Need Rye Saison-ish ale help ASAP!

I'm entering an informal homebrewing competition with my local club. All beers are required to be under BJCP category 16 - Belgian and French Ale. I had a vial of frozen 3724 acquired from a friend that I planned on using. I have made a starter, but afterwards read that 3724 can take a long-@$$ time to ferment out. The competition is in 8 weeks, so I need something that I know will work on schedule. So I have a propogator pack of WY 3942 that I plan on using for this beer instead. I just need some advice on how to proceed with this beer that I am, of course, brewing tomorrow.

The recipe I was going to use is 66% Pilsner, 26% Rye, 8% Piloncillo with an estimated OG of 1.056. I was going to use some Palisade hops I had on hand as the bittering hops then either add some Nelson Sauvin at knockout or as a dry hop. I suppose I could just make a Belgian pale, but was wondering if I could make a Saison-like beer by adding some spices (or, hell, even making a spiced Belgian pale).

I have the following spices on hand which might work in this beer. Everyone please weigh in on whether these would be good additions:

*Powdered coriander
*Green coriander seed from my garden
*Green cardamom
*Black peppercorns
*Dried chamomile flowers
*Dried lavender flowers

Unfortunately this will be my first recipe using rye and using belgian yeast so I kind of put myself up a creek here. Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated.

I would not add any spices. Spices to me are indicative of wits, not saisons. That being said I think you will be happy either way. But for me with Belgians, sometimes less is more. I have had a lot of luck with late hopping saisons. Most recently with a bunch of styrians at flameout.

I would take the extra time to get a pack of 3711. It's a monster, you will still be done early. And I agree on the no spices. Although if you insist I would lean toward some combination of black/green/pink peppercorns.

I just brewed a white pepper saison(but I used 2 Row and MO since I didn't have Pilsner) a week ago. I'm looking forward to seeing what it came out like. It smells great!

73Drvr said:

I would take the extra time to get a pack of 3711. It's a monster, you will still be done early. And I agree on the no spices. Although if you insist I would lean toward some combination of black/green/pink peppercorns.

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I thought about getting a pack of 3711, but I'm on a very tight budget until I get my financial aid money in August. I'm using existing hops, yeast, and DME and only bought the grains.

I think Saison yeast and Rye are awesome together. I do a batch every summer that is 30% rye. I feel that adding spices (especially strong ones like peppercorns and coriander) is not necessary because you will get spice from both the yeast and rye. I have had success with both 3711 and 3724. With the gravity you are shooting for I do not think 3724 will be a problem ( keep fermentation temps up).

I do a honey rye saison and it works well. I think 8wks is more than enough time with the yeast you have (3724). Just remember to ramp that sucker up to the 80's once the bubbling slows. It will provide you with everything you need. I agree with the no spices. I have nothing else to add except to say work with what you have. As long as your technique is good, the beer will be good. promise.

Also, you said a frozen vial? Was it in glycerin? If not, I would be careful about the viability of the yeast. Glycerin is needed in order to freeze yeast if you don't want a lot of cell death due to cell membrane punctures by water crystals. Just for what it's worth.

Try this recipe as a start - I've brewed it with Wyeast 3726 - and it's awesome. It certainly has NO need of additional spices.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/how-rye-i-am-rye-saison-2011-1st-place-best-show-hbt-comp-238831/

MDVDuber said:

Try this recipe as a start - I've brewed it with Wyeast 3726 - and it's awesome. It certainly has NO need of additional spices.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/how-rye-i-am-rye-saison-2011-1st-place-best-show-hbt-comp-238831/

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I actually was following that recipe. I realized too late that piloncillo and dark candi sugar are more different than I thought, but the base beer is there.

And I have decided I am going to use 3942 instead to ensure a prompt 3 week fermentation. But we're all decided no spices even though I'm not using saison yeast?

I brewed a saison last Sunday and pitched WLP566 Belgian Saison II Yeast. Took off like a rocket ship, went from 1.070 to 1.010 in 5 days.

BishopGary said:

I think Saison yeast and Rye are awesome together. I do a batch every summer that is 30% rye. I feel that adding spices (especially strong ones like peppercorns and coriander) is not necessary because you will get spice from both the yeast and rye. I have had success with both 3711 and 3724. With the gravity you are shooting for I do not think 3724 will be a problem ( keep fermentation temps up).

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What is your standard grain bill for that rye saison? Is it straight pils/rye?