Hitachino Nest White Ale

I got a bottle of HN White Ale today for my birthday and was quite impressed. I have made 3 or 4 witbeers since I started brewing about a year ago but never got something like this. There was something a little different about this beer, something just a bit unusual. I couldn't put my finger on it because the aroma is to style and the look is also to style.

I went searching for a clone and didn't really find anything special. For such a well-regarded beer, I'm surprised a clone hasn't been made. I am only really practiced at reading a recipe, not making one, and am looking for some insight.

This is what I've gathered:

OG- 1.055, Final Gravity 1.06
IBU- 13
Malts- Pilsner, Flaked Wheat, Flaked Barley
Adjuncts- Coriander, Orange Peel, Nutmeg, Orange Juice.
Hops- Styrian Goldings and Perle.
Yeast- Unknown, going with Belgian Wit II

My recipe for starters is:

#5.5 Pilsner
#4 Flaked Wheat
#0.75 Flaked Barley
2 cups of OJ near end of boil??

0.5oz Styrian for 45 min
0.5oz Perle for 5 min with ground up coriander, nutmeg, orange peel
Dry hop with 1oz Styrian??

I did get in touch with the brewer and found out it's 1.5% OJ. So, a cup and a quarter per 5 gallon batch.

I would like to know about the hops, does anyone have any knowledge to share about the Styrian and Perle? What should I use to get 13 IBU? Using either to bitter could get to 13 IBU easily, but how would the taste be different using one over the other? Does this Wit need a dry hop?

Bit disappointed no one else gives a rip about this beer! I'm brewing today. Just missed out on the 410 yeast so I settled for 400 I had lying around.

6# 2 row
4# wheat, flaked
0.5# flaked barley
0.5 ounces of styrian goldings @ 30 min
0.5 ounces of perks @ 15 min
.5 ounces of ground coriander and bitter orange, each
8 grams of nutmeg @ 5 min.

1.25 cups of OJ post fermentation. Will update after fermentation.

nice beer. i've had it several times. there is a thread around here somewhere about someone who brewed a batch at the brewery itself. do a quick search and it should pop up. if i remember correctly they actually use a neutral yeast and get all the wit character from spices.

Yes, been in there, but outside of the guy who brewed at the brewery, no recipes. I chose 400 because at 71 degrees, it will produce some light fruit/citrus and some tartness, which is what I'm going for and is noticeable in this beer.

I have since brewed and bottled 2 batches of this clone.

Version 1 had 0.75oz of coriander and a liquidy orange juice (simply orange)
Version 2 had 0.5oz of coriander

Everything was spot on for the first 5 drafts. Then the OJ started to fade a bit. There was some tartness left over from the WLP400, but not like White Ale. So I am researching the type of orange juice they use in Japan at the brewery to try and dial this in to an exact clone. Otherwise, everything else was right on the money. I'd go with the 0.5oz of coriander and let the nutmeg breathe.



The head on this is two finger but quickly goes down to as what is shown on the picture of the clone. Will try and get another bottle of White Ale and show the 2nd version with tasting notes.

Did you find out the type of orange juice they use? Maybe we can try an over ripped fresh squeezed orange juice???

My wife loves this beer and I'm after a good clone for my next batch. Any updates?

Yes, here is the updated recipe:

6 lbs Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 57.1 %

4 lbs Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 2 38.1 %

8.0 oz Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 3 4.8 %

0.50 oz Perle [7.00 %] - Boil 45.0 min Hop 5 12.2 IBUs

0.50 oz Styrian Goldings [5.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 4 1.9 IBUs

0.50 oz Orange Peel, Bitter (Boil 5.0 mins) Spice 7 -

0.75 oz Ground Coriander (Boil 5.0 mins) Spice 7 -

0.5 oz Nutmeg (Boil 5.0 mins) Spice 6 -

1.0 pkg Forbidden Fruit (Wyeast 3463) [35.49 ml] Yeast 8

1.5 cups of tangy Orange Juice post fermentation!

30 minute rest at 122, 30 minutes at 154, 10 minutes at 168.

If you can get WLP410, go with that, otherwise Forbidden Fruit.

I like this beer a lot. I was going to brew Jamil's wit in the Spring but I'll probably do this one instead. Thanks for sharing!

This you, vegan brewer? You still think 74 degrees for the fermentation?

http://www.homebrewbargains.com/item/hitachino-nest-white-ale-clone-recipe-all-grain-2.html

kman42 said:

This you, vegan brewer? You still think 74 degrees for the fermentation?

http://www.homebrewbargains.com/item/hitachino-nest-white-ale-clone-recipe-all-grain-2.html

Click to expand...

If you use the forbidden fruit, I'd shoot for 75-80 degrees. I haven't tried it yet since it's so cold here, will do in the summer. I am going to try one with 410 when it's released and FF

Can anyone help me a bit with the mash profile for this in Beersmith? The Temperature Mash, 2 Step, Full Body is close, but I'm not sure how to set it up to adjust temps with hot water additions instead of a RIMS (I don't have a RIMS setup yet).

Thanks,
kman

kman42 said:

Can anyone help me a bit with the mash profile for this in Beersmith? The Temperature Mash, 2 Step, Full Body is close, but I'm not sure how to set it up to adjust temps with hot water additions instead of a RIMS (I don't have a RIMS setup yet).

Thanks,
kman

Click to expand...

I did it as Double Infusion, Light body.

Ok. That makes a lot of sense and was the profile I was looking for. Unfortunately, I'm getting an error for the mashout, saying that the infusion temperature is above boiling. This is my first attempt at using a protein rest and Beersmith so I'm having a bit of trouble getting everything aligned.

Thanks! I'm really looking forward to brewing this (President's Day).

kman

Not sure if this will help cause I'm not sure what your setup is or how many gallons you're doing. But this is what my screen looks like.

Thanks, that is helpful. I'll play with it and see what I can come up with. I'm using a 10 gallon round igloo cooler to mash. Maybe it just isn't big enough to add the mash out volume at a below-boiling temp.

kman

kman42 said:

Thanks, that is helpful. I'll play with it and see what I can come up with. I'm using a 10 gallon round igloo cooler to mash. Maybe it just isn't big enough to add the mash out volume at a below-boiling temp.

kman

Click to expand...

That's what I've got too. I had the boiling temp thing come up one of my recipes before, I don't know if it was this one, but I remember it happening. You should be able to mess around with it and make it work.

Ok. I think I figured that out and I am up to my last question. What type of OJ, when do you add it and how do you include it in your Beersmith recipe?

BTW--do you have this recipe on the Beersmith cloud?

Thanks for all your help!
kman

I thing I had to add OJ to the programs list, not sure it might be there in miscellaneous ingredients. Just dont add until after fermentation is done.

I used to live in japan and also Korea and usually orange juice is very sweet there, like tangerine juice. But were not sure what they use, so anything with no pulp should work.

Brewed this up yesterday and it went really well! I cooled it a bit too much and the fermentation started at 67, but it is up to 71 in my fermentation chamber this morning, so hopefully it will get up to 75 by the 24 hour mark.

When you say to add the OJ after fermentation, do you mean after the primary fermentation or should I wait until kegging? Does it need to be boiled?

Kman

With the OJ, it's pasteurized, so I just opened a fresh bottle on the day I added it (to the keg) and measured in a sanitized glass measuring cup.

Wont the OJ start fermenting even after fermentation has finished? Gonna brew this beer soon but dont want the vomit flavored orange taste.

globe said:

Wont the OJ start fermenting even after fermentation has finished? Gonna brew this beer soon but dont want the vomit flavored orange taste.

Click to expand...

No it won't, just make sure its done fermenting before adding the OJ. Its not that much and the yeast doesn't really do anything with it.

theveganbrewer said:

Yes, here is the updated recipe:

6 lbs Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 57.1 %

4 lbs Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 2 38.1 %

8.0 oz Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 3 4.8 %

0.50 oz Perle [7.00 %] - Boil 45.0 min Hop 5 12.2 IBUs

0.50 oz Styrian Goldings [5.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 4 1.9 IBUs

0.50 oz Orange Peel, Bitter (Boil 5.0 mins) Spice 7 -

0.75 oz Ground Coriander (Boil 5.0 mins) Spice 7 -

0.5 oz Nutmeg (Boil 5.0 mins) Spice 6 -

1.0 pkg Forbidden Fruit (Wyeast 3463) [35.49 ml] Yeast 8

1.5 cups of tangy Orange Juice post fermentation!

30 minute rest at 122, 30 minutes at 154, 10 minutes at 168.

If you can get WLP410, go with that, otherwise Forbidden Fruit.

Click to expand...

I know this is an old old thread. But does anyone have any updated recipes??