My first All Grain Lager

Well guys, I am ready for lagers. I plan to take advantage of this coming winter.

I would like to make a Bock and a Pilnsner. Any hints that are not in the books? Any specific kind of yeast that you would recommend?

How would U make a starter using lager yeast? Below 65F or even lower?

Primary fermentation time? Any surprises?

Thanks in advance, Nil

Nil, I put together an AG lager, my first, pitched two packs MJ's M84 24 hours ago, currently sitting at 52*. Zero activity, its so weird to not see activity yet but apparently this is normal.

That would drive me up the wall, as I am a dedicated FV watcher

your starter should generally be 3-5 liters. if you decant the liquid on top, don't stress about the temperature of your starter. alternatively, you can pitch two packets of rehydrated 34/70. the other dry lager yeast (s-23) i've always avoided. if you did everything right, you should expect activity within 36 hours and a krausen within 72 hours

my method is to primary ferment about 7 days at 50-54 degrees, then pull for a nice long diacetyl rest when fermentation is 75% complete. this rest happens at room temperature. the length of my d-rest can be as short as one day or as long as a week, depending on how it tastes and if the yeast has cleared. i am not at all shy about leaving the beer for a while at room temperature. i think it clears up not only diacetyl but also sulfur. others let the sulfur clear during lagering. anyhow, after the rest, i cold crash below 35 degrees for a few weeks.

there are different ways to do this, the above is just what i do. hope this helps.

for me, i learn the most about when to do what and what the beer needs by tasting the product as i go along. it won't be that meaningful at first, but after you start tasting everything you make at different stages, it's a lot easier to understand what is actually going on.

your starter should generally be 3-5 liters. if you decant the liquid on top, don't stress about the temperature of your starter. alternatively, you can pitch two packets of rehydrated 34/70. the other dry lager yeast (s-23) i've always avoided. if you did everything right, you should expect activity within 36 hours and a krausen within 72 hours

my method is to primary ferment about 7 days at 50-54 degrees, then pull for a nice long diacetyl rest when fermentation is 75% complete. this rest happens at room temperature. the length of my d-rest can be as short as one day or as long as a week, depending on how it tastes and if the yeast has cleared. i am not at all shy about leaving the beer for a while at room temperature. i think it clears up not only diacetyl but also sulfur. others let the sulfur clear during lagering. anyhow, after the rest, i cold crash below 35 degrees for a few weeks.

there are different ways to do this, the above is just what i do. hope this helps.

for me, i learn the most about when to do what and what the beer needs by tasting the product as i go along. it won't be that meaningful at first, but after you start tasting everything you make at different stages, it's a lot easier to understand what is actually going on.

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+1 - I have a very similar schedule and lager for 6 plus weeks. I also use a dry Nottingham to add at priming.

Couple of things come to mind.

1) For good results, you really need to have More than just cool/cold temps but good temperature control. Controlling temps is key with lager fermentations.

2) lager yeast produces a clean and sulfury profile when fermented at cool temps (48-52). It will
Grow in temps much much warmer but no one talks about that because it doesn't make good beer.
In a starter, the name of the game is propagation and health, not flavor. Therefore, ferment your starter at room temp as you would an ale starter. Cold crash and decant the starter beer prior to pitch.

3) the use of pure O2 in your wort prior to pitch will likewise help you get good results. A sintered stone and air pump will work but take more time. either way you'll need to do a thorough aeration prior to pitch.

I find the first few days to be critical for temps. I start low prior to pitch (40-42) before you pitch- then let it free rise to 48-50F. 7 days after pitch i will let it free rise until It hits FG ( I let it get as warm as it wants in a cool room or in my fermentation chamber). Then rack to 2ndary, and crash to lager temp. And sit on it as long as you can stand. Don't be surprised to see it slightly carbonated at bottling time due to cold temps and some signs of additional fermentation even as it lagers.



Good luck.

Thanks, guys. Your inputs have been very useful. I'll let U know how it goes.

Thanks, Nil