Belgian Dark Strong Ale The Pious - Westvleteren 12 style quad - multiple

Nierika · Apr 12, 2012

g-star said:
Well, you're already in the upper 70's in terms of apparent attenuation, so I don't think that adding more yeast is going to do much in a 10%+ ABV beer. I would just condition it as is and see how it turns out. Won't be quite as dry as the real thing, but might still be a very nice beer.

The sample was pretty tasty as is. There was sweetness there but not cloying. Also, I hadn't read the whole thread when I bought my ingredients. My LHBS had the Candi Syrup brand syrup. I bought 2 D-90 and 1 D-45. With 10 min left in the boil, my scale crapped out so I had to just wing it with syrup measurements.

After reading more It seems like a lot of people are using the D-180 for this recipe. For those of you using it, what amounts did you use?

Damn, I guess I will just have to brew this again to get it right...

smokinghole · Apr 12, 2012

Last time I made the old world I used 16.5% of my total beer as D-180. So for my 8.5ish gallon batch I used almost 4.5lbs of the syrup. I don't know for sure I had my notes in a beersmith file from the last brew and it crashed so I lost the modifications I made the day before brewing because the standard recipe for me is 7.5gal. My recipe is slight modified too from the original in the post. Also as a bit of side fun the reason for my almost 9 gallon batch was to split some off and do sour cherry and oak. So I have three gallons of sour cherry oaked quad along with my standard version.

Nierika I see your in Philly. I suggest you look into getting some ECY09 from Princton Homebrew and brew this recipe with that yeast. It made for a very very nice beer.

Nierika · Apr 12, 2012

Thanks for the heads up. I've heard some good things about East Coast Yeast!

bhaff · Apr 15, 2012

Brewed traditional last night. Wondering how long it took for your fermentors to climb into the 80's? I am at 78 within 20 hours of pitching. I do have the fridge set to slow this beast down at 81.

rjwhite41 · Apr 19, 2012

I have seen several people come back and report on comp results with this beer so I thought I would do the same. I got a 29 and as many people before me have stated I was knocked big time for fusels with all responses telling me to lower my ferm temp. I think it's a little odd when quads I drink have more fusels than my beer but fyi for all others looking at this fermentation regimen.

shmEk · Apr 19, 2012

rjwhite41 said:
I have seen several people come back and report on comp results with this beer so I thought I would do the same. I got a 29 and as many people before me have stated I was knocked big time for fusels with all responses telling me to lower my ferm temp. I think it's a little odd when quads I drink have more fusels than my beer but fyi for all others looking at this fermentation regimen.

Thanks for sharing. Also, which version did you submit and did you do anything different then the OP versions? What comp were you in?

g-star · Apr 19, 2012

In my experience, letting this yeast rip up into the low 80's uncontrolled in a high gravity wort is a mistake in a typical homebrew bucket/carboy setup. Too many fusels produced this way.

Much better results obtained by keeping temps in the mid 60's for the first 48-72hrs, then ramping up to 75F over the course of a week.

smokinghole · Apr 19, 2012

I've found that many times with competitions beers are judged on a preconceived idea of what the beer should be. I wonder how a real Westy would fare at these comps compared to the homebrewed versions. I know saq ended up rated better than the real deal in a judging he was involved with.

rjwhite41 · Apr 19, 2012

smokinghole said:
I've found that many times with competitions beers are judged on a preconceived idea of what the beer should be. I wonder how a real Westy would fare at these comps compared to the homebrewed versions. I know saq ended up rated better than the real deal in a judging he was involved with.

saq ran that judging.

g-star · Apr 19, 2012

smokinghole said:
I wonder how a real Westy would fare at these comps compared to the homebrewed versions. I know saq ended up rated better than the real deal in a judging he was involved with.

Interesting question. I've had the real deal several times, and it has no detectable fusel/solvent character, which is just one part of its unique charm. I wish I could say the same about my Old World version, but I've got to keep it real.

rjwhite41 · Apr 19, 2012

shmEk said:
Thanks for sharing. Also, which version did you submit and did you do anything different then the OP versions? What comp were you in?

Old world/traditional. I did 2# of d2 and 1#of d1. Everything was pretty much the same otherwise. IBU (Iowa Brewers Union) open. The apprentice actually scored my beer higher originally but you can see that he erased numbers and lowered them. There were comments about a lack of hop aroma and flavor from one of them, which we all know is not a part of this style. But all listed fusels as a problem. Again, Rochefort (I've never had Westy) has more fusels than my beer as do the vast majority of quads I've had (and I drink a lot of them). I'm not sure what to think about the results to be honest. I can taste what they are talking about but I disagree with their belief about the style, at least the commercial representation of it.

rjwhite41 · Apr 19, 2012

double post

Brewskii · Apr 20, 2012

rjwhite41 said:
I had a minute so I ran to my office. Here's the write up and I believe there are some videos on youtube as well.

BTW... Thanks for this info... Things got busy and I still haven't got my materials together yet. Informative vid though. Thx

Nierika · Apr 25, 2012

Looks like mine finished out at 1.024 (my OG was way over). It's pretty tasty coming in at 10.4%. I haven't started the cold conditioning yet.

I have a bunch of Palo Santo that I have from my travels to Peru. I was thinking about throwing some into the secondary, but I'm not sure how much or what method. They are in large chunks and pieces about the size of a finger. I'm guessing that I should soak them for a while in vodka or everclear to sanitize. Do I leave the pieces whole or chop them into smaller pieces to increase surface area? Any thoughts on amounts or techniques is appreciated.

bottlebomber · Apr 25, 2012

Is it toasted at all? You might consider toasting it lightly to bring out some flavor

eludden · Apr 27, 2012

Nierika said:
Looks like mine finished out at 1.024 (my OG was way over). It's pretty tasty coming in at 10.4%. I haven't started the cold conditioning yet.

I have a bunch of Palo Santo that I have from my travels to Peru. I was thinking about throwing some into the secondary, but I'm not sure how much or what method. They are in large chunks and pieces about the size of a finger. I'm guessing that I should soak them for a while in vodka or everclear to sanitize. Do I leave the pieces whole or chop them into smaller pieces to increase surface area? Any thoughts on amounts or techniques is appreciated.

I've used Palo Santo once in an RIS and my experience is that a little goes quite a long way. I used about 0.25 oz in 4 gal and it added a nice subtle flavor/aroma without dominating. The RIS was 13.5%ABV and I didn't actually sanitize the wood before adding, which may have been risky but it turned out well. I also left the wood as one whole chunk instead of chopping. Let us know how it turns out in this brew and how much you end up using, I'd be curious.

Akavango · May 8, 2012

I bottle the traditional yesterday and it was wonderful. Can't wait until it is fully ready to be drunk.
How long do you age it in the bottle before drinking it? I plan not to touch it for a least 2 months.

I have a new world fermenting right now, looking forward to compare them both as well as with the original.

Layne · May 8, 2012

Brought mine the theZapps beer festival exctly 2 months from brewday, and everyone loved it! Kinda sad to see the keg drained that day, but is was a pleasure to share this great beer with all those folks.

jpoder · May 8, 2012

Akavango said:
How long do you age it in the bottle before drinking it?

IMHO, as long as possible! I brewed both the new world and old world versions in January last year, and they keep getting better...

Akavango · May 9, 2012

jpoder said:
IMHO, as long as possible! I brewed both the new world and old world versions in January last year, and they keep getting better...

Which one do you like best? and did you compare them to the original?
If so what are you conclusions.

I put most of the bottle in a hard to reach place to be able to resist as long as possible.

Gritsak · May 9, 2012

What category are people entering this in?

The obvious choice is 18E- Belgian Strong Dark Ale, since it has Westy 12, St. Bernardus, Rochefort 12, etc. listed as classic examples of the style. However, some internet sources and the actual BJCP guidelines also list 16E- Belgian Specialty Ale as a place for Trappist Quads.

Those with competition success with this beer (saq), what category did you use? I'm leaning towards 18E since 16E is broad.

rjwhite41 · May 9, 2012

I entered 18e but I didn't have a lot of success.

saq · May 9, 2012

18E. The kinds of quads that fit into 16E would be more like Pannepot or things that are more like Belgian Barleywines (Scaldis Ambree), basically things that stray pretty far out of the entirety of cat18.
I'm kegging my most recent batch that has been in primary for 3 weeks where it will condition for a bit before getting tapped.

Gritsak · May 10, 2012

18E it is then, thanks for the replies. I picked up a bottle of St. Bernardus 12 last night for comparison and my realized westy clone was way undercarbonated. Luckily i have a few more days until entries are due, so i can still jack up the psi.

cercueil · May 10, 2012

Thanks for the recipe Saq. I searched high and low for a good Ommegang Three Philosophers clone and didn't come up with anything. I figured I needed a really good quad as a base and ran into this recipe. I added 48 ounces of Vintners Sweet Cherry Puree after about 5 days of fermentation. Its about 3 months old now on tap and its unbelievable. The cherry flavor is not overpowering and you still get to enjoy the great quad flavor. Thanks again for a great recipe and a great job talking about mashing low to get the attenuation and dryness that this needs.

sockmerchant · May 11, 2012

My slightly modified version of the "New World" has been close to two months in the bottle now. Really damn good. One of the better brews I've made I reckon.

I've been having one bottle a week to see how it develops. Quite remarkable how it changes really. If i keep having one a week it will last into next year. Should be interesting

The biggest difference probably came from my home made candi sugar which turned out pretty damn dark

Cheers!

bigbopper · May 14, 2012

brewed this on "the big brew day".missed sg by a few points but had a solid week of fermentation(blow off tube went nuts for 4 days) cant wait to try this.will keg 5 gal. and bottle 5 gal. any specifics on bottling ?

bhaff · May 15, 2012

I am still in my secondary but I plan on repitching at bottling.

rjwhite41 · May 15, 2012

I repitched at bottling but mine was bulk aged for 6 months.

BuffaloBeer1 · May 17, 2012

This looks great. I was hoping to brew this next weekend, however, had some questions about this. The highest gravity I have brewed thus far has been a 1.075. I have never used a starter, and have never had any problems getting down to the FG. I usually use either a dried yeast or Wyeast smack packs. Here are some of my questions.
1) I only have 6.5 gallon buckets for fermentation fitted with airlocks. Do I need to worry about blowing off the airlock with this one?
2) I was planning on substituting about 3lbs. of DME due to constraints on the amount of grain I can fit. Would it be beneficial to hold that off until after the fermentation dies down a little, then mix up some wort with it, add it to the primary and restir things? My thinking, is that might help get it down to the FG while not having to worry about exploding yeast.

Thanks for any help.

Belgian Dark Strong Ale The Pious - Westvleteren 12 style quad - multiple

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