Secondary Fermentation

Hello All,

I'm about to join this hobby of homebrewing and have done alot of research. I'd like to brew all grain and have found alot of helpful information on the forums here and other sources as well. One subject that I have not seen covered too much is secondary fermentation. How long do you need to have your batch in the secondary fermenter, and is an airlock necessary for the secondary process. Is this where you add sugar to aid in carbonation, or do you not need to add any sugars because of the yeast? Also, after bottling how long should the beer be kept in a dark place before you can refrigerate and consume? I apologize if these questions have been asked before, but I did not find the info in the FAQ's or search portion of the website. Thanks in advance!

A lot of folks around here don't use a secondary fermentation. They just leave the wort in primary until they are ready to bottle. Yes, you'd still want an airlock on the secondary to prevent other bacteria from getting in. You would not add sugar until you bottle the beer. The yeast eat the sugar and product alcohol and CO2.

A decent general rule I have read about is the 1-2-3 week rule.
1 week in primary
2 weeks in secondary
3 weeks in the bottle
and you're ready to go.

I'm very new to this as well, but I'm sure one of the senior members will correct me if any of this is incorrect.

Pyrenus is right on, but one clarification. A secondary is a clearing tank. There shouldn't be any fermentation going on there. You just use it, if you want, to get the beer off the trub and allow more of it to settle out.

Many here don't use secondary at all. I use both methods, meaning extended primary then straight to bottles and a couple weeks in primary then a couple more in secondary. Depends on what type of beer I'm making. For instance, I used a secondary on a recent pumpkin ale because that produces a lot of trub and I want it as clear as I can get it.

A great resource for a step by step walk through on brewing your first batch can be found at How to Brew - By John Palmer by John Palmer. That site contains an early version of his book, How To Brew, that is recommend reading for any brewer of any skill level. Great information in that book.

Shecky's right. Secondary Fermentor is a misnomer. It is really a clearing tank or Bright tank in the industry used to bulk age the beer in another vessel so the Fermenting tanks can be cleaned and reused. The fermentation should be done before you move to the secondary and the yeast should have already started flocculation. At that point, why bother moving it just to move it again to the bottling bucket? Leave it alone for a while longer and then rack to the bottling bucket and proceed as normal. Save a step, save a chance of introducing an infection, and allow the yeast to clean up after themselves with a larger cell count.

Oh, boy. Here comes this fun again. There are a few reasons why "secondary fermenter" is not a misnomer. For many brewers, some fermentation does occur in the secondary.

First, fermentation does not always complete in the primary. Racking beer to the secodnary rouses the yeast and often results in further attenuation. Getting those last few points out can be very important if you are bottling. Most bottle bombs are not the result of overpriming, in a sense, but of failing to reach full attentuation before priming. Even if you are kegging and want the clearest beer you can get, that little bit of fermentation in the secondary will help you along.

Second, some beer styles (or recipes) call for a second fermentation by adding more fermentables. In those cases, the brewer usually wants to rack off the old trub before adding those fermentables.

Finally, the practice of an extended primary fermentation, followed by immediate packaging, has only recently become common. Back before a homebrewer could reliably get excellent quality yeast, you wanted to get your beer off the inital trub as soon as possible or risk nasty consequences (e.g., autolysis). Often, that meant racking after fermentation had slowed but not completed, usually within the first several days after pitching. Fermentation clearly continued and completed in the secondary. Because many brewers who have been around for a good while don't like to fix things that ain't broke, they still follow that practice.

I still advise and use a secondary, even though I have high confidence in today's yeasts. I find it makes my brewing more consistant and, frankly, better. I also leave beer in the primary for at least 10 days after visible yeast activity begins, so that there is plenty of time for the yeast to both have its party and clean up, afterwards. I've tried a couple batches where I just leave the beer in the primary for three to four weeks and then kegging straight out, and I was slightly less happy with the results, both in the beer and in the perceived convenience (i.e., I did not see any extra convenience, as it was a greater hassle keeping trub out of the keg). On the other hand, I know many brewers who go straight from the primary to the package (or bottling bucket) with great results. Do what suits you.

Just as an aside, there is virtually no risk of introducing contamination when racking to the secondary, so long as you practice proper sanitation. You have a finished beer, there, still with quite a bit of yeast suspended within it. That is not a happy place for intruders to find refuge. You do, however, need to consider oxidation, but that also is not a problem with proper practice (e.g., avoid splashing, use a properly sized vessel). If you can purge your secondary with CO2, do that. If not, the CO2 that comes out of solution when you rack should provide plenty of protection.

As another aside, comparing homebrewing to industry brewing is a poor analogy, unless you have analgous equipment and practices. For those homebrewers with conical fermenters and who very quickly repitch slurry, the secondary might be a true bright tank. For the rest of us, not so much.


TL

Thanks Tex. I should have clarified more I suppose but I'll leave it as is for continuity. In THIS situation, secondary is a bit of a misnomer. I do use secondaries when doing fruit additions, oaking, bulk aging on big beers and the like.

However, I still maintain that moving a small beer off the yeast before fermentation finishes, while not "detrimental" per say, isn't necessary for a properly prepared wort with a health yeast count. As to this being a "recent" development, I'd say within the last decade at least. I've been brewing mostly primary only beers for over 6 years now. I suppose it depends on your definition of recent. In terms of the thousands of years of brewing history, sure it's recent.

As to autolysis, with proper yeast counts and proper temps I contend that it is so rare as to not be a major concern to new brewers. Too many phrases are bandied about by experienced brewers, ie. autolysis, infection and hot side aeration, that new brewers, imo, may be scared off by the boogiemen of brewing.

I'm of the school that the easier brewing is for individuals at first, the more chance they will stick around and having more homebrewers active should be everyone's goal. I agree, do whatever suits you.

Well, Tex, if you really want to be literal about it ...
As always, good clarification.

after letting the bath sit in secondary fermantation do i need to mix corn sugar blended in water into the secondary fermenter, blend and then bottle so i have carbonation? is this necessary to get carbonation if im using dme in the recipe? also if i'm adding fruit to the mix during the secondary fermentation can i go straight to bottling after a couple of weeks and still have carbonation in the beer? sorry for all of the questions i'm just trying to be thorough.

Recent, as in I learned to homebrew 15 years ago, and the conventional wisdom and practice at that time was (and I'm still prone to, since it works - as Tex said, it ain't broke, why fix it?) to put every batch into secondary.

Having only recently come back to any sort of brew discussion groups, after a several year break from brewing caused by being otherwise too busy with other stuff, this "leave it in the primary for 3 weeks and bottle" idea is new to me - and I doubt I'll do it, since I own secondaries, they free up space in my primary, and they allow me to get most of the crud off the bottom of the beer, so that less crud ends up in my bottles. I see a few folks talking about tossing a gallon or half-gallon of beer to achieve the same end and I know they think very differently than I do - I want to get down to the last bit above the crud, and the inevtiable realities of putting a racking cane in are that you'll stir some up at the beginning, and get some in at the end as well - put into secondary, that makes for a much smaller cake which is less prone to ending up in the final product, and is more yeast than trub if any of it does.

It also means that any yeast I re-use from primary is of the "more flocculent" end of the range, since it dropped out in a week or two.

jackwhite75 said:

after letting the bath sit in secondary fermantation do i need to mix corn sugar blended in water into the secondary fermenter, blend and then bottle so i have carbonation? is this necessary to get carbonation if im using dme in the recipe? also if i'm adding fruit to the mix during the secondary fermentation can i go straight to bottling after a couple of weeks and still have carbonation in the beer? sorry for all of the questions i'm just trying to be thorough.

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After secondary, you rack into the bottling bucket in which you have already put your 3/4 cup of corn sugar boiled in 2 cups water. The racking into the bottling bucket mixes the sugar solution into your beer. You wouldn't mix your sugar in the secondary as that would sir up any sediment that has cleared out of your beer in that vessel. You still need to do this if you use DME because your yeast has already processed any sugars from the DME that it could to make alcohol. You need to add more sugar at bottling to produce the CO2 that escaped during fermentation out of your airlock.

If you added fruit in the secondary you still want to wait until your beer has finished fermenting before bottling and follow the same steps for bottling as before.

jackwhite75 said:

after letting the bath sit in secondary fermantation do i need to mix corn sugar blended in water into the secondary fermenter, blend and then bottle so i have carbonation? is this necessary to get carbonation if im using dme in the recipe? also if i'm adding fruit to the mix during the secondary fermentation can i go straight to bottling after a couple of weeks and still have carbonation in the beer? sorry for all of the questions i'm just trying to be thorough.

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While you CAN mix it in the secondary, it's better to boil (to sanitize) the corn sugar with some water (2 cups /.5 liter often suggested) and place that in a bottling bucket, then siphon from the secondary into the bottling bucket. But you can mix it into the secondary - you just end up mixing up the sediment you've been getting out for several weeks, and much does not re-settle until the brew is bottled. Not how I actually do it, but I'm not a particularly good model for most to follow - that is the method most people use happily and successfully.

Some relevant sections from the free, online version of How To Brew by John Palmer - if you are trying to be thorough, READ at least sections 1 and 2 of that free resource.

How to Brew - By John Palmer - Priming Solutions

How to Brew - By John Palmer - Using PrimeTabs

oh, so you can still add the sugar into the secondary and let it sit for some time before you can bottle. is that correct?

jackwhite75 said:

oh, so you can still add the sugar into the secondary and let it sit for some time before you can bottle. is that correct?

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No. If you add the sugar while in the carboy, it'll ferment out. The purpose of adding the sugar when bottling is so that it'll make a mini-fermentation in the bottle. Since the co2 can't off gas in the bottle, it's absorbed by the beer. That makes carbonated beer.

If you add it to the secondary, it'll ferment out. Then, you'll bottle fermented beer that will be flat.

You add the sugar JUST before bottling. Like minutes before.

It's been recommended twice now but just in case you missed it before, a very good source for a step by step explanation of brewing that will help you get the whole process straight in your mind can be found at How to Brew - By John Palmer.

I read at another site that adding a small amount of sugar to the secondary fermentation can help condition and clarify. I made a simple sugar with 250 g sugar and 250 ml water and added this to the secondary ferment when transferring from the primary carboy. I'm waiting on pins and needles, doubt is creeping in... Have I screwed it up? Will I take out too much of the remaining yeast so that it won't carbonate? Will the sugar not be eaten after the primary fermentation stage and when bottling can risk exploding bottles as the mix will be off?? Or am I just over analyzing? Has anyone tried this before? My desired effects were a less yeasty finished product, a thicker head and a more full-bodied beer.

Goofy1 said:

Has anyone tried this before? My desired effects were a less yeasty finished product, a thicker head and a more full-bodied beer.

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AnOldUR said:

What you did is called incremental feeding. It will not help clear your beer, just boost the ABV without stressing the yeast.

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You didn't screw anything up, but there isn't any need to feed the yeast in secondary. When the yeast are done, they flocculate and fall to the bottom, so the beer will clear after fermentation. Sometimes they don't really fall out that well, depending on yeast strain, so it's helpful to place it in a cold place for a couple of days if you can.

As AnOldUR said, you will boost the ABV slightly by adding sugar. The one thing to note, though, is that sugar will thin the body of the beer as well. If you want to fuller bodied beer, stay away from adding simple sugars. Malt extract doesn't do that, but sugar does because it's fully fermentable. It doesn't leave any residual sugars behind, and will dry out the beer some.

Since it was a small amount though, you probably won't notice it. That's more of an explanation of why not to do that next time.

I was reading this older thread in looking for an answer to my problem in regards to secondary fermentation... Any help would be appreciated.

I am a new brewer making only my third beer batch. I had read numerous posts regarding doing a secondary fermentation to reduce the amount of sediment in the beer and to give the yeast more time to ferment (your posts here were very informative). I have made a Brewers Best recipe for Irish Stout that just came out with NO carbination. The same exact thing happend to my first batch, which the sink ended up drinking because flat beer sucks. The flavor is definitally there... no sour or cidery flavor, just no carbination. Here's the rundown of what I did:
1 week in primary fermenter, 2 weeks in secondary fermenter, bottled and used carbination tablets (which worked great for my second batch), sat one week in bottles.
Is there any way I can still resurect this brew? Is there anything else that I am doing wrong. Thanks in advance for your reply.

One week in bottles is just not long enough. I have a stout that has been sitting for 3 weeks and is just starting to carb. Patience!

If, after a few more weeks it still hasn't carbed, you can try to pop the top and add a few grains of dry yeast and another carb tab. But it should be OK.

Thanks BioBeing... I'll let you know what happens in three more weeks.

I secondary because I never have the amount of empty bottles needed for bottling. When I do have the bottles I procrastinate, and am not always in the mood to do the bottling work. I also secondary because I need my fermenting vessel for my next brew. So my secondary fermentations are usually in a state of limbo. lol. I get to them when I get to them. I also think that its a good idea to let your beer maturate as a whole in a secondary for a while rather than rushing it into single bottles. Another benifit for me to secondary is that I can't own a hydrometer because I store them improperly and break them. lol

I'm going to secondary because from what I ready even if some say it isn't necessary, IT CAN'T HURT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

brewagentjay said:

I'm going to secondary because from what I ready even if some say it isn't necessary, IT CAN'T HURT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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As long as you have good control of your sanitation processes and leave the beer on yeast long enough for it to finish, sure.