Which one for pale ale ?!

[hector]

Hi there !

I've gotten two brands of spring water with different profiles .

Which one is suitable for brewing a pale ale ?

If it needs adjusting , how would you do it the easiest way ?

Brand A :

Ca = 26 ppm

Mg = 14 ppm

Na = 45 ppm

SO4 = 49 ppm

Cl = 6 ppm

Bicarbonate = 140 ppm

pH = 7.4

Brand B :

Ca = 31.8 ppm

Mg = 6.5 ppm

Na = 1 ppm

SO4 = 4 ppm

Cl = 1.5 ppm

Bicarbonate = 142.8 ppm

pH = 7.2


Hector

 

[cheezydemon3]

.....................ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm the first one.

 

[hector]

.....................ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm the first one.

O.K. , Is it a good Idea to add a little Calcium Chloride to it ?!

I would add 0.33 grams per gallon .

Hector

 

[shanecb]

The first one, though they really aren't that crazy different. I would add calcium in the way of gypsum, personally (to 50ppm or more calcium). Keeping the SO4 higher than the Cl will help bring out some good hoppiness.

 

[orangehero]

I would recommend B, as the first has a bit much Na (sodium).

The bicarbonate is a little high, so you may have to acidify the mash or use saurmaltz.

I'm not sure what is ideal for a pale ale, but you probably will want to add a modest addition of CaCl and a little more CaSO4 to accentuate the hops. The calcium additions will also help to drop your mash pH some, reducing the quantity of acid required.

 

[oldschool]

If you can wait til tomorrow I'll make an educated guess or if you have the day off you can listen to the Brewing Network's water ganza... then nap and listen again and do it again and maybe a third time and use Palmer's spreadsheet. It's really pretty easy as long as your water is moderate and you have an accurate scale or balance. As they say, brewing is a robust process.

 

[oldschool]

Just remember it is a game of ion balancing.

 

[ajdelange]

You could certainly use either. The difference would be in the hops perception. The second profile contains appreciably more sulfate and many brewers want more suilfate, a lot more sulfate, in fact in their ales. If you are one of those then you might even want to add some gypsum (calcium sulfate) which will not only increase the sulfate level but boost the calcium ion content to closer to the nominal 50 mg/L that so many people like to maintain as a minimum though it really isn't necessary.

If you don't like the effects of sulfate you could boost the calcium through the addition of calcium chloride. This would move your beer towards mellow/sweet. You could increase chloride with either of the waters.

Both have alkalinity of around 115. This will mean mash pH will be high unless you use acid of some sort. Dark malt is out for a pale ale, of course, CRS (a mix of hydrochloric and sulfuric acids) is not available in the US (AFAIK) and that leaves phosphoric or lactic (available from LHBS) and lactic in the form of sauermalz which is the easiest to use and, therefore, the hardest to make a mistake with. It is not traditional in British brewing (CRS or one or the other of the acids again depending on whether you want hops amplification or smoother beer is) but will certainly do the job. You would want 2 - 3% of your grist (by weight) to be sauermalz.

As is always the case you should be checking mash pH (at room temperature) with a pH meter. By so doing you can fine tune the sauermalz (or acid if you go that way) addition.

 

[hector]

If you don't like the effects of sulfate you could boost the calcium through the addition of calcium chloride. This would move your beer towards mellow/sweet. You could increase chloride with either of the waters.....

It's very nice to have your Hints here !

I would rather brew a mellow/sweet pale ale , because I have only bittering Hops and the sweetness can be balanced .

So , I think it's better to choose the first one and add some CaCl2 ( 0.33 grams per gallon ) .

Unfortunately , there is no LHBS where I live and I don't have any Acidmalt , but I can buy some Food-grade Lactic acid from a

distributor of a German Chemical Company in my Country .

I have already a pH-meter .

Would you please tell me the best way to use the Meter , as the mash is not at room temperature !

Hector

 

[ajdelange]

First, be sure that the meter is calibrated with pH 4 and pH 7 buffers at room temperature. Then withdraw a small sample of the mash and let it cool to room temperature. When it is cool take the pH reading. Many brewers put the mash sample in a small glass or metal container and then immerse it in cool water or place it in a refrigerator or freezer briefly.

 

[shanecb]

Have you ever used the EZ Water Calculator? You can plug in your starting water, the grains you will be using (assuming this is an all-grain recipe), and get an estimate of what your mash pH will be, and what the adjustments will change. Of course it's not always going to be 100% accurate, but it's a pretty good spreadsheet.