Wine kits, degassing, aging time, etc.

[Unferth]

It makes perfect sense to me why one would not degas a wine that one was planning on bulk aging for many months... the gas escapes naturally on its own.

it also makes perfect sense why one would want to degas a kit wine that is being rushed to the bottle. (the gas doesn't have time to escape on its own).

what does not make sense is why these kit wines are able to be rushed to the bottle and drank sooner, and why country wines are typically not rushed... I'm assuming it is NOT the degassing process that enables the wine to be drank sooner.

The Pinot Noir kit wine I have clearing now will be good to drink like 10 weeks after I pitched the yeast! I'm not expecting to really enjoy my cherry wine for another year or more. What gives?

I'm perfectly happy to be patient and let my anticipation build. I can brew beer, cider and kits in the meantime. I'm just curious about the difference. They don't teach you this stuff in school, you know.

Do they do something different to the juice that comes with the kits? Any success with rushing good things?

 

[Yooper]

It makes perfect sense to me why one would not degas a wine that one was planning on bulk aging for many months... the gas escapes naturally on its own.

it also makes perfect sense why one would want to degas a kit wine that is being rushed to the bottle. (the gas doesn't have time to escape on its own).

what does not make sense is why these kit wines are able to be rushed to the bottle and drank sooner, and why country wines are typically not rushed... I'm assuming it is NOT the degassing process that enables the wine to be drank sooner.

The Pinot Noir kit wine I have clearing now will be good to drink like 10 weeks after I pitched the yeast! I'm not expecting to really enjoy my cherry wine for another year or more. What gives?

I'm perfectly happy to be patient and let my anticipation build. I can brew beer, cider and kits in the meantime. I'm just curious about the difference. They don't teach you this stuff in school, you know.

Do they do something different to the juice that comes with the kits? Any success with rushing good things?

Well, there are a couple of keys to those quick kits. One is that it's all pH balanced, and made perfectly so that you just add the water, pitch yeast, and follow the instructions. The "quick kits" aren't very complex and don't have oak spirals or anything like that. They clear quick, and don't have a lot of depth that has to mellow. Degas them, bottle them, drink them! But some of the premium kits are actually much better in a year or two, as the flavors have to meld a bit and the tannins have to mellow. (The premium kits start at $150 and go up).

For the country wines, you could rush to bottle also if you made sure the acidity was right, the ABV wasn't too high, your fruit was low in pectin and would clear quickly, and degassed. Instead of starting with fruit, start with apple juice- and you can bottle in 2-3 months or so, maybe earlier!

If you start with grapes instead of a wine kit, you'll find that it'll be MUCH longer than you can imagine. The kits are perfected so that you get a quality product, acid adjusted, and the juice ready to go. Wine from grapes is a whole 'nother ballgame. Country wines are in the middle, as far as time and difficulty.

 

[Unferth]

Thanks Yoop! So should I be checking PH balances? Is this what I've (unknowingly) been adding acid blend for?

Also, if you start with juice and bottle in 2-3 mos, how long do you bottle age ( I know till its done, but generally)?

 

[jensmith]

Hmmm, I have only been making wine for a short time, but just about all my country wines have been drinkable young. I sample often during fermentation and clearing. From start to bottleing is just a couple of months. They have been done at 4-6 weeks, it just takes me longer to bottle them! I usually ferment dry and do not backsweeten. Maybe that is the difference? I also fement with just a cloth over the pail and stirr several times a day. No degassing needed. Maybe I just like realy young wines! Of course I have been accused of having no taste, so that could be it as well! If there is any wine left in a years time I will see if any of my wine is better with age.
The grapes are half ripe now, about time to start my first grape wine!

Bottled. Rasberry, cranberry, cider wine, mixed fruit.
Ready to bottle. Rhurbarb, ginger, blueberry
Secondary. Mixed fruit, plum
Primary. Seconds mix.

 

[Yooper]

Acid blend does help lower the pH, but it also provides flavor as a certain "bite" to the wine. You could leave it out, and add it to taste later. I also sometimes add powered tannin to some country wines.

The wines may be finished early (and they should be- many of mine reach FG in 5 days) but they take a bit of time to clear. If you bottle a cloudy wine, you'll have lots of crud in the bottle. Once they are clear, and not longer dropping lees, they are ready to bottle.

Some wines are better pretty young, like dandelion, while some wines improve with age. Cherry wine, for example, might taste like cough syrup for the first year. Dandelion will lose its "brightness" within about 2-3 years.

For wines to taste great young, they should be lower alcohol (so they aren't "hot"), unoaked (tannins take longer to mellow), and not very complex. If you add ingredients to add complexity (like elderberries) it can take longer for the wine to be smooth and mellow.

For most "country wines", I would drink within 1-3 years. For most grape wines, I wouldn't even start for about 2 years! For a kit, you can drink whenever you want. Some cheaper kits do not age well, and should be consumed before they start to age too much.

I hope that helps!

 

[Unferth]

Very informative, thanks. The damn fruit should come with instructions, IMO. HBT is the next best thing though.