Yeast issues?

[DVCNick]

Just bottled my third batch this past weekend. Also brewed my fourth. It was rainy, and not much else to do.

Anyhow, I've got some observations I'd like to get some opinions on. I haven't consistently been using the hydrometer, and that might be a problem that needs to get fixed.

-Batch #2: "Lunar Shock" extract kit. I had liquid yeast shipped cross country in the warm weather (I think this is a bad idea, right). Despite what looked like a good packing job, the yeast bag seemed somewhat inflated when I opened the box. Never having seen one before, I had no point of reference. I just stashed it in the fridge till brew day. Upon opening it at pitch time, I discovered that there were two internal smack bubbles; one was broken, one was not. I popped the second bubble, and pitched it all. No starter, no delay after opening the second smack bubble.

Fermentation seemed normal to my eye. I got a decently bubbling airlock, probably 3/4" of krausen, it dropped back in, three weeks later I bottled it. It bottled fine and carbed fine.

However the taste... just tasted like not much of anything. It didn't taste bad; it was just probably the most generally flavorless beer I can remember ever drinking. Could this have been a function of some issue with the yeast? Also, just from the taste and drinking it, I don't think it had much alcohol content. No hydrometer readings on this one before or after though.

------------------------

Batch #3: This is the one I bottled yesterday. Dead Ringer extract kit. It had been in the fermenter for four weeks. I pitched one dry yeast pack of US-05. Again, to my eye the fermentation looked normal; good bubbling, probably an inch of krausen in the early stages. Good size cake on the bottom. On this one, I did take a FG reading by putting the hydrometer straight into the bottling bucket after racking. The reading I came up with was 1.035. That seems like it is too high. ~3.2% using the target starting gravity on the recipe sheet.

The only thing I can think of: My priming sugar was mixed in before the reading. Would this impact the reading to such a degree, or is it likely I didn't get a good fermentation?

Thanks for any insights.

 

[carluchi]

Not sure what happened with brew #2. Depending on what yeast is used, the majority of the flavor will come from the grain / malt / hops. The exception to this is if you are making a heffe where most of the flavor profile is from the yeast. Since you said you had a good krausen, seems the yeast was fine and you had a good fermentation. Chalk it up to being batch #2 but you should really taking readings before you add the yeast and after the krausen drops to get an idea of your alcohol content.

Foo batch #3, taking a reading with your bottling sugar mixed in will absolutely give you a high reading, so I would not use your reading as a gauge of what the alcohol percentage is.

The only way to do that is to get a reading before yeast is added (ie right after you fill the fermentor up) and then again after the fermentation is complete (ie. 3 separate readings spread out over a few days that are the same). This is only way to figure out what you alcohol percentage is.

Let it carb up and see how it comes out, I'm sure it will be fine.

[ETA - grammer]

 

[DVCNick]

The "Lunar Shock" is described as a Blue Moon/Shock Top kind of clone.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Sometimes smack packs activate on their own and start to swell, just keep it in the fridge till brew day and plan to use it soon. Even if you didn't activate the pack, the yeast will still do their job in your beer they just won't likely be as vigorous so soon, needing more time to wake up eat breakfast and start multiplying.

Next time smack it till the inner bubble bursts then shake well, when swelled up and you're ready to pitch, dunk the whole bag in sanitizer and just snip off a corner with a pair of sanitized scissors and squeeze the yeast out into your cooled wort. This will minimize the chance of infection.

 

[bucketnative]

Regarding Batch #3, 1.035 is way too high to be bottled, assuming that the gravity was measured correctly. It is best to measure the FG prior to adding priming sugar. As a general rule of thumb, each gravity point (0.001) will yield 0.5 vol CO2 in the carbonated beer. So, when you prime, you are generally adding about 4 gravity points (0.004) to get a carbonation level under 3.0 vol CO2. That's based on the assumption that your beer holds about 0.9 vol CO2 after fermentation is done.

I got a little way's down a path there, but assuming you had a gravity of 1.035, I doubt that primary fermentation was done. Even if you subtract a proper dose of priming sugar, you would have been around 1.030. Typically a wheat beer will finish much closer to 1.010 (with extract, maybe higher). Based on the numbers you gave, you have the potential for a dangerous situation (bottle bombs sending shards of glass at high velocity).

There's always the potential that your beer and priming solution were not mixed well-enough when you made the measurement... that could have resulted in a very high gravity measurement. If the beer/sugar remained unmixed, then you only have the potential for a very dangerous situation in half your bottles... either way, beware.

 

[DVCNick]

Regarding Batch #3, 1.035 is way too high to be bottled, assuming that the gravity was measured correctly. It is best to measure the FG prior to adding priming sugar. As a general rule of thumb, each gravity point (0.001) will yield 0.5 vol CO2 in the carbonated beer. So, when you prime, you are generally adding about 4 gravity points (0.004) to get a carbonation level under 3.0 vol CO2. That's based on the assumption that your beer holds about 0.9 vol CO2 after fermentation is done.

I got a little way's down a path there, but assuming you had a gravity of 1.035, I doubt that primary fermentation was done. Even if you subtract a proper dose of priming sugar, you would have been around 1.030. Typically a wheat beer will finish much closer to 1.010 (with extract, maybe higher). Based on the numbers you gave, you have the potential for a dangerous situation (bottle bombs sending shards of glass at high velocity).

There's always the potential that your beer and priming solution were not mixed well-enough when you made the measurement... that could have resulted in a very high gravity measurement. If the beer/sugar remained unmixed, then you only have the potential for a very dangerous situation in half your bottles... either way, beware.

Wow thanks for the info. Batch #3 was actually a hoppy IPA style, "Dead Ringer" kit if that matters.
It was in the fermenter longer than my first IPA.
I've definitely heard the expression "bottle bombs", but I figured the cap would either vent slowly or pop off before the bottle would actually shatter... the later is actually a possibility? Ouch...

Priming sugar should have been pretty well mixed; I put the entire solution in the bottom of the bottling bucket and racked on top of it. The put the hydrometer in on top of that.

Should I open one at, say, a week, and if it looks fully carbed up I'm probably headed for trouble?

 

[PRM]

One thing to consider going forward is the temperature of your fermentation area. If the temperature is too high you might be killing off the yeast. Alternatively, if the temperature is too cool the yeast may start to go into dormancy. Both of these situations could explain the higher final gravity in batch #3.

As for the caps venting or not, you might get some venting or you might have some burst and I don't believe there is any way to know before hand. I would plan on the beer being over carbed and I would let the bottles carb for maybe a week and then test a bottle (repeat until carbed the way you want). Once you get to an acceptable level of carbonation, put the beer in the refrigerator to stop the yeast and possibly lower the pressure.

If you do end up with over carbed beer, I'd suggest the following:
1. Put the bottles in a refrigerator/freezer and get them to near freezing. This will help drive some of the CO2 into solution with the liquid.
2. Wearing eye protection, other safety gear and possibly wrapping the bottle in an old towel in case it bursts in your hand, uncap the bottles and let some of the pressure escape. I'd plan on loosing some beer from each bottle, but I guess it's better than having huge mess to clean up.
3. Once some of the pressure/beer escapes the bottles (10 minutes or so), recap and then continue to refrigerate.

 

[DVCNick]

I live in SC, and we do have hot summers and I don't AC the house much during the day if I'm gone. For temp control I am using a swamp cooler setup, with the bottom of the carboy in a few inches of water and a t-shirt over the carboy to wick water up. Whenever I check the temp of the water in the sump or the wicking area of the t-shirt, it shows 60's to low 70's at most even when the air temp in the house is higher. Also this is in the coolest room of the house that is usually a couple degrees cooler than the living room where the thermostat is.

My first batch of IPA seemed to ferment out just fine in these same conditions (no issues with bottle pressure; seemed perfect). Is this ok or do I need more drastic steps for temp control?

 

[bucketnative]

The real question should be, why are you bottling at 1.035 (1.030)? You should bottle when fermentation is done. Done is not measured by time, but rather by gravity. When gravity has been stable over 3 days (or longer), and it is within a reasonable range of the estimated FG, it may be considered time to bottle. You have to apply some judgement, because a stalled fermentation is definitely possible. So, if you're gravity were stuck for a three days at 1.030, I would consider fermentation to have stalled based on a predicted FG of 1.010 - 1.014, and I would not bottle. Rather, I would investigate the stalled fermentation and try to correct it, either with new yeast, time, or increased temperature. Some yeasts, particularly WY 3724 are known to stall around 1.030, so it is real scenario to consider at times.

 

[PRM]

The cooling technique seems fine. US-05 is happy between 59-75F so that probably isn't the reason for the lower attenuation. What was the OG for batch #3?

 

[bucketnative]

Another thing to consider is if you are measuring the standard gravity in the correct manner. Have you checked the accuracy of your hydrometer? It should read 1.000 in distilled water (tap water is perfectly fine, too, given the resolution of most home hydrometers).

 

[kh54s10]

Lunar shock. A clone of blue moon. Not much taste to begin with... Also an underpitch since you didn't make a starter with the yeast.

#3 At 4 weeks it is more than likely done. Since you took your hydrometer reading in the bottling bucket with priming sugar added but probably not mixed well, you can probably ignore that reading. Just in case the reading was close, condition those bottles in a plastic storage box. After a couple of weeks shake the box before opening it to see if any bottles explode. Be careful.

 

[DVCNick]

Another thing to consider is if you are measuring the standard gravity in the correct manner. Have you checked the accuracy of your hydrometer? It should read 1.000 in distilled water (tap water is perfectly fine, too, given the resolution of most home hydrometers).

Near as I can tell including temp correction, I'm getting a reading of 1.001 in my tap water.

 

[DVCNick]

The cooling technique seems fine. US-05 is happy between 59-75F so that probably isn't the reason for the lower attenuation. What was the OG for batch #3?

Unfortunately no OG number to go on...

 

[DVCNick]

I popped one from batch #3 open over the weekend, and observed some carbonation, but I would still say decidedly under-carbed. (It had been in the bottle about a week at that point) Taste was good; maybe a little sweet.

Hopefully my hydrometer reading was just high based on some quirk with the priming sugar, and I'm on track for a normal carb in the normal timeframe.... will pop another one next weekend? Or sooner?