Another Argument for Better Bottles

... what's crazy is that it was actually an empty 6-gallon carboy falling on top of this 6.5-gallon carboy (FULL of oxiclean and hot water) that shattered it - and the 6-gal carboy DIDN'T break!!!

Needless to say, our floor is probably the cleanest it's ever been after the tidal wave of "cleaning, oxyenating scrubbing" it received.

That's Clazyness right there! Glad no one was cut.

JOHN51277 said:

Glad no one was cut.

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+1

I have one 5 gallon glass carboy left. I only use it as a secondary and it very rarely leaves the milk crate.

I dropped a Better Bottle while putting it into the fermentation cabinet (DUMAS...I know) Nothing broken, or lost, except my dignity and about a half gallon of Robust Porter. Sure glad I wasn't using my glass carboy that time (it has been collecting dust ever since.)

Glad nobody was cut with your drop.

I have been hesitant to make the switch to better bottles. I lucked out early on and found 4x 6.5 gal and 2x 5 gal glass carboys on craigslist for about $15-20 a piece. But, I was listening to Jamil the other day talking about his switch to better bottles...

With all ny other brewing expenses right now, it might be a while before I switch. I may just gradually fade them out.

I was just glad my b-i-l was over to help and that the SWMBO wasn't.

As someone who broke a carboy, I'm glad to hear that no one was injured. Just one piece of advice though, don't use hot water in carboys. They aren't designed for that kind of stress.

homebeerbrewer said:

As someone who broke a carboy, I'm glad to hear that no one was injured. Just one piece of advice though, don't use hot water in carboys. They aren't designed for that kind of stress.

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hot water is pretty vague. also don't drop them they aren't made for that kind of stress :cross:

How is someones accident an argument for better bottles. It's like telling people to walk because you got in a car accident.

wildwest450 said:

How is someones accident an argument for better bottles. It's like telling people to walk because you got in a car accident.

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not true. better bottle is a reasonable alternative. I am NOT walking to Florida

moosetav said:

not true. better bottle is a reasonable alternative. I am NOT walking to Florida

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Then take a bike, but don't forget the helmet, safety first.

He didn't say it was an argument for other people to use Better Bottles.

If I was a terrible driver and kept getting into accidents, I think walking would be better.

If I was a clumsy oaf, and dropped glass carboys all of the time, I think Better Bottles would be better.

wildwest450 said:

How is someones accident an argument for better bottles. It's like telling people to walk because you got in a car accident.

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It was kind of a joke. I guess my intent would be more like telling people to be careful when driving. And if you are interested in completely avoiding any possible ill effects of driving (or one in particular in this case), then you should walk.

I didn't realize there was a title-appropriateness officer on duty

evanmars said:

If I was a clumsy oaf, and dropped glass carboys all of the time, I think Better Bottles would be better.

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Ouch... With 8 carboys in constant rotation for almost two years, I thought it was pretty good this was the first one, especially with as many trips up and down the stairs that they have made (don't ask).

I was just listening to the session the other day and Gordon Strong was talking about breaking carboys and I thought to myself, "how does that even happen"? Well, becoming careless and trying to transfer, clean, and sanitize three at once on Saturday gave me that answer.

I'd probably get rid of the 6 gallon one that didn't break. There's gotta be some sorta stress cracks somewhere...

After using BB's exclusively for a long time, I now ferment in corny kegs. Any argument for a BB can be answered nearly 10-fold for using a keg. One man's opinion y'all!

this is just my opinion but many of those who are fans of the glass carboys are prolly not guna convert just because of this thread b/c this was va contemplated situation that they probably thought of before choosing glass. definitely an unfortunate incident though thank god noone was hurt

chenwood said:

hot water is pretty vague. also don't drop them they aren't made for that kind of stress :cross:

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LOL, I think everybody knows that dropping a glass object will probably break it, but not everyone knows not to use hot water on a big glass container. Small bottles don't go through the same stress as carboys when filling with hot water. The smaller mass of say, a beer bottle, will heat much quicker than a 5 or 6+ gallon carboy because it takes a while to fill, resulting uneven heating. Those stresses are enough to break the glass, especially if there are other stresses like moving the carboy.

But yeah, "hot water" is vague. If it feels hot on your skin, it's probably too hot for the carboy.

I can barely lift my primary bucket when full. I sold my glass carboy immediately after I bought it.

AZ_IPA said:

I'd probably get rid of the 6 gallon one that didn't break. There's gotta be some sorta stress cracks somewhere...

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This is definitely a fear of mine. I inspected the carboy carefully, but still haven't decided exactly what to do with it yet.

There's been alot of talk about hot water in this post. How do you guys clean carboys? I used to use a brush and beat the hell out of the neck... now I use PBW or Oxiclean with hot water to clean them. Also, it wasn't the hot water that broke the carboy in this incident - it was the other glass carboy smashing into it that did it.

These are less than the cost of two Better Bottles:

http://www.watertanks.com/category/82/

They need fittings, and some handiness in making a stand, but here is at least one thread about that:

http://frugalconicalfermenter.blogspot.com/

They might push your batch size, though!

Edit: These tanks are full drain, and probably a better choice:

http://www.tank-depot.com/productdetails.aspx?part=A-INFD15-19

The only glass I use is the one I serve the beer in. Knowing how clumsy I can be I've always been skeptical of using glass. Especially if I'm drinking on brew day!

Grizzly, you can use luke warm water to clean them. Feel the water with your hand, if it feels hot, it's too hot. Small temperature changes don't cause a lot of stress on the glass, but big ones do. Think of it this way, you have a room temp carboy, and then you start filling it with hot water. The bottom starts to heat up, but the sides are still at room temperature. The glass where the temp begins to rise will expand, causing stress in the area that boarders the hot and cold glass. As you fill, the weight of the water is pushing on those stressed areas. Then, if you try moving it, you add more stress by shifting the weight around. Any of those actions are enough to break a carboy. You're lucky that the carboy filled with hot water didn't break when it was hit by the dropped one, but maybe the entire carboy was at the same temp, relieving the temperature stresses. Be vary careful using it in the future, there could be cracks that you can't see where it might fail.

As far as cleaning, you can still use PBW or Oxy-Clean, but as I said, use luke warm water. I fill mine, let it soak overnight, and then use a carboy brush. It comes clean without a lot of scrubbing.

Also, read through my thread about my broken carboy. There is an idea in there that I'm using on my carboys that could possibly save someone some severe injuries. I haven't broken another one yet, but I'm hoping that when I do, that stuff saves me another trip to the ER. (Disclaimer: I have tested the product on a carboy, and it held pretty well. But your mileage may vary, so use at your own risk.)

homebeerbrewer said:

You're lucky that the carboy filled with hot water didn't break when it was hit by the dropped one,

Also, read through my thread about my broken carboy. There is an idea in there that I'm using on my carboys that could possibly save someone some severe injuries.

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It WAS the carboy filled with hot water that broke! The empty 6-gallon fell of the counter on top of the 6.5 gal (filled with hot oxiclean sitting on the floor). The 6-gal fell neck-first onto the other carboy - I guess kind of spearing it. I imagine because the neck is the thickest part, it saved the rest of the carboy. That, and the fact I violated the first rule of kitchen utensil safety - I attempted to grab the carboy as it fell.

I read through a good part of your post. I've been meaning to get some carriers (plastic crates, straps, etc.) but have been putting it off. Although none of those would have helped in this scenario. I had the top carboy propped up at an angle to get most of the liquid I was siphoning and I guess when the liquid was gone, so was the weight holding it in place - It just toppled over. I usually place a non-slip pad under the carboy but this time around I forgot. Again, in this case, I don't think it would have helped. Like I said, I just got careless trying to do too many things at once.

I bought one of these today at my local brew shop:

http://www.rebelbrewer.com/shoppingcart/products/Brew-Hauler-%252d-Carboy-Carrier.html

They work like a champ! Until I get my 15gal SS conical, the Brew Hauler will be on all of my six gallon carboys. So the title of this thread could read Another argument for conicals!

Edit: However, I do not believe they provide any protection from six gallon carboys falling from above! LOL

Grizzly, the idea that I was talking about is in this post.

I also use the Brew-Hauler, on each of the four remaining carboys.

Personally, before I went to the extreme to PlastiDip my glass carboys, there is no doubt that I would switch to plastic conicals instead...or at least try one as an alternaltive to glass. My druthers is SS conicals though. Mind you, I have never tried SS conicals; I just think they are a good idea.

However, I do like the gumption of that energetic brewer to PlastiDip a carboy and attempt to break it in the name of science! "Keep moving forward"!

I did the Plasti Dip to keep using the equipment I have instead of going out and buying something else. Plus, I couldn't brew for several months after the "incident", so I had to do something, and painting a carboy and breaking it filled the time.

I now ferment in Sanke kegs though, so the carboys are mostly sitting lonely in the corner. Only when I'm doing something that I want to secondary, or age for a while, will I get one out.

homebeerbrewer said:

I did the Plasti Dip to keep using the equipment I have instead of going out and buying something else.

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There's much to be said for that approach!

i atually just switched to winpaks because of a broken carboy full of maibock and love them. to me better than better bottle and glass