Kölsch- lager before or after bottling?

Hey guys. My first post here, but I've done lots of reading and picked up lots of good info here. I've got my third batch in primary right now. The first two were kits, but I threw this one together from scratch. It's supposed to be a Kölsch, using WLP029 at 63 degrees. Beersmith calls for 3 days in primary at 60, then 12 days in secondary at 60, then age for 30 days at 45. I'll be bottling this, so I was wondering if I should lager before or after bottling. I can leave it in secondary for 12 days, and then slowly drop to 45, but I didn't know if the yeast would survive well enough to bottle carb then. Help or experiences? Thanks!!

3 days in primary eh?

Well, you can lager either in the fermenter or in the bottle. There will be plenty of yeast regardless. Typically people lager in the fermenter so you get all the yeast and proteins etc dropping out there so the bottles have less sediment.

I think 3 days sounds awfully short too. Especially as slow as its been getting started. If I rack from primary to secondary, I'll get rid of a lot of sediment. I wasn't sure if the Kölsch yeast could take those low temps and come back out of it.

i would definitely agree to lager before bottling as standard practice.

HOWEVER- to me, the flavor of kolsch beers (vs real lagers) isnt hurt by having yeast in it. so from a flavor standpoint it might not matter to you if you left alot of yeast in in the beer by lagering in the bottle.

maybe the answer might depend on why exactly you're brewing a kolsch--

if you're choosing kolsch because you really like the style and the estery flavor profile of a kolsch then its totally up to you, yeast or no yeast in final beer.

but if you're brewing a kolsch because you cant brew a true lager (no temp control/fridge, etc) then you'll probly be happier if you dont keep a bunch of yeast in the final beer so you can get a cleaner flavor.

at only your third brew its not something to worry stress about either way, but just wanted to give you a little idea of the reasons for each choice.

good luck

Personally I'd do everything in the primary. There are thousands of threads on this forum about secondaries not being necessary, feel free to research a bit. Cliff notes: No real benefit, increased chances of oxidation and infections.

Your yeast will be fine. Even ale yeasts can handle being lagered and then still bottle condition fine once they warm up. The yeast just goes dormant, not deaded. If youre doing multi-month lagers it might be prudent to add some yeast at bottling, but for typical shorter ones it's not necessary at all.

I was hoping to hear it would be OK to lager first. I'm brewing a Kölsch because I picked up the yeast before I got the fridge and Fermostat. I'm looker for the cleaner flavor and the next brew will be a true lager.

WL029's sweet spot is 65-69F. I use it to brew my hybrid lager I call " Hopped & Confused". I don't have temp control yet, so I brew it in the winter, then " lager" in the bottles after some 3 weeks at room temp. They get some lagering in the fridge for at least two weeks. Then poured cold into a glass, they have a nice bit of crispness on the back, with a lager-like balance. Great yeast!

You don't need to worry about a "secondary" before a min of six weeks IMHO. 3 days is ridiculous. Just keep it at 60 for a few weeks and let it clean itself up

Thanks for all the help guys. I'm getting pretty excited about this one. Just checked on it and it's bubbling like crazy. Hard to see through the bucket, but it looks like it's got a pretty good krauzen going too!

My method is 58* for 3 weeks, 70* for 1 week, then put the whole fermenter into my beer fridge @ 40* for a week.
I don't drink from the final vessel (keg or bottle) until its cold conditioned for a further 3 weeks.

First I agree with Grannyknot's method. 58 for 2-3 weeks, 1 week room temp, then the whole fermentor in the fridge. No secondary vessel needed.

You mentioned you will be bottling so you'll need to warm up the bottles at room temp for a few weeks for them to carb. Then you can cold condition for consumption.

I did a 10 gallon batch recently where I bulk lagered 5 gallons and the other 5 gallons I bottled first, then lagered. Not much of a difference between them however I preferred the bulk lager batch as it seemed a tiny bit more rounded.