Off taste after 3-4 weeks

Ok so now I'm really lost...I just fermented 2 batches a once, one was the home brewery's lawnmower lite, and the other was a red head ipa from the home brewery as well. The ipa fermented 3 weeks, dry hopped a week, then cold crashed a week. The lawnmower lite fermented 4 weeks and cold crashed 1 week. I kegged them both on the same day and force carbed at 25 psi for 1 day then 10psi for 3 days (now at 5-7psi)(all was done at 36 deg.) The lawnmower lite is really lite of course but has a clean taste with none of the off flavor I have been experiencing. The ipa definitley has this off taste, but not as bad as some of my beers. So....I'm thinking possibly I'm tasting the hops? although the ipa used 2 different hop varieties I've never used so one would think that shouldn't be the same as the other brews. My other theory would be that the lawnmower lite was an extract only brew with no specialty grains and the ipa was an all grain kit, so maybe im getting tannins? I mashed at 150 for 90 min. My tun is a rectangular cooler with a stainless braid. If I was getting husks through the braid could that cause the tannins? I used 5.2 and campden tablets as well. Going through my notes I did find that one other brew didnt have this off taste (but had a different off taste) and that one didnt have any specialty grains either. I have used 3 different thermometers to measure mash or steep temperatures, but none had been calibrated. Any other ideas????

In addition, both of these brews used us-05 yeast and fermented side by side at 60-65 degrees. And the lawnmower lite tastes just like miller lite and if thats the only damn beer I can make without this off taste...I QUIT!!!! I hate miller lite!!! Of the thousands of beers I have tried it is the only I cannot drink!

OK, so you've found someplace to start. All grain is giving you the flavor, but extract isnt, right? Try another extract kit with steeping grains this time - see if the flavor comes back. Something cheap and simple, like a Mild or an Innkeeper. If it comes back again, you may be grabbing tannins. If it doesnt, it may be something in your AG process?

I have done numerous extract/specialty grains in the past and have had this issue, this is why I went AG. Other than calibrating my thermometer anything else I should watch for with tannins?

I've pretty much read this whole thread.

What about hot oxidation of the wort before it cools down to pitching temp? If you read through Palmer's "How to Brew" it cautions about hot aeration causing off flavors that will be retained to the finished product.

Just a thought.

Jayhem said:

I've pretty much read this whole thread.

What about hot oxidation of the wort before it cools down to pitching temp? If you read through Palmer's "How to Brew" it cautions about hot aeration causing off flavors that will be retained to the finished product.

Just a thought.

Click to expand...

I've been getting the same off taste described in this thread on the 4 extract brews I've done. Would whirl-pooling the hot wort during chilling cause this hot aeration? I usually remove my 5 gal boil and immediately start the wort chiller and start whirl-pooling for about 15 min.

BoltsFan704 said:

I've been getting the same off taste described in this thread on the 4 extract brews I've done. Would whirl-pooling the hot wort during chilling cause this hot aeration? I usually remove my 5 gal boil and immediately start the wort chiller and start whirl-pooling for about 15 min.

Click to expand...

If by whirl-pooling you mean stirring lightly with a sanitized paddle in a circular motion to help the wort cool faster in an ice bath or copper chiller in center, then that should be ok. I do that too and no off flavors in my extract beers but I'm super careful not to splash the wort or create bubbles.

I did have a little bit of an off taste on beer batch #2 and I now believe it was caused by too high an initial fermentation temp. My fermentation room was at 68F but the beer fermented so strong that it was up into the low-mid 70's inside the fermenter for the first 24 hours of fermentation. I think from now on I'm going to ferment my ales in a room at 60 degrees so that the beer temp rises to no more than 68F

I suppose anything is possible, but I do whirlpool to speed up chilling, and did both of these last two batches the same way.

I've had issues in the past with a sweet/sour vinegar taste. I hit my FG number everytime and first draw from keg was good, then it turned bad. I think I have narrowed my issues which may help you, granted different tastes.

One: Fermentation temperature. I always put it in the basement when I brewed in the summer so it was a bit warmer than upstairs...I continued this during winter months and realized this year that it's too d*mn cold for ale yeast. I know you've gone over this before, but really make sure you're maintaining the temps.

Second: If you're kegging, do you have a check valve on your lines? I didn't have one on one of my splitters and when I tried to mellow out an awful cream ale, i was getting that taste in a newly brewed irish red. I think I had the beer back into my lines. I disassembled all serving lines, gas lines , faucets, cleaned and star-saned, and good as new. no awful, lingering taste.

Third: fermentation vessel. clean it. then clean it again. Hoses for transfer: get new ones as they are cheap.

Fourth: Ultimately, if you have a friend who brews, have him/her brew your kit on their equipment. Take notes on what he/she does. If the taste isn't there from using their equipment/bottling/kegging, go through the notes and compare it to what you do on your brew day. It helps.

Thanks for the ideas, here are my thoughts on them:
1, These last two batches were fermented side by side with the same yeast
2, May still be an issue, but I had this off taste when I was still bottling.
3, I have used 3 different fermenters and 2 sets of hoses all with the same results
4, Just now getting some friends involved in all of this so that may be a possibility soon

I'm really leading towards the tannin problem as the two batches I didnt have this issue in were both all extract batches, but I just dont understand how 3 thermometers all never say warmer than 160 and I still get them, also I dont understand how the beer tastes good out of the fermenter, and for a few days after kegging and then the off taste shows up.

I'm having a similar issue...any update?

helibrewer said:

I suspect oxidation. From my wine making I have become anal about oxidation. I purge all vessels with CO2 before racking into them. I push with CO2 when racking out of carboys. I top off all head space with CO2 and check it every 2 weeks during conditioning by using a lighter at the edge of the carboy lip (it should extinguish).

Purge your kegs with CO2 prior to filling and insure the headspace is purged before you seal it up to carbonate. Keep your racking process as closed as possible.

Good luck, keep at it

Click to expand...

wow that is SUPER anal

Nothing yet, been too busy to brew....I did attempt to calibrate my thermometers, both were off a good 10 degrees, but the funny thing was I attempted to calibrate them to boiling water and ice water and could not get them even close at both temperatures. I ended up calibrating one with boiling water and the other with ice water. My plan will be to use both and average the temperature out with them. I'm also planning to do a no sparge mash in hopes to eliminate the chance of over sparging. So hopefully I will know more in a few weeks.

My god man, just buy a new thermometer... averaging the temp between two broken thermos will only lead to more frustration. If you don't want to shell out the $90 for a thermapen, I would get the $20 one:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002GE2XF8/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

I don't have that one, but I LOVE my thermapen.

BoltsFan704 said:

I've been getting the same off taste described in this thread on the 4 extract brews I've done. Would whirl-pooling the hot wort during chilling cause this hot aeration? I usually remove my 5 gal boil and immediately start the wort chiller and start whirl-pooling for about 15 min.

Click to expand...

My latest brew (extract ale) had the off flavor again. This was my first brew that I kegged. This will be the 3rd beer I pour out. It's undrinkable. I was looking over my notes and I noticed that all 3 times I pitched yeast (Notty, Saf 04, and 05) straight from packet to chilled wort. At the last HBC meeting, I was told the off flavor is from stressed yeast.

I will be brewing my first AG this weekend with a 1L starter from stir plate.