Revvy's article points out something very important. While we all think we are getting great cash-back rewards of 1% or airline miles, we are actually paying more money for the services and goods we buy due to the credit card fees to the merchants. Money doesn't come from out of nowhere.
4 LHBS to choose from, 1 just took himself off the list
- Thread starter rtt121
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We are all talking about a $4 transaction right?
Yeah, he probably loses money every time he runs them, EVEN if he has a 10 buck minimum. Like the article says, merchants get hosed on fees, the smaller the business worst it probably is. And I'm sure a drycleaner takes in more business than a homebrew shop.
Most of us are not writing a book with each response, just sayin.
So that mean you don't have the brain capacity to read a well made argument? I didn't use TOO many multi syllabic words....
So that mean you don't have the brain capacity to read a well made argument? I didn't use TOO many multi syllabic words....
Touche'......
mosquitocontrol
Well-Known Member
Mine does the same exact thing and I hate it I never ever carry cash. I've had to run out to my car to covet parking change to pay him before He always gives me a judgmental face when I pull out my card and insists I buy more. That's why 99.9% I buy online. And I found a new store for urgency b
PirateBrewer
Well-Known Member
So that mean you don't have the brain capacity to read a well made argument? I didn't use TOO many multi syllabic words....
Man, if your brewing process is as thorough and well thought out as your responses, I REALLY need to try one of your beers
OP
OP
rtt121
Well-Known Member
Regarding squaring transactions with CC companies, this is just requires a few more steps and is done by plenty of merchants, including myself if a customer requests a tip be charged.
And again, HE DOESNT HAVE A MINIMUM. He doesn't like credit cards. If he is losing money on every transaction then he is not charging enough.
I purchased phone orders with him for just a pack of yeast before and paid with credit card. This is a decision he made on whim and had nothing to do with minimums.
He also does not have a computer, his prices are handwritten on everything in the store.
northernlad
Well-Known Member
I can see your point, but I wonder if you are punishing him for trying to be profitable or for being a poor communicator.
The bank charges our company a premium for nonswiped transactions so that $.40 is probably not all he's getting dinged for. On a <$5 transaction that wipes his profit out. The argument he is not charging enough doesn't hold water either because then people would be complaining about his prices. He can't win. Period. All he can do is hope to pay his bills let alone make money because he has to deal with online pricing.
Cut him some slack and understand the overhead he has to deal with to provide you the convenience of getting what you want when you want.
The bank charges our company a premium for nonswiped transactions so that $.40 is probably not all he's getting dinged for. On a <$5 transaction that wipes his profit out. The argument he is not charging enough doesn't hold water either because then people would be complaining about his prices. He can't win. Period. All he can do is hope to pay his bills let alone make money because he has to deal with online pricing.
Cut him some slack and understand the overhead he has to deal with to provide you the convenience of getting what you want when you want.
Maybe all those little nickel and dime credit charges you and others have been doing have FINALLY caught up to him, and he's going broke from them. Maybe his accountant showed him the books recently and it hit him how much he is pissing away in fees. Maybe he's having personal and/or financial problems like millions of other folks, and he's hurting from it so has decided to stop doing it.
We don't know what "cross" he may be bearing right now. I doubt, if he's been doing it for you in the past, was just a stubborn, knee jerk reaction. There's probably something bigger going on......
Hell, maybe they JUST raised he fee even more. I thin Northernlad hit the nail on the head.
Austinhomebrew
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It is against Visa or Mastercard policy to charge extra because it is a credit card purchase. You can discount for cash but not charge extra for credit cards.
Forrest
Austinhomebrew
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I pay 1.8%V plus 20 cent per transaction for MC/Visa.
Almost 4% for American Express and 4% for paypal.
43 cents period for a debit with a pin number.
So on a $200 order:
MC/visa $3.80
Amex $7.70
Paypal $8.00
Debit 43 cents
Cash 0.00
So do merchants a favor and if you can't bring cash, run your debit card and enter the pin.
I have my cashiers run cards as debit instead of credit unless the customer objects.
If you have a business and you don't have a pin pad, it will pay for itself in a couple days.
In this instance he would have paid about 32 cents in fees. He shouldn't complain. He needs to come to the reality that we are no longer a cash based society and adjust his prices accordingly.
In Omaha there used to be a camera shop in a rich area that would charge list price for everything. But they had a 20% discount for cash. The rich people wouldn't blink and hand over the card.
Forrest
Almost 4% for American Express and 4% for paypal.
43 cents period for a debit with a pin number.
So on a $200 order:
MC/visa $3.80
Amex $7.70
Paypal $8.00
Debit 43 cents
Cash 0.00
So do merchants a favor and if you can't bring cash, run your debit card and enter the pin.
I have my cashiers run cards as debit instead of credit unless the customer objects.
If you have a business and you don't have a pin pad, it will pay for itself in a couple days.
In this instance he would have paid about 32 cents in fees. He shouldn't complain. He needs to come to the reality that we are no longer a cash based society and adjust his prices accordingly.
In Omaha there used to be a camera shop in a rich area that would charge list price for everything. But they had a 20% discount for cash. The rich people wouldn't blink and hand over the card.
Forrest
northernlad
Well-Known Member
I am sure there are exceptions to this rule. I do not know if everyone has AM/PM's where they live but they charge a fee to run cards. Certainly they are big enough to enter Visa/MC's radar if they are breaking rules.
PS, the last merchant service info I read from Visa stated that a surcharge could be added if other forms of payment were accepted, meaning that if you did not want to pay it you could pony up the cash.
As far as your charge break down, I agree. If it is under $20 it is usually better for the merchant to run as credit, over that debit.
To reiterate a statement before, I know its all cool to get a bunch of airmiles and cash back, but keep in mind your friendly LHBS is paying for all the free shyt you get. Personally I hate the jackasses who run their debits as credits because the bank gives them a share of the increased charge.
jppostKW
Well-Known Member
My LHBS prefers you use a debit card as they only get charged .75 cents compared to credit which is in the 3 dollar range. I was at a leather store and they asked me to do the same thing. I have no problems with this as I try to buy local whenever I can to keep my money local i only order off the internet if I have to. This might cost me an extra 5 bucks but meh it will all even out when the zombie Apocalypse makes TP the new currency. I will be using 5 squares when everyone else is using 1.
/i need to go to bed
/i need to go to bed
I don't think the OP is punishing him for trying to be profitable. Seems to me it's just a matter of customer service. As I was saying before, it was $4.00. If someone is wigging out that much over a .40 cents charge then there is probably something else going on in their life much greater than that. It may come to light one day. I'd say give him another chance as everyone can have a bad day.
Austinhomebrew
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In this instance, the customer is right. He should have said "if you paid in cash it would help me out. But if you cant it is no problem." Or not even bring it up and be happy that he is getting the business instead of one of the other three.
Forrest
Good answer. It looks to me like the OP was just trying to work out a deal they could both appreciate.
While trying to set up a CC account at work I got a peek at all of the fees that kick in at different transaction amounts and methods. From now on if the person at the counter ask Credit or Debit I just answer, "Whatever you like is fine with me!" They know what they lose less money on, and most of the time it's not a big deal to me.
shroomzofdoom
Well-Known Member
I think there are state level rules on this--but you can charge fees for ATM, but not for using credit cards. You can have a minimum charge though ($10 or $20) and that's OK with the CC companies.
My LHBS doesn't even want to talk to customers on the phone and they won't take orders on the phone either. They'd rather you come down and wait for an hour in line...and they hate taking credit cards...You hand them the card, they ask if you have cash.
So, I buy from online and plan ahead....problem solved.
I manage client relationships for a living and this is what we call in the biz 'customer confrontational'...when the policies of the business serve the business, to the detriment of their customers.
Whenever a business puts me in between them and their vendor, I take my business elsewhere. At least you have choices, I recommend you use them.
My LHBS doesn't even want to talk to customers on the phone and they won't take orders on the phone either. They'd rather you come down and wait for an hour in line...and they hate taking credit cards...You hand them the card, they ask if you have cash.
So, I buy from online and plan ahead....problem solved.
I manage client relationships for a living and this is what we call in the biz 'customer confrontational'...when the policies of the business serve the business, to the detriment of their customers.
Whenever a business puts me in between them and their vendor, I take my business elsewhere. At least you have choices, I recommend you use them.
SpanishCastleAle
Well-Known Member
IMO it should be: If the guy is generally a good customer, is this the hill the shop owner wants to die on?
Forrest has the right answer imo. His post also illustrates why my Credit Union-issued VISA Check Card cannot be used as 'Debit' a lot of the time (like at the grocery). They just want the bigger fee.
HItransplant
Well-Known Member
---I like it, what a great idea.
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Id look at the silver lining.. you still have 3 more options of where to shop
. at least you dont live in a place where you have to continue to patronize that guy's shop because
option 2: confront the guy.. let him know that this is not an appropriate way to conduct business. Maybe he is just ignorant?? ask him if $.40 is worth losing a customer?
either way, Id agree with what appears to be the consensus.. "life is too short to waste time with bad customer service."
OP
OP
rtt121
Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the replies. If he was my only guy I would probably suck it up and just bring cash... but hes not. I will frequent the other 3 establishments.
BTW, the DME worked great.. haha.
BTW, the DME worked great.. haha.
Nova5
Well-Known Member
against most merchant agreements.
northernlad
Well-Known Member
If you are under $10 or so and hand me a debit card, its getting run as a credit whether you like it or not. It doesn't matter to the card holder how its run and its nice to control the bloodletting from time to time.
NOT true. By a country mile.
NOT true. By a country mile.
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