Pretty sure I ruined my beer

So I have had a hell of a time with this last batch. I was never able to get it to ferment below 1.02 with an OG of 1.058. I had tried warming it up, stirring the yeast back into suspension, adding another starter and so on. Nothing worked.

I'm thinking that with all the hydrometer readings and monkeying around with the beer for over a moth, I must have introduced something to the beer which has caused some unintended flavors. Possibly the second starter.

The flavor I am detecting is almost like a soft apple with a hint of tartness like apple cider and a little bit of lemon. My wife actually likes if but it wigs me out and I kinda want to dump all 10 gallons of it and start over.

My recipe...
Kolsch Yeast WLP029
10 lbs Pilsner Malt
7 lbs American 6 row malt
2 lbs American Caramel malt (60 degree)
3 lbs Flaked Maize

1 oz Centennial Hops - 60 mins
1 oz Cluster hops - 15 mins
1 oz Cluster hops - 5 mins

Mash 151 - 75 Min
Boil 60 min


So any ideas what caused these flavors and what they are?

Thanks,

David

If your wife likes it bottle it. Just saying.

That's on the short side for boil time with Pilsner malt, adding in the corn, I don't know if that would be the source of the off flavor either. Is this one you have done before?

Pils malt nor corn should give you that cider off flavor. Is it still at 1.020?

Are you sure about your mash temp?
Are you using a hydrometer to measure FG, or refractometer?
I'd have boiled longer with the pilsner malt.
How long has it been fermenting now? Did you put it into secondary? How quickly?
That's a lot of crystal malt, 1.020 might be as low as you get.
Are you sure the apple/lemon flavor isn't an infection?

I switched from 029 to wyeast 2565 and those flavors went away. Bottle and wait it out, the beer will get very fizzy with that yeast also and that will take away some of that fruitiness.

http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter21-2.html
May be green. Give it some time. Could also be ester's which won't go away. Research your yeast and watch your temps. Good luck.

Jsamp said:

If your wife likes it bottle it. Just saying.

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Agreed at this point

d3track said:

That's on the short side for boil time with Pilsner malt, adding in the corn, I don't know if that would be the source of the off flavor either. Is this one you have done before?

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Thanks, I brewed sometime else with the same yeast and similar grain bill a month before and did a 90 minute boil and it turned out perfect.

Jsamp said:

Pils malt nor corn should give you that cider off flavor. Is it still at 1.020?

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Yes still at 1.020, I spend weeks trying to get it down with stiring, another starter, warming up, and so on. I did not add yeast nutrient though.

pdxal said:

Are you sure about your mash temp?
Are you using a hydrometer to measure FG, or refractometer?
I'd have boiled longer with the pilsner malt.
How long has it been fermenting now? Did you put it into secondary? How quickly?
That's a lot of crystal malt, 1.020 might be as low as you get.
Are you sure the apple/lemon flavor isn't an infection?

Click to expand...

Pretty sure, if anything it would have cooled below 151 or so into the 140s but I never added heat and it was right on when I added the strike water.

Hydrometer

It fermented for 10 days, I cold crashed it at 1.020 thinking is was done and then decided to remove and give it another shot by letting it warm to room temp for a week. No luck. Then I stirred it and left it for a few days, no luck. Then I added a starter at high krousen, no luck so I kegged it after a week or so.

"Are you sure the apple/lemon flavor isn't an infection?"
No I am not sure and not sure how to tell. Actually at first I assume it was.

hottpeper13 said:

I switched from 029 to wyeast 2565 and those flavors went away. Bottle and wait it out, the beer will get very fizzy with that yeast also and that will take away some of that fruitiness.

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The guy at the LHBS recommended against the WLP029 too. I decided to try the batch gain yesterday and he had me go with SAFALE US-05 which is an Ale yeast but said it was good for "lager like" beers too.

djonesax said:

Pretty sure, if anything it would have cooled below 151 or so into the 140s but I never added heat and it was right on when I added the strike water.

Hydrometer

It fermented for 10 days, I cold crashed it at 1.020 thinking is was done and then decided to remove and give it another shot by letting it warm to room temp for a week. No luck. Then I stirred it and left it for a few days, no luck. Then I added a starter at high krousen, no luck so I kegged it after a week or so.

"Are you sure the apple/lemon flavor isn't an infection?"
No I am not sure and not sure how to tell. Actually at first I assume it was.

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Your cold crash may have pooped your yeast out. With all your steps, I imagine you were done. The point is moot, since you've already kegged, but whenever I have a sluggish fermentation or want the gravity to drop a little lower, I'll boil a small amount (4-8oz) of corn or table sugar in ~ 1 pint of water with 1/4 tsp yeast nutrient, boil, cool and add to fermenter. I usually transfer to a sanitized measuring cup, and pour down the inside of the carboy to minimize splashing.

Acetaldehyde, a common green flavor, is described to have a green apple aroma but theres also a chance you could be getting a littlt tartness from a contamination of Lactobacillus. Either way, will likely be a fine beer to drink (A tart Kolsch-esque beer sounds pretty damn good, actually...)

BigPerm said:

Your cold crash may have pooped your yeast out.

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I think so too.

With all your steps, I imagine you were done. The point is moot, since you've already kegged, but whenever I have a sluggish fermentation or want the gravity to drop a little lower, I'll boil a small amount (4-8oz) of corn or table sugar in ~ 1 pint of water with 1/4 tsp yeast nutrient, boil, cool and add to fermenter.

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Thanks for the tip.

Acetaldehyde, a common green flavor, is described to have a green apple aroma but theres also a chance you could be getting a littlt tartness from a contamination of Lactobacillus. Either way, will likely be a fine beer to drink (A tart Kolsch-esque beer sounds pretty damn good, actually...)

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The beer seems to be getting a little less tart the longer it sits in the fridge so maybe some conditioning will do it some good. My wife actually asked for a pint last night instead of the yuengling I keep on tap for her, so that's positive.