using a TON of CO2! help!

hello
UPDATE: Picture of regulator on Page 3

I just put a batch of Belgium Wit in my first kegarator keg. I have had the problem of it being to foamy, but this isn't necessarily my concern (although it may have something to do with it) I have read a ton on how to fix the foam, I have a feeling its the length of my line (3-4ft)

THE PROBLEM IS... at full, the CO2 tank read about 800....its only been a week and a few days, its now down to 250!... I force carbonated at 30PSI for about 2 1/2-3 day (i know, maybe a little to long).... but if there was a leak, I don't think it would have held at 30psi for that long.. plus I checked it often by spraying water around all the seals to see if it bubbled.... Any ideas?

after 2-3 days I turned off the co2, purged the regulator (not the keg) then turned it up to about 8PSI... the next day it was back up to 12PSI??... it was in the kegarator this whole process as well.

EDIT: I just purged the tank.. going to let it sit until I get home from work later tonight.. just checked for leaks again... none that I can see.. we'll see what happens

1. Dont look at your high pressure regulator. It does not give you any indication of how full your tank is until it is empty. Compressed liquid CO2 will have the same pressure if it's a full tank, or 1/4 of a tank, the gauge should only change due to temperature, or when the liquid CO2 is gone and all thats left is compressed gas.

2. It sounds like you over-shot your carb levels with the 30 psi. Seems like the beer is trying to come to equilibrium, but there is too much CO2 in solution for it to remain at 8 psi at the temperature it is at. Some of that CO2 is releasing and causing the overall pressure of the keg to creep back up. This is a problem with the "blast carb" method. This is one of the reasons why I set my regs to serving pressure and let it carb up at that for about a week. Never a chance of overshooting.

good to know... I just found it odd that it went down like that over about 2-3 days...

anyone else have input how I can solve this... I turned off the co2 about 10hrs ago, purged the keg completely... I am now going to turn it back on at 5psi just cause im scared of ruining it if I let it go overnight

I'm guess that your CO2 tank is in the fridge with your kegs. The cold CO2 is going to compact inside the tank, which is making your regulator read that there is less CO2 in the tank than there actually is.

Relax, Don't Worry, Have a Draft Homebrew.

Ignore the HP gauge.
For your foam issues of being over carbed, turn you reg down to 10-12 psi, then pull the release valve on your keg every few hours to purge the excess gas. It'll slowly but surely come down to normal.

thanks guys

My 20# tank reads 400 PSI at 34 degrees, and almost 700 at room temp.
Don't sweat it! Assuming the temperature of your tank stays the same, it'll read 300 PSI for 99.9% of it's time. It'll only drop when the liquid CO2 has all changed to gas and made it to your kegs. And then it's gonna drop so fast you won't have any warning. It's just the way liquefied gasses in tanks work.

Learn to ignore the HP gauge When your pours get really slow, you will know it's time for another tank.

the tank should be stamped with a tare weight. this is the weight of the tank without the regulator on it. you can get a pretty decent idea of how much gas you have by simply putting the tank on a scale and subtracting the tank tare weight. when it's empty, re-weigh it with the regulator attached, and it'll be even easier to figure out how much is left next time (without having to take off the regulator assembly)

this is the most reliable way to determine how full the tank is.
this is the way the shop who fills it determines if it's full.
your 5# tank should weight 5# + the tare weight after being filled.

the high-pressure gauge is not a fuel gauge, it does not tell you how much is in there, just what the inside pressure is. in the case of liquified gasses, pressure does not always correspond to volume, as a liquified gas will maintain a constant pressure (the pressure at which the liquid turns into gas) until all liquid has been gassified. this pressure will vary based upon ambient temp of the pressurized container, higher temp making the pressure rise and lower temp making the pressure contract - neither of which affect volume (or more specifically, Mass) in a closed container.

ught oh!!

just went to pour a beer (2 days since last one) and the tank is on empty!. if I can't get it filled this weekend, is the beer F-ed!? or can I just re-carbonate it when I get it filled?

again, im not sure how this happened... looks like the reading on the meter WAS accurate afterall. Could this be from perging the keg... how long should a small bottle of CO2 typically last? i was told a few kegs worth....this only lasted me 2 1/2 weeks AT BEST!

and still no leaks detected

Your beer will stay carbed in the keg as long as the keg isn't leaking. Just like a big bottle. What size tank do you have? Try some soapy water in a sprayer to check for leaks. Check everywhere. I would suspect a leak.

lschiavo said:

Your beer will stay carbed in the keg as long as the keg isn't leaking. Just like a big bottle. What size tank do you have? Try some soapy water in a sprayer to check for leaks. Check everywhere. I would suspect a leak.

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thats exactly what I have done like 3 times just to check and double check.. i don't see anything, but at the same time, even though everyone says don't trust the meter, it seems to have been dead on. thing dropped like 150 overnight the night i turned it down from 30 to 12psi.... its a 5 gal keg...how long should these bottles typically last (small bottle.. probably 3/4Gal size)

Most people are using 5,10 or 20 lb co2 tanks. I use a 20 and it will last months without leaks. If you have a smaller tank I guess you could burn through it quite quickly especially with a leak.

You have checked your keg lid and posts and all tubing connections? I just repaired my regulator and am finally leak free. Mine has a small weep hole in the bonnet next to the adjustment screw where I found it leaking. This type of leak may also cause the set pressure to creep up as you mentioned earlier.

Well they say don't trust the high pressure meter because of physics. The vapor pressure will stay the same (assuming the tank is at the same temperature) until there is no more liquid CO2 and then it will quickly drop to almost zero.

you have a leak. spray everywhere, on the keg, on the tap, on the shank, everywhere there is a fitting, from the valve of the tank to the keg to the tap. the leak can be anywhere.

if it is loosing that much pressure I am willing to bet you can hear it. Unplug your compressor and listen. mine is a 15lbs and it has carb 4-6 kegs so far....

jonp9576 said:

you have a leak. spray everywhere, on the keg, on the tap, on the shank, everywhere there is a fitting, from the valve of the tank to the keg to the tap. the leak can be anywhere.

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i've sprayed the top seal, both gas and tap connectors, all fittings to them, fittings to the regulator, like 3-4 times because of my day to day suspicions.

even when it was turned to 30PSI when the pressure would have been greater... didnt hear anything either....

another question...can I turn off the co2 from day to day....isnt it technically like sitting in a "bottle" sealed up (assuming theres no leaks)... is there anything that tests the actual pressure?

if you turn it off, make sure to use the inline shutoff valve instead of the co2 tank knob. I've read Something about co2 being able to escape through the seating of the valve, I'm too lazy to look it up meow.

You wont be carbing when its off. If the beer is already carved you can turn on gas to dispense.

Woof, bark, growl.

ok, so I went and got a new tank today... started off just over 800... its been hooked up for about 3 hours now... regulator reads 600 now... had it on 5-6PSI... still couldnt even pour a beer... listened, couldnt hear any leaks where I heard em earlier... filled up a HUGE bucket of soap.... made every connector look like i was getting ready for freakin christmas.. NOTHING!????????? I should have pressure to pour a beer within a few hours AT MOST right??

Nothing constructive to add except that this is why I bottle haha

the high pressure gauge on the regulator is absolutely worthless, better to not have one as a distraction really as all if will indicate is the pressure relative to temperature. it has nothing to do with how much co2 you have. nothing.

in reading into your posts, it looks like you are using a paintball canister for co2? you said 3/4 gallon. yes, if you re carbing the beer with this, it will deplete fairly quickly i think. i also do not know if they are typically filled to a given weight or if they are filled simple to a certain pressure with pressurized CO2 gas. ive never used them.

but most of the comments you see here will be in relation to 5lb, 10lb, 15lb tanks... where they are filled with 5, 10, or 15 lbs of liquified CO2. this is substantially different from 3/4 gallon, which is a measure of volume, not weight.

you may not have a leak and may just be going through alot of co2 becuse you dont really have very much co2 to begin with.

for example, a 5lb tank should last several kegs, carbing and dispensing. i dont know if paintball canisters hold liquid co2 or if they are just a vessel to hold X amount of co2 gas up to a certain pressure.

rawlus said:

the high pressure gauge on the regulator is absolutely worthless, better to not have one as a distraction really as all if will indicate is the pressure relative to temperature. it has nothing to do with how much co2 you have. nothing.

in reading into your posts, it looks like you are using a paintball canister for co2? you said 3/4 gallon. yes, if you re carbing the beer with this, it will deplete fairly quickly i think. i also do not know if they are typically filled to a given weight or if they are filled simple to a certain pressure with pressurized CO2 gas. ive never used them.

but most of the comments you see here will be in relation to 5lb, 10lb, 15lb tanks... where they are filled with 5, 10, or 15 lbs of liquified CO2. this is substantially different from 3/4 gallon, which is a measure of volume, not weight.

you may not have a leak and may just be going through alot of co2 becuse you dont really have very much co2 to begin with.

for example, a 5lb tank should last several kegs, carbing and dispensing. i dont know if paintball canisters hold liquid co2 or if they are just a vessel to hold X amount of co2 gas up to a certain pressure.

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I just found out today it was a 5lb tank... its the tank that came with the Kegerator... this sucks!!! I mean I covered the crap outta every connection... its been another hour... still nothing comin through the tap! wtf!

You can have a leak that is so slow that the bubble/soap test does not show that easily. You might be better off with a slightly viscous liquid that will truly show a bubble, just spread some dish soap without water. Also you can immerse the QD's and fittings in a bowl of water while flowing gas to see if that is the source of the leak. Could also leak at the regulator, don't however stick that in a bowl of water.

Unlike everyone else, I've caught the HP gauge dropping that alerted me to an almost empty tank. But it is not really a great way to judge it.

btw - once you have gone through a leak fix you will most likely not have these issues in the future or you will be able to spot them quickly - that's why I don't bottle ... LOL

here is a pic of the regulator... if anyone knows which way the level should be for "ON" please let me know.. I have it in the middle now... seems to be working so im gonna go with that for now., haha

Relax man,
It's the temperature of the bottle!
Set your regulator for 11 or 12 PSI, put some duct tape over the high pressure gauge, and forget it's there. Seriously - Don't ever ever look at it again and worry unless it says you have less than 25 PSI. Then you're out. It's not a leak. Even if you were using a paintball tank, you're not going to empty the whole thing in 3 hours if you can't see bubbles...

5 or 6 PSI is a really slow pour on my rig. I serve at 12 or so. And if I had a plug laying around I'd remove the high pressure gauge and throw it away. Make your serving lines 8-10 feet of 3/16, forget about how much pressure is in the tank, and you'll be golden.

As for your valve, unhook the gas QD, pull the purge on your keg and let all the gas out. Turn the valve one way, hook up the QD, listen. If you hear gas, it's on. If you don't. turn it on

Then RDWHAHB

(in the pic, i'm not worried about the guage, im just don't know about the lever, where is open, and where its closed??... one would guess the right is open but apparently I was wrong)
i've already purged this tank like 4-5 times.. is it ok to keep doing that?... I wont worry about the tank reading anymore, BUT it was pretty accurate with the last one.. it slowly dropped, and sure enough it went out, just so you guys understand why i'm paranoid about the level, but OK.. im over it

snb778 said:

(in the pic, i'm not worried about the guage, im just don't know about the lever, where is open, and where its closed??... one would guess the right is open but apparently I was wrong)
i've already purged this tank like 4-5 times.. is it ok to keep doing that?... I wont worry about the tank reading anymore, BUT it was pretty accurate with the last one.. it slowly dropped, and sure enough it went out, just so you guys understand why i'm paranoid about the level, but OK.. im over it

Click to expand...

No worries,
I was talking about how to see which way is "ON" for your valve. I suppose it would be easiest just to take something hard and press the center spike in your disconnect. If the valve is off, it'll hiss for a couple seconds and stop. If it's on, it'll just keep on hissing...

For reference, I can force carb and serve 5 corny's full of beer on a 5# tank. I've lost a tank to a leak I couldn't find, but it certainly wasn't in 3 hours. I think you'll be OK if you get your lines balanced out and serve somewhere around 11 PSI.

" just don't know about the lever," the lever is down for on, left or right is off.

yea down seems to be working