of a hassle, too messy, etc to strain the whole batch of wort, IMHO.

I have tried this swirl method with my two first brews and I still have problems getting it to do anything noticable... I still end up siphoning a ton of that stuff into my primary... oops... I never thought to use a fine strainer though.. good idea...

Jester said:

I have tried this swirl method with my two first brews and I still have problems getting it to do anything noticable... I still end up siphoning a ton of that stuff into my primary... oops... I never thought to use a fine strainer though.. good idea...

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I myself have never gotten a mound of trub when whirlpooling cooled wort, even though many processes say to cool the wort and then whirlpool. However, if I start a whirlpool while the wort is hot and I'm cooling it with my immersion chiller I do get quite a nice mound in the center (but unfortunately the chiller is in the way at that point). I don't know what the dealio is.

When you use an immersion chiller, whirpool after you removed the chiller. You also want to take out the spoon after this. You will also have to let it sit covered for about 20min for all the gunk and some cold-break to settle. Now you can siphon from the side.

Like cowain said, the last bit of wort/gunk can be strained with a fine mesh. I usually strain this part with a paper towel in a colander. But I do not put this in the primary but freeze it for use a gyle (priming) and/or future starters. That's why I don't have to worry about sanitation of the colander or paper towel.

Kai

i use to whirlpool, and it works if your patient enough to wait 20-30 minutes for everything to settle out, but after i got a few infected batches i stopped touching the naked wort prior to pitching...i think the risk of contamination out weighs the advantages (if any) of leaving all the trub behind...Papazain says that trub in the primary can have a detramental effect on the finished beer in theory, but for the homebrewer its effects are negligable...

King Kai said:

When you use an immersion chiller, whirpool after you removed the chiller. You also want to take out the spoon after this. You will also have to let it sit covered for about 20min for all the gunk and some cold-break to settle. Now you can siphon from the side.

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That's what doesn't work for me. When I've whirlpooled quite vigorously after chilling and let it settle for 30 minutes it's more or less uniform on the bottom. If I whirlpool during chilling it chills faster and I get a nice mound. I just have to be careful removing the chiller to not disturb the mound.

BeeGee said:

That's what doesn't work for me. When I've whirlpooled quite vigorously after chilling and let it settle for 30 minutes it's more or less uniform on the bottom. If I whirlpool during chilling it chills faster and I get a nice mound. I just have to be careful removing the chiller to not disturb the mound.

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BeeGee, are there any irregularities in your kettle that would disturb the even rotation of the wort?

Kai

Nope, it's a standard ss kettle with no taps or anything, perfectly uniform.

Ivan Lendl said:

i think the risk of contamination out weighs the advantages (if any) of leaving all the trub behind...

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keep it covered with a large piece of aluminum foil from flame-out all the way through siphoning to the primary. And leave the spoon in during the boil. This will sanitize the spoon that you will later use to start the whirpool.

I actually found that this method is much less prone to infection than messing around with a big funnel and a mesh. Since I like to harvest some yeast, I don't want to much gunk in my primary.

Kai

BeeGee said:

Nope, it's a standard ss kettle with no taps or anything, perfectly uniform.

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Well I, just have to stop by when you are brewing next time. Something I thought of doing anyway.

Also, don't push the racking cane down all the way when you start siphoning. I put mine in half the way and then slowly push it lower as the wort level is approaching it's end.


Kai

BeeGee said:

That's what doesn't work for me. When I've whirlpooled quite vigorously after chilling and let it settle for 30 minutes it's more or less uniform on the bottom.

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thats crazy! do you live near a worm-hole or something? unless all of the particulate matter is exactly the same size and mass, i cant see how you would not end up with a conical pile in the middle...(if im correct in thinking that the heavy stuff falls out first towards the outer edges and the lighter stuff falls last closer and closer to the center)

im confused...

BeeGee said:

That's what doesn't work for me. When I've whirlpooled quite vigorously after chilling and let it settle for 30 minutes it's more or less uniform on the bottom. If I whirlpool during chilling it chills faster and I get a nice mound. I just have to be careful removing the chiller to not disturb the mound.

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Given that preventing every bit of hot and cold break and hop trub from entering the primary is not that big a deal anyway, this seems like a very sensible strategy to me. There are two significant advantages to doing this the way you have described:

1. It's one less thing (a spoon) coming into contact with your wort after it has been chilled.

2. It's 20-30 minutes sooner (no waiting for trub to settle after chilling) that your yeast gets pitched. That's 20-30 minutes less time for any nasties to get a foothold.

To me, I think those two upsides easily offset the downside of maybe a little more cold break material from chilling getting into your primary.

Yeah, I don't worry about it too much. I could be disturbing it somehow? Not sure.

Kai, maybe I'll take you up on that when I do my Aventinus clone.

Pouring the wort thru a fine strainer works for me and aerates it in the process.