From First Stage to Second Stage fermentation

I just brewed my first batch of beer, an irish stout. I have read several books and have looked over this forum, but cannot figure out if letting air in when siphoning from fermenter 1 to fermenter 2 is aloud or not. Do i merely take the air lock out, stick the siphoning tube in where that was, and siphon into the carboy, or do i just pop the top off and siphon into the carboy. I have a couple of days before it is ready to transfer, i just don't want to screw it up.

A couple of things:
1) you do have a racking cane, correct? You need one if you don't.
2)Pop the lid off and rack it over. Try not to splash it around too much. You do want to minimize oxygenation, but the small amount you'll introduce won't hurt.
To quote Byron Burch "Just remember, they were brewing beer thousand of years before they understoods bacteria. Take reasonable care, and you will be fine." Hope this helps - Dwain

yes i have a racking cane, and siphon. I bought the deluxe kit from the local home brew store which came with both. Thanks for the help, since i am new to this, i am unsure what will complete destroy my beer, and what wont hurt it too much.

Just about everything you can do won't hurt the beer very much.

Here's a very good thread: What are some of the mistakes you made...where your beer still turned out great?

RDWHAHB!!

That fact that you are aware that you need to minimize the amount of splashing/churning while racking means you probably aren't going to do anything serious enough to actually ruin it. I think you have to try pretty hard to make it undrinkable.

Here's the solution. Don't secondary the beer.

There's no need to. Just let it sit on the cake for another week or two. Its black anyways, so racking it into another vessel does nothing for clarity. You are only introducing more chances for infection and aeration. The only time I put a beer in a secondary for actual fermentation is when I racked a saison into my dedicated sour container to get infected with Brett B. Every other beer just stays in the primary for 30+ days.

I think racking to secondary just allow brewers the opportunity to tinker more with ****...just to achieve the same results. I would venture to say most beers benefit 0% from getting racked to another vessel (besides a bottling bucket). When you do rack it... just be a little more careful and mindful of the cake to reduce settled yeast from getting into your serving vessels.

Something that bothered me when racking is how air would get pulled in between the hose and the extension/tip of the racking cane. You will see and hear bubbles entering the hose when this happens. So, keep a few twist ties to maintain a tight seal between the hose and cane. I'm not sure it hurt anything, but by maintaining the seal, I haven't seen the minor jump start of the yeast after racking that would occur sometimes.

I usually only rack to secondary for clarity or for other "additions".

But,I did just hear an interview with the guy who started Wyeast and he said that when moving to a secondary it can "re-boot" the fermentation activity letting your yeast have one last chance to do all they can to your beer.

+1 on the don't worry too much about hurting the beer. I've yet to have any problems when using a secondary. The kit I bought came with a siphon, but not an autosiphon. If you do not have an autosiphon, get one, now. Really. Go now.

Have you ever had a problem when you did not rack the beer into a secondary? Then you don't have to worry about a leaky connection pulling in air, etc etc. If you just leave it and rack into your serving vessel, the yeast will have just as much opportunity to "re-boot". Beer ferments just as easily in a bottle/keg as it does a glass carboy or plastic bucket.

sirsloop said:

Have you ever had a problem when you did not rack the beer into a secondary? Then you don't have to worry about a leaky connection pulling in air, etc etc. If you just leave it and rack into your serving vessel, the yeast will have just as much opportunity to "re-boot". Beer ferments just as easily in a bottle/keg as it does a glass carboy or plastic bucket.

Click to expand...

The "re-boot" he was talking about came from the slight airation that will occur when racking. Giving the yeast a bit more O2, allowing them to ferment the rest of the sugars while driving out excess O2 when they produce CO2. Different than the fermentation done in the bottle/keg. At least that's what David Logsdon said in the interview.

Yeast perform much if the fermentation anaerobically. Zero oxygen is required to convert sugar into alcohol and CO2.

C6H12O6 -> 2(CH3CH2OH) + 2(CO2)
Sugar -> Alcohol + Carbon Dioxide


The amount of yeast increases like double every 4 hours in the presence of oxygen.... aerobic fermentation. This is why we add oxygen back into the cold wort...to increase the yeast count to obtain complete fermentation.

Not worth the risk of transferring it to a bright tank. Keep it in primary for 2 week and then keg or bottle.

sirsloop said:

Yeast perform much if the fermentation anaerobically. Zero oxygen is required to convert sugar into alcohol and CO2.

Click to expand...

Yes, O2 is not needed in that formula, you are correct.

Dave was talking about how O2 gives the yeast a little gas. Again, I don't use a secondary unless it's for clarity reasons. But, I thought it was an interesting point on using a secondary.

Here's the podcast with David from Wyeast:
http://www.basicbrewing.com/radio/mp3/bbr11-03-05.mp3

If anyone doesn't listen to Basic Brewing, I suggest giving it a shot, it's a pretty good podcast.

dlittle29 said:

I just brewed my first batch of beer, an irish stout. I have read several books and have looked over this forum, but cannot figure out if letting air in when siphoning from fermenter 1 to fermenter 2 is aloud or not.

Click to expand...

Just don't shout aloud when yo do and you'll be golden.

Do i merely take the air lock out, stick the siphoning tube in where that was, and siphon into the carboy, or do i just pop the top off and siphon into the carboy. I have a couple of days before it is ready to transfer, i just don't want to screw it up.

Click to expand...

I rather suspect you won't have much success getting a tube down that cork hole. Pull the cork and don't sweat it. Don't sweat into it either.

I clean the opening up with a little Star San before I pop the cork.

Get yourself an auto siphon, the full carboy size.
http://www.midwestsupplies.com/5-16-auto-siphon.html
you will thank me every time you use it.
I won't reply because I'm a surly SOB.