Bottle Fermentation Mystery

I recently switched from partial mash to all-grain which has been a success (mostly because the beer is even more delicious).

One difference I have noticed from my previous batches though is fermentation after racking. While in the secondary there doesn't appear to be ANY activity. When using extract there would be some appearance of bubbles and occasional airlock activity. With the all-grain batches I am not seeing anything.

In addition, some of the bottles do not appear to have bottle-fermented and are fairly flat and slightly sweet. I'm using 1 cup of dextrose for a 5 gallon batch so there should be plenty of sugar in there. The weird thing is that the flatness seems to occur consistently in my 1 liter and 650 mL bottles, while the few 12 oz bottles I filled bottle fermented really well. So it's not like there isn't sufficient yeast to bottle ferment.

Any suggestions on what could be causing the bottle fermentation issue? Is the lack of activity in the secondary a clue or unrelated? What other factors should I consider as a cause?

Joel

the carboy action you where seeing before was probably out gassing not really fermentation. your bottle mystery might be explained by an ever so slight difference in the diameter of the bottle mouthes. the caps aren't as tight as they should be and the carbonation is escaping. you could use warm, not hot, sanitizer on your bottle caps right before you put them on the bottle. in theory the caps would shrink slightly as they cool and make a better seal.

You shouldn't rack to the secondary until fermentation is complete anyhow. The larger bottles may just be taking more time. Read Revvy's article about carbonation. Save him some typing.

put a balloon or condom around one of the bigger bottles next time and zip-tie it snugly. if it inflates, your caps aren't sealing.

go long in the primary. 10 days is my minimum in primary, 14 days in teh cooler months (like now). THEN off to secondary for another 2-3 weeks to get nice n clear for the bottle or kegging.

deyoung said:

In addition, some of the bottles do not appear to have bottle-fermented and are fairly flat and slightly sweet. I'm using 1 cup of dextrose for a 5 gallon batch so there should be plenty of sugar in there. The weird thing is that the flatness seems to occur consistently in my 1 liter and 650 mL bottles, while the few 12 oz bottles I filled bottle fermented really well. So it's not like there isn't sufficient yeast to bottle ferment.

Joel

Click to expand...

I have some pints, 22 oz bombers and other sizes that I often use, but since I enter contests I usually also do a sixer or two of standard 12 ouncers for entering. And inevitably the 12 ouncers are done at least a week faster than the larger bottles....some times two weeks ahead of time...

Also the rule of thumb is 3 weeks at 70 degrees for a normal grav 12 ounce bottle....to carb and condition....It takes longer for the yeasties to convert the larger volume in the bigger bottles to enough co2 in the headspace to be reabsorbed back into the solution...A ration I don't know how much...

Big Kahuna gives a good explanation here...

BigKahuna said:

Simple. It's the ration of contact area just like in a keg. The c02 will need to pressurize the head space (Which takes LESS TIME) in a bigger bottle (More Yeast and sugar, roughly the same head space) but then it has to force that c02 into solution through the same contact area...thus it takes longer.

Click to expand...

Also read this...http://blogs.homebrewtalk.com/Revvy/Of_Patience_and_Bottle_Conditioning/

You'll find that many people have observed that larger bottles take longer...And comparing 2 at the same time often results in a different taste, becasue they are conditioning at different rates...

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/flavor-differences-bottles-103127/#post1133388

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f35/bottle-observation-size-matters-101628/

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f35/does-bottle-size-affect-carbonation-78194/

So nothing is wrong...except you aren't waiting long enough on the larger bottles....or more than likely ALL your bottles.

Thanks so much for the detailed response. You are right--we're now 3 weeks after bottling and all sizes are much better. Glad this particular problem's solution involves me doing nothing.

Now that I've moved to all-grain I think I'm going to start lengthening both the time in the bottle and in the secondary. My current batch in the carboy seems to be benefiting from extra time as it's now starting to clarify nicely.

Cheers!

Joel

Revvy said:

I have some pints, 22 oz bombers and other sizes that I often use, but since I enter contests I usually also do a sixer or two of standard 12 ouncers for entering. And inevitably the 12 ouncers are done at least a week faster than the larger bottles....some times two weeks ahead of time...

Also the rule of thumb is 3 weeks at 70 degrees for a normal grav 12 ounce bottle....to carb and condition....It takes longer for the yeasties to convert the larger volume in the bigger bottles to enough co2 in the headspace to be reabsorbed back into the solution...A ration I don't know how much...

Big Kahuna gives a good explanation here...



Also read this...http://blogs.homebrewtalk.com/Revvy/Of_Patience_and_Bottle_Conditioning/

You'll find that many people have observed that larger bottles take longer...And comparing 2 at the same time often results in a different taste, becasue they are conditioning at different rates...

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/flavor-differences-bottles-103127/#post1133388

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f35/bottle-observation-size-matters-101628/

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f35/does-bottle-size-affect-carbonation-78194/

So nothing is wrong...except you aren't waiting long enough on the larger bottles....or more than likely ALL your bottles.

Click to expand...