Compact Fluorescent Lightbulbs

I keep seeing CFL’s (compact fluorescent bulbs) being rated for 10,000 to 12,000 hours ... no doubt under laboratory conditions.

What I’m finding is that I’m getting about only 20% to 30% of that number of hours out of the ones I’ve used ... across various brands and various sizes. I’d estimate the average life I’m getting at about 1800 to 2500 hours.

I’m wondering what the difference is.
Peculiarities in the electrical supply in my house or in my area (ever heard of such a thing?)? .....
Bulbs sold locally flown in aboard a cargo plane full of rubber whoopi cushions out of Chungking?? .....

What sort of average life for CFL’s would you estimate you are getting?

I switched all my lighting over to CFL a couple years ago and I haven't had to replace any of them yet. Well, that's not true. I had to replace one in the brewery a couple times because my brew partner kept running his fat head into it.

I purchased a bunch of CFLs 5 years ago and have moved them from apartment to apartment. The only ones I've had to replace are ones in the bathroom. I figure it either has to do with the humidity in there or the constant on/off a bathroom light experiences.

Are you running them on a rheostat (dimmer)? Even at full capacity (turned up all the way) the CFL's I had in the bathroom were humming. I removed the dimmer and put a straight switch, no more humming.

MC

One of the worst things to do with CFLs is to turn them off and back on again repeatedly. It's better to just leave them on if you're going to need light relatively soon. Many people are in the old-school habit of turning off lights when leaving a room for just a minute, and with CFLs this is a bad idea.

Most don't completely fail, but they take longer to get bright, and the total brightness diminishes, drives me crazy. I also think the hourly rating is continuous, they don't include the constant on/off that real bulbs go through that shorten their life.

I really wish that we skipped this whole CFL deal and went straight to LED, these CFL bulbs are bad in just about every way.

Misplaced_Canuck said:

Are you running them on a rheostat (dimmer)? Even at full capacity (turned up all the way) the CFL's I had in the bathroom were humming. I removed the dimmer and put a straight switch, no more humming.

MC

Click to expand...

They are on a standard switch. Considering I managed to get about 4 years out of them before any of the started to go, I'm more than OK with the lifespan.

BBL_Brewer said:

I switched all my lighting over to CFL a couple years ago and I haven't had to replace any of them yet. Well, that's not true. I had replace one in the brewery a couple times because my brew partner kept running his fat head into it.

Click to expand...

Are you saying he smashed the bulb with his head? Those thing contain mercury vapour which is not very nice stuff and requires a thorough cleanup if they get broken. Google broken CFL and you will see...

We live in an older house and not all of the wiring has been updated. I have noticed that CFL's that are on the old wiring burn out faster than the others. But they still last a long time. Most in my house have not been changed since we moved in our house over 5 years ago, and some are used a lot.

My old compact fluorescent bulbs with the straight bulbs are really really old and I do not think I have replaced one yet.
The newer I have bought are the twisty ones, and I have replaced more than half of them already.
I have had two of the new twisty ones burn out with sparks and smoke.
I won't buy any more CFLs if I can help it.

I am also using two LED light bulbs now and they are okay, but weak.

mattd2 said:

Are you saying he smashed the bulb with his head? Those thing contain mercury vapour which is not very nice stuff and requires a thorough cleanup if they get broken. Google broken CFL and you will see...

Click to expand...

I actually do EH&S for a living, so I know all about universal waste. And no, he didn't break the bulb, he just bumped his head into it and it stopped working. Did that twice, so I started taking that particular bulb out when comes over to brew. Oh BTW, since you're savvy on the mercury and all, are you taking your spent bulbs to a recycling center instead of chucking them in the trash?

mattd2 said:

Are you saying he smashed the bulb with his head? Those thing contain mercury vapour which is not very nice stuff and requires a thorough cleanup if they get broken. Google broken CFL and you will see...

Click to expand...

I've smashed more than one with my head....never called the hazmat crew.

Misplaced_Canuck said:

Are you running them on a rheostat (dimmer)? Even at full capacity (turned up all the way) the CFL's I had in the bathroom were humming. I removed the dimmer and put a straight switch, no more humming.

MC

Click to expand...

They do make dimmable CFL bulbs. We have some at work. You can also get CFL's designed for 3-way switches (bright, brighter, brightest).

BBL_Brewer said:

I actually do EH&S for a living, so I know all about universal waste. And no, he didn't break the bulb, he just bumped his head into it and it stopped working. Did that twice, so I started taking that particular bulb out when comes over to brew. Oh BTW, since you're savvy on the mercury and all, are you taking your spent bulbs to a recycling center instead of chucking them in the trash?

Click to expand...

I'm not really on the CFL bandwagon yet (seems like a lot of people are getting off it now!)
I just thought that if he was breaking them with his head that would be a lot worse for him if it broke while he was standing somewhere else in the room when it broke. Good to hear they just stopped working.
The whole cleanup thing has put me on the fence about it all. It would be good to save money, and the planet ofcorse! But is it really saving the planet or just moving the issue somewhere else.
The other interesting fact about CFL usage I have read is if you think about total energy use in a home being not just lighting but heating aswell you soon realise that if you need to heat you home you are not really saving any energy by using energy efficient bulbs. Because the "waste" energy from the bulb goes to heat you house so with CFL you will be using more heating.
Now here is the kicker - if you live somewhere where most of you enegy comes from renewable resources like hydro but you use fosil fuel heating like LPG/propane you are actually doing more damage than good

mattd2 said:

I'm not really on the CFL bandwagon yet (seems like a lot of people are getting off it now!)
I just thought that if he was breaking them with his head that would be a lot worse for him if it broke while he was standing somewhere else in the room when it broke. Good to hear they just stopped working.
The whole cleanup thing has put me on the fence about it all. It would be good to save money, and the planet ofcorse! But is it really saving the planet or just moving the issue somewhere else.
The other interesting fact about CFL usage I have read is if you think about total energy use in a home being not just lighting but heating aswell you soon realise that if you need to heat you home you are not really saving any energy by using energy efficient bulbs. Because the "waste" energy from the bulb goes to heat you house so with CFL you will be using more heating.
Now here is the kicker - if you live somewhere where most of you enegy comes from renewable resources like hydro but you use fosil fuel heating like LPG/propane you are actually doing more damage than good

Click to expand...

Actually, CFL's get pretty hot too. Not as much as incandescent, but per watt of energy usage, I'd say they put out more btu's than incandescent. Besides, if it were more energy efficient to heat your house with light bulbs, they wouldn't build furnaces.

BBL_Brewer said:

Actually, CFL's get pretty hot too. Not as much as incandescent, but per watt of energy usage, I'd say they put out more btu's than incandescent. Besides, if it were more energy efficient to heat your house with light bulbs, they wouldn't build furnaces.

Click to expand...

Huh? that doesn't make senses? At least in NZ they put an equivilant incadesent bulb rating on the box - "20W CFL = 100W" sort of thing. What they are saying is you are getting the equivilant amount of light from using 20W that you would get using 100W with a normal bulb. So there is an extra 80W that is "wasted" (= heat) using a normal bulb over CFL. I'm not saying that CFL don't produce heat, just that they produce less of it than normal bulbs to give the same amount of light. So if you swap 12 normal bulbs to CFL you just reduced the amount of heating in you home by close to 1kW.
Ofcorse the flip side is if you live somewhere hot that you are using A/C even at night then this would help out a lot
And what are you running your furnace on? NG/Propane? Fossil fuels that are realeasing more CO2 into the atmosphere rather than electricy from hydro/wind/etc. - Damn it man now you got me sounding like some sort of eco-evagilist!
All I am really saying is that by sometimes only just looking at the small picture, "hey I save lots of power by using these fancy lightbulbs, I must be awesome for the planet", you are blinded to the fact that it is not really a good thing in the big picture, "why has my NG bill gone up since I changed my lightbulbs? the planets going to start hating me!"

Misplaced_Canuck said:

Are you running them on a rheostat (dimmer)? Even at full capacity (turned up all the way) the CFL's I had in the bathroom were humming. I removed the dimmer and put a straight switch, no more humming.

MC

Click to expand...

Two things...

Most modern dimmers use triacs, not resistive dimming. They tend to work by chopping the wave (either leading edge or, more commonly, trailing edge) instead of dividing the resistance.

Secondly, typical CFL bulbs are not dimmable, and should not be used with dimmers. They require a large current in order to light, usually provided by a ballast (low-cost bulbs use magnetic ballasts, while more expensive ones tend to use electronic ballasts). By dimming it, you're causing the electronics to continue to run, which will cause premature failure, potentially in the form of a fire.

There do exist dimmable CFLs, but in my experience they are terrible, in terms of light quality (especially when dimmed), dimming linearity, and most importantly, lifetime. At the cost of around $15-20 a bulb, it's not worth it.

I've moved on to LED bulbs for most applications. I am partial to the Philips bulbs, but they are not cheap. They look yellow, but the light quality is much closer to incandescent bulbs than any CFL I've seen.

All I have is my own experience and that is, CFL's suck for anything requiring short term usage as they seem to burn out pretty quick if switched regularly. So, I pretty much only use them for hall lighting to be left on when I'm away or outside lights. Not to mention I like the light spectrum of the incandescent much more. I have my fingers crossed for the LED's though. Once the prices come down I'm happy to lower my electricity bill.

They sell the CFL's for dimmer switches at Lowes/Home Depot.

I have a ceiling fan with 4 lights in it. I probably have to change a bulb probably once a month on average. I use the correct watts but they burn out pretty fast. I'm currently switched over to CFL in 3 out of 4 of the lights and none of the CFLs have burnt out.

I absolutely despise CFLs. Hate virtually everything about them. Light quality sucks, there is no such thing as a CFL that comes on to true full brightness right away, even a cool basement screws with them. Have exactly ZERO of them in my house. Now that 100-watt bulbs are getting hard to find (thanks to the since-cancelled phasing out of them), I have one cabinet in my pantry full of incandescent bulbs. Figure I've got at least 3 years worth. By then, LED technology will be at a price point I can go that route. I plan to fully skip the CFL garbage. I'd do it right now -- my basement would certainly benefit from the heat savings (7' ceiling, with 13 can fixtures), but at current costs it would run me over $500 to make that switch.

CFL's are a lot better now than they used to be. I think they rushed them out. I think a lot of people who tried them right away won't try them again. I would suggest buying a new pack and trying them again. We have a house full of them and don't have any issues, and some have lasted over 5 years and have been used a lot.

AMonkey said:

CFL's are a lot better now than they used to be. I think they rushed them out. I think a lot of people who tried them right away won't try them again. I would suggest buying a new pack and trying them again. We have a house full of them and don't have any issues, and some have lasted over 5 years and have been used a lot.

Click to expand...

I do. About every other year I buy one to see if they've managed to make a respectable product. And they consistently fail. The most recent one was a year and a half ago, a 60 watt bulb for the can fixture at the bottom of my stairs. Flip the switch on, and for the first minute, I've seen brighter NIGHT LIGHTS. Give it 5-10 minutes, and it was nice and bright. But at first, you're better off with a friggin candle.

Like I said, I'm skipping completely over the joke that is CFL bulbs, and going straight to LED.

Edit to add: I was even one of the early adopters; had one in my desk lamp in college, back about 2002 -- the 'regular' bulb got too hot next to my head during extended study sessions. Honestly, I think THAT bulb was better than the ones they make now.

Then I guess I have nothing for you.

Like I said, we have had them for quite a while and I don't notice really any difference. In the colder basement it takes about 45 seconds to come to full strengh, but not 5-10 minutes. I really am hoping the LED lights come down in price soon and are as good as hyped.

I will never use those in my house, on the outside next to my garage doors is the only place. And yes they are toxic if you break them. Here is an exceprt from the EPA (I know I don't believe everything they say either) on how to clean up one if it breaks:

Before Cleanup
•Have people and pets leave the room.
•Air out the room for 5-10 minutes by opening a window or door to the outdoor environment.
•Shut off the central forced air heating/air-conditioning system, if you have one.
•Collect materials needed to clean up broken bulb:
◦stiff paper or cardboard;
◦sticky tape;
◦damp paper towels or disposable wet wipes (for hard surfaces); and
◦a glass jar with a metal lid or a sealable plastic bag.

During Cleanup
•DO NOT VACUUM. Vacuuming is not recommended unless broken glass remains after all other cleanup steps have been taken. Vacuuming could spread mercury-containing powder or mercury vapor.


link: http://www.epa.gov/cfl/cflcleanup.html

AMonkey said:

CFL's are a lot better now than they used to be. I think they rushed them out. I think a lot of people who tried them right away won't try them again. I would suggest buying a new pack and trying them again. We have a house full of them and don't have any issues, and some have lasted over 5 years and have been used a lot.

Click to expand...

They weren't "rushed out"... the problem is that most people don't want to spend a lot, so they cheaped out on the technology, especially early on (that, and the phosphors in the bulb weren't the best, leaving only cool white temperature bulbs initially). I used to work for a company that produces a lot of bulbs, but not in the lighting division... But I was involved on electronic ballast design for a small amount of time.

Even the newer ones (the cheap packs seen at Costco and the like) aren't to my liking. My townhouse has 24 recessed can lights, all on dimmers, so the cheap ones won't work anyway (since they are not dimmable). In my book even though they are expensive, LEDs are the way to go.

VApatriot said:

I will never use those in my house, on the outside next to my garage doors is the only place. And yes they are toxic if you break them. Here is an exceprt from the EPA (I know I don't believe everything they say either) on how to clean up one if it breaks:

Before Cleanup
•Have people and pets leave the room.
•Air out the room for 5-10 minutes by opening a window or door to the outdoor environment.
•Shut off the central forced air heating/air-conditioning system, if you have one.
•Collect materials needed to clean up broken bulb:
◦stiff paper or cardboard;
◦sticky tape;
◦damp paper towels or disposable wet wipes (for hard surfaces); and
◦a glass jar with a metal lid or a sealable plastic bag.

During Cleanup
•DO NOT VACUUM. Vacuuming is not recommended unless broken glass remains after all other cleanup steps have been taken. Vacuuming could spread mercury-containing powder or mercury vapor.


link: http://www.epa.gov/cfl/cflcleanup.html

Click to expand...

Yeah... the Hg is definitely a minus. That said, LEDs do contain dangerous substances as well, such as gallium and arsenic. Luckily, though, it's in extremely small quantities and rather difficult to liberate...

If the bulbs you purchase are energy star rated, there is a minimum 2 year warranty on them that has to be honored or the manufacturer risks loosing the rating.

http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?c=cfls.pr_cfls_warranty

Save your reciepts.

I did have to use the warranty one time about 18 months ago, and the manufacturer sent me a couple of replacement bulbs. It may also have had to do with the sparks and smoke that I told them about when it failed as they said it was something that should not have happened.

I have some bulbs I don't use too much but still work after about eight years.