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Old 06-06-2012, 03:57 PM   #21
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Jesus guys, they're talking about portable canning systems by WELCOME TO CASK.COM that puts beer in cans...



You know, BEER CANS?

There are threads about that one here, including someone thinking about offering a similar service for homebrewers.

NOT MASON JARS...

Mason jars are meant to hold a vaccum, not the outward pressure of carbonation pressing on the screw ring.

Drink out of them, but don't bottle in them.

They work by creating a vacuum when you can under pressure... When you put your food in the jar, seal the jar and stick it inside the boiling water bath, as it cools the vacuum draws the seal downward or inward that's why the dimple on a can is supposed to be pushed inward, and if you ever come a cross a can where it is bulging outward you are in trouble...

When you bottle, the gas builds up til it maxes out the head room (held in place by the crimped cap or the cork with wire or the gasket on a grolh bottle.....The co2 hits the barrier, maxes it and then goes back into solution/

With a mason jar you would either blow the seal and all the co2 would escape or if you were lucky enough that the seal held, more than likely the glass of the jar would explode and you would have a nice bottle grenade....

The tops for a mason jar typically is a thin metal lid with a rubberized "grommet" attached to is, really just a silicon band around the edge of the lid, and a retaining ring.




When you can, the cooling of the once heated container and it's goodies creates a vaccuum, it sucks inward. It pulls the flat tightly Downward.

In fact many of the lids actually has a small indentation in the center of it, that when the vacuum occurs it is pulled inward on the top and leaves a little dimple. That's a sign that there is a vacuum pulling the lid down and keeping the veggies or jam sealed up nicely and protected from infection.

And usually after you remove the retaining ring, if everything is OK with the jar, you usually can feel/hear the the vaccum break, with a little *POP*

However any of you who have ACTUALLY canned before, probably knows that one of the ways you can tell if your food in the can spoiled is if the little dimple is pushed outword. In jars without the dimple it is really hard, usually the lid might feel loose or there might actually be wetness around the lid when you unscrew the retaining

Because usually the rotting food give of a gas which expands to push up the dimple OR it breaks the seal where the little lid gasket meets the rim of the glass.

There is considerably MORE pressure in the carbonation process of beer, often enough pressure to cause a BOTTLE BOMB, in bottles specifically made to handle the OUTWARD pressure of carbonation.

Now if you managed to find one of these older style, thick walled jars with big gaskets and flip tops...We MIGHT be having a different discussion.



But your typical jars from the grocery store...NOT.

The gas is going to break the seal and leak out...Anyone who has ever canned food and have one go bad knows it doesn't take a lot of gas from the rotting food to break the seal.

A crown bottles cap is designed to contain the Outward and upward pressure of a beer bottle, we crimp it down, we don't create a vacuum that seats it on the bottle.

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Old 06-06-2012, 04:02 PM   #22
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Srsly??

I've gotten the idea to bottle in mason jars from this site once or twice. I'm wondering why it's not MORE common if there's no need for a capper and a "limitless" replacement caps.

Mason jars come in 8, 16, 32, 64 oz jars. Twelve jars for $10 or less???

Oh yea... they're not brown, tho. So leave 'em in box inside two bags, in a closet, in the basement. Then it's all good!!!
This is Revvy's reasoning behind not putting homebrew in mason jars. Long story short - they work as a vaccuum - the exact opposite of anything beer related.
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:03 PM   #23
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Crap! You beat me to it Revvy! I don't think I'll forget a post as epic as that one.

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Old 06-06-2012, 04:13 PM   #24
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That's great, Revvy! I was waiting for that one..... HTF did the topic co from canning beer in actual beer cans to bottling in mason jars? And really, how could you think mason jars would hold any outward pressure? Those lids, the flat part, that'd just bow and pop out of the ring, at best. Worst case.... well, Grndslm, post back the results of your 'plan'.... I wanna see how that turns out!

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can i drink this? I mean. Im gunna. But is it fine?
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:13 PM   #25
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Great minds think alike!!!Ninemile

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Old 06-06-2012, 04:15 PM   #26
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I've seen that post at least a half-dozen times after searching for "mason jars conditioning", but I feel obligated to test it out for myself.

I'm fairly certain that I could get the lids tight enough to hold onto a positive pressure, and to batch prime with half the sugar.... thus reducing the pressure on the thinner than preferable glass.

If there is a limit, then I will find it. If there is not a limit, then at least I will know.

Don't try this at home kids!!

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Old 06-06-2012, 04:19 PM   #27
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That's great, Revvy! I was waiting for that one..... HTF did the topic co from canning beer in actual beer cans to bottling in mason jars? And really, how could you think mason jars would hold any outward pressure? Those lids, the flat part, that'd just bow and pop out of the ring, at best. Worst case.... well, Grndslm, post back the results of your 'plan'.... I wanna see how that turns out!
(1) Topics lead to discussions. Discussions lead to tangents.

(2) I expect the threads to be tight enough, and perhaps have a "wet seal" on the flat lip??

(3) I'll be sure to let you know. But it will be several months, I'm sure.
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:19 PM   #28
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It's not whether or not you can get the lids on, it's whether or not the two piece lid can remain intact under the pressure. My guess is that it will bow, and eventually pop out of the ring. Probably in a rather explosive manner.

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can i drink this? I mean. Im gunna. But is it fine?
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:32 PM   #29
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It's not whether or not you can get the lids on, it's whether or not the two piece lid can remain intact under the pressure. My guess is that it will bow, and eventually pop out of the ring. Probably in a rather explosive manner.
I think grndslm's made his mind up. Personally, I definitely would like to see the experiment played out in its own thread for documentary reasons. Also, to truly test it - make it be a Hefeweizen carbed to style. I give it 10 days before kaboom. Any takers?
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:41 PM   #30
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See I don't predict Kaboom, I predict hissssssssssssssss. The co2 is going to pop the seal on the lids and the gas is just going to leak out. And probably not even all that dramatically, as soon as the slightest amount of overpressure happens (probably within 24 hour) the seal is going to break and the gas is just going to ooze out as it is being produced.

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