Sour mash for Berliner Weisse

richross · 11-24-2011, 09:23 PM

I am looking to attempt my first berliner weisse in about a week. I am going to do a Laco starter to throw in at least 36 hours before my yeast hoping to really give it a head start. At the same time I am wanting to do a partial or perferably full sour mash. I have a small grain bill: 3lbs. white wheat, 3lbs. Pilsner, 1 lbs Carapils. My original recipe calls for a 152F mash and sparge with no boil. My question is; can I do my original recipe, transfer to a bucket with 1/2lb of pale malted barley to sour for a day or two...and then I'm stuck. I am doing no boil so do I just transfer full sour mash to my carboy and add the Lacto? Or back to my kettle, raise the temp to kill and unwanted bugs and then transfer to carboy? Or am I off all together? Any help please

andreas23 · 11-25-2011, 10:01 AM

I am not quite sure what you are trying to achieve here. Originally, sour mash means transferring a part of the fermented mash back to a fresh batch of mash. So the whole process only makes sense when continuously producing sour mash, and not for a single batch.

Then, sour mash comes from whiskey production, which is a lot like beer production, except that the mash usually isn't lautered before fermentation and destillation. So to me it doesn't really make sense to talk in terms of a sour mash when talking about Berliner Weisse.

However, there are historical reports about something resembling the idea of sour mash being used in production of Berliner Weisse. Some brewmasters added 10% of the young beer back to the wort before pitching the yeast, giving what you could call a sour wort scheme. However, unless you are bewing a batch once a week, you can't use this scheme.

In effect, preparing a lacto starter of about 10% of your desired batch size gives you the same effect, namely reducing the pH of the wort and giving the lactos a decent head start.

**emjay** · 11-25-2011, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andreas23

I am not quite sure what you are trying to achieve here. Originally, sour mash means transferring a part of the fermented mash back to a fresh batch of mash. So the whole process only makes sense when continuously producing sour mash, and not for a single batch.

Then, sour mash comes from whiskey production, which is a lot like beer production, except that the mash usually isn't lautered before fermentation and destillation. So to me it doesn't really make sense to talk in terms of a sour mash when talking about Berliner Weisse.

However, there are historical reports about something resembling the idea of sour mash being used in production of Berliner Weisse. Some brewmasters added 10% of the young beer back to the wort before pitching the yeast, giving what you could call a sour wort scheme. However, unless you are bewing a batch once a week, you can't use this scheme.

In effect, preparing a lacto starter of about 10% of your desired batch size gives you the same effect, namely reducing the pH of the wort and giving the lactos a decent head start.

When talking about brewing, sour mash refers to holding a portion of the mash at a certain temperature (about 120° IIRC) for several days, allowing the lactobacillus bacteria on the grain to propagate and ferment unhindered. The actual brewday comes several days later, and aside from adding this "sour mashed" portion to the rest of the mash, it doesn't have to be different from any other typical brewday.

I believe the term is used differently by whiskey producers, but as you can see, the sour mash that brewers do can certainly be done on a singular, rather than continual, basis.

andreas23 · 11-25-2011, 11:54 AM

Oh, I see, thanks for the information! So what you are trying to achieve with this is essentially cultivation of the natural lactos living on the malt? That's not how they used to do it here, but good luck, interesting experiment!