Yeast for this English Barleywine recipe

[urg8rb8]

What kind of yeast should I use to ferment this one:

1.5# Pale Malt Grains
1# Crystal 120L
12oz Munich Malt
.5# Special Roast Malt
.5# Victory Malt
12# Amber LME
2# Corn Sugar
2# Turbinado Sugar

1oz Columbus @ 60min
.75oz Sterling @ 30min

Expected OG: 1.143
Expected FG: 1.019

I'm thinking of using WLP099.

Thanks for your help!

 

[LeftyRighty]

I'm doing a barleywine soon, not as heavy on the malts, mostly LME starting as a SMaSH, OG = 1.123, using Munton's Premium Gold ale yeast in the primary for a month.. Then, will cold-crash, transfer to secondary, and ferment again with Lavin's EC 1118 or WLP099 for a month, then 2nd secondary for 6 months or more. Hoping for more of the ale flavors, and not too dry from the wine yeast.

 

[urg8rb8]

I'm doing a barleywine soon, not as heavy on the malts, mostly LME starting as a SMaSH, OG = 1.123, using Munton's Premium Gold ale yeast in the primary for a month.. Then, will cold-crash, transfer to secondary, and ferment again with Lavin's EC 1118 or WLP099 for a month, then 2nd secondary for 6 months or more. Hoping for more of the ale flavors, and not too dry from the wine yeast.

What are you expecting your FG to be? I'm thinking of going with the WLP099 first to see how it goes.

 

[mikeprooo]

2 packs of rehydrated Nottingham and watch the fireworks!!

 

[LeftyRighty]

brewersfriend recipe says FG = 1.027, but I don't think that the ale yeast will take me to it, assuming ABV too high at 12.6%. brewersfriend recipe says FG = 1.018, ABV = 13.7 if I used only WLP099.

I just don't feel comfortable using the WLP099 or EC1118 for the full route. I've done a couple SMaSH ales with this LME's, first as a OG = 1.046, and a stronger OG = 1.086, both nice beers. My plan is to push it to a barleywine, hoping for success. Keeping the same SMaSH will tell what the wine yeast does.

 

[Qhrumphf]

A) I haven't tried but I've heard WLP099 doesn't taste too great as a primary strain.

B) I have used it as a secondary strain, and despite a relatively high mash for the gravity (152 I think it was, but it also had some sugar in there) it took a beer from 1.115 or so down to 1.004 (primary strain crapped out in the high 1.030s which was too high for my liking). I was livid and will never use that strain ever again.

Now, for the gravity you're going to you may not have much of an option. However, going with a different yeast (WLP007 might be a good bet) I would not add ANY sugar until primary fermentation is wearing down, and then add the sugar to try and coax more, which the yeast may be more willing to handle past their normal range. Or, if you're just going with sugar at that point, then champagne yeast would be able to take it down without over attenuating, since champagne yeasts (at least most of em as far as I'm aware) don't really ferment maltose or maltotriose and should just hit the sugar.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

+1

2 packs of rehydrated Nottingham and watch the fireworks!!

 

[LeftyRighty]

A)

Now, for the gravity you're going to you may not have much of an option. However, going with a different yeast (WLP007 might be a good bet) I would not add ANY sugar until primary fermentation is wearing down, and then add the sugar to try and coax more, which the yeast may be more willing to handle past their normal range. Or, if you're just going with sugar at that point, then champagne yeast would be able to take it down without over attenuating, since champagne yeasts (at least most of em as far as I'm aware) don't really ferment maltose or maltotriose and should just hit the sugar.

what wine yeast would be recommended to ferment maltose or maltotriose, as I'll be adding some sugars, but know the malts will not be fully digested.

 

[urg8rb8]

I just put this recipe into beersmith and played around with different types of yeast. The program calculates that the WLP099 will take this recipe down to 1.010. Yikes! Nottingham would take it down to 1.017, close to where I want it to finish.

Do you think Notty will give me ~16% ABV? What flavors will Nottingham add to the beer? I was reading that it will add tartness... is that going to mess up the flavor of the barleywine?

 

[Qhrumphf]

Lots of variables in play here that BeerSmith can't always account for. Once you start going beyond 12% ABV the game changes. My recommendation is malt sugar only up to the level your yeast can handle, pitch a huge starter and aerate the crap out of it, and then once it finishes coax as much more out of it with staged simple sugar additions and then if necessary go with wine yeast the rest of the way. Maybe others with more experience brewing extreme gravity beers could provide a better way, but no way I know of to reach those kinds of levels with a normal beer yeast (as far as I'm concerned WLP099 might as well be distillers yeast).

 

[urg8rb8]

Lots of variables in play here that BeerSmith can't always account for. Once you start going beyond 12% ABV the game changes. My recommendation is malt sugar only up to the level your yeast can handle, pitch a huge starter and aerate the crap out of it, and then once it finishes coax as much more out of it with staged simple sugar additions and then if necessary go with wine yeast the rest of the way. Maybe others with more experience brewing extreme gravity beers could provide a better way, but no way I know of to reach those kinds of levels with a normal beer yeast (as far as I'm concerned WLP099 might as well be distillers yeast).

You're recommending I leave out the 4 lbs of simple sugars from the boil and just add them periodically during prim ferm? I take it that I should boil the sugars in a small amount of water and pitch it in primary when it cools?

 

[Qhrumphf]

You're recommending I leave out the 4 lbs of simple sugars from the boil and just add them periodically during prim ferm? I take it that I should boil the sugars in a small amount of water and pitch it in primary when it cools?

That's exactly what I'm suggesting. I'd go maybe a pound at a time, a couple days in between, mix with just enough water to dissolve the sugar, boil it to reduce it down, cool, and add.

Too much sugar at once, particularly in a beer like this, and particularly if it's adding during the boil, and the yeast get lazy, go for the simple sugar first, end up altering their metabolic pathways and then end up unable or at least much less able to go after the maltose and maltotriose. Result is an underattenuated cloying mess.

This way you're going to get the best attenuation and not end up with cloying beer.

I brew all my Belgians (and all my bigger beers in general) that way.

 

[Billy-Klubb]

I used WLP099 a lot when I first started doing high OG beers (like 13 years ago). I would recommend against using it as the primary strain. I have found it works much better as a secondary (a proper secondary fermentation). I would personally recommend WLP007 or Wyeast 1318 for primary and the WLP099 for a proper secondary if needed.