What to do with "bad" beer batch?

[TrickyDick]

Hi,

Recently screwed up a batch learning the ins and outs of my Brutus style rig. The short version of the story is that I inadvertently performed a mash out at 10-15 minutes into the mash. Didn't realize it was ruined until after it was kegged.

Beer is overly sweet & undrinkable as expected and though I haven't measured the SG, by sweetness, I would guess at least 1.040

It was a dead guy ale clone attempt.

What to do with the beer is the question.

I was thinking that I could potentially use the beer for the mash water in an upcoming batch, with some 6 row barley in the grist, and hopefully I can get a good conversion. I don't know what potential drawbacks this might create however. I could end up with 2 ruined batches instead on just one.

Any suggestions?

RH

 

[Cpt_Kirks]

If it turned out like your batch, I would dump it.

For brews that turn out fine, but just not to my taste, I give it away. Even though I didn't like it, the guys I give it to LOVE it, and ask for more.

Go figure...

 

[TrickyDick]

Last time I had this happen it was due to bad thermometer, mash temps too low, there was a bubble in the thermo making it seem like the temp was much higher.
I tried using alpha amylase enzyme and beta amylase enzyme to convert the residual sugars. It didn't work, I think because you need to get the temp into the 100s for the enzymes to become active.
I think I'm just going to dump the beer this time unless anyone reports success in using it as mash in water.

TD

 

[Irrenarzt]

Get yourself a reflux stillhead and a 15.5 gallon Sanke keg and pull the stem. You'll never dump a bad batch again.

 

[dcp27]

you dont need to get the temps into the 100s for the enzymes to become active. they're much more effective at those temps, but they will slowly work at fermentation temps. how long did you give those to work?

 

[TrickyDick]

Thanks.

First- what's a reflux still head and why would that help me?

Next- the last time I had a bad batch, darn shame too as it was a perfectly hopped DFH 60 minute clone, I added the enzymes (though at that time I didn't have the beta amylase as I recall), and let the keg sit in my Florida garage after releasing the CO2 pressure and de-gassing the beer daily for probably 3-4 weeks in the summer where temps are in the 90s during the day. Didn't work. Might be that there was little working yeast left in beer after kegging? Who knows.

Got the alpha amylase at AHS, and the Beta (I believe it's beta anyway) is liquid Beano from local pharmacy, special order of course.

TD

 

[Vance71975]

Hi,

Recently screwed up a batch learning the ins and outs of my Brutus style rig. The short version of the story is that I inadvertently performed a mash out at 10-15 minutes into the mash. Didn't realize it was ruined until after it was kegged.

Beer is overly sweet & undrinkable as expected and though I haven't measured the SG, by sweetness, I would guess at least 1.040

It was a dead guy ale clone attempt.

What to do with the beer is the question.

I was thinking that I could potentially use the beer for the mash water in an upcoming batch, with some 6 row barley in the grist, and hopefully I can get a good conversion. I don't know what potential drawbacks this might create however. I could end up with 2 ruined batches instead on just one.

Any suggestions?

RH

I would Sanitize a bucket, Add a tablespoon or 2 of Amylase enzyme, Pour the beer back in and hit it with some Nottingham dry yeast.

 

[Irrenarzt]

Thanks.

First- what's a reflux still head and why would that help me?

Next- the last time I had a bad batch, darn shame too as it was a perfectly hopped DFH 60 minute clone, I added the enzymes (though at that time I didn't have the beta amylase as I recall), and let the keg sit in my Florida garage after releasing the CO2 pressure and de-gassing the beer daily for probably 3-4 weeks in the summer where temps are in the 90s during the day. Didn't work. Might be that there was little working yeast left in beer after kegging? Who knows.

Got the alpha amylase at AHS, and the Beta (I believe it's beta anyway) is liquid Beano from local pharmacy, special order of course.

TD

http://www.milehidistilling.com/New_reflux_Still_Head_p/16152.htm Which turns your schitty beer into white whiskey

Beano isn't beta-amylase, just so you know. It's a different enzyme altogether.

 

[asterix404]

Yea. I had a stuck fermentation and poured in 1tsb of amalise and it's running through another fermenting cycle. I had a problem because I didn't think it would ferment so fast so I put it in the secondary. If you add enzymes make sure to do it in the primary and give it 2 weeks. It's a slow start but it takes off like crazy. It will still produce dexitrins so your beer should also taste good and it won't reduce it to an SG of 1.

 

[samc]

One of my rare, thankfully, dumpers went to my neighbor as slug bait. I often get some veggies in return - good deal.

 

[skyzo]

+1 for the still :rockin:

A few years back I had a 5gal batch of chocolate porter that was horrible. Its really the only beer that I've made thats been "bad". I mean this thing was undrinkable. For some reason, it would NOT go below 1.035 (this was back in my extract days), and it was sickly sweet. Makes me gag even thinking about it haha. Anyways, we kept freezing it and scraping off the water until we had what we calculated to be about a 15% concoction. Let it age for a half year, and boom!, we got something drinkable that packed a major punch.

 

[Irrenarzt]

Good call on the freeze distillation.

 

[Robusto]

How's that song go? "...beer for our horses..."

If you know someone who has horses they may take it off your hands. Horses love beer and its good for their coats and digestion.

 

[dcp27]

wouldn't freeze distilliation exaggerate the sweetness even more?

 

[OLDBREW]

brew another batch of dry high alcohol brew then mix the two together. If this batch that you have now taste sweet but just doesn't have the alcohol, or flavor you're looking for, blending may be the way to make one good beer from two different beers.

If not then use this not so drinkable batch for cooking. crab boil for one would be good.
grab the book "Beer Lover's Cookbook" by John Schlimm

you don't want to get caught distilling moonshine whiskey in the USA. They will confiscate all your brewing equipment, big fines, and even jail time can occur.

 

[ILOVEBEER]

If it turned out like your batch, I would dump it.

For brews that turn out fine, but just not to my taste, I give it away. Even though I didn't like it, the guys I give it to LOVE it, and ask for more.

Go figure...

CUZ IT's FREE :cross:

 

[TrickyDick]

http://www.milehidistilling.com/New_reflux_Still_Head_p/16152.htm Which turns your schitty beer into white whiskey

Beano isn't beta-amylase, just so you know. It's a different enzyme altogether.

Yeah i think you're correct about the enzyme. Alpha galactosidase maybe? I used this on a batch of orange juice that I was experimenting with, and it cleared it up a bit. Airlock ran dry and the OJ project failed however. I may revisit it in the future however..

I think I'm going to maybe give the enzyme trick once more. I think I will transfer the beer into a bucket, and add some dry yeast. It's carbonated right now, so was wondering if I should let it degas with an airlock, and if I should attempt to oxygenate?? Can I pitch the amylase and yeast together or should I let the amylase do it's thing, THEN pitch the yeast?

I think I'm going to skip the still head idea for the time being.

RH

 

[OLDBREW]

wouldn't freeze distilliation exaggerate the sweetness even more?

yes

 

[OLDBREW]

don't try to degauss the brew. At this point you are better off blending your brew, rather then running the risk of contaminating it trying to drop the terminal gravity. It is what it is, beano nor more yeast will change it that much.

Blend the Brew

 

[MazdaMatt]

Sounds to me like unconverted complex starches. Be the pioneer. Put it in a bucket with fresh yeast and beano. I'd want to let the beano work for at least a few days before the yeast go in so the yeast have some food. O2? Ask the experts on that one.

Take gravity readings at the start and weekly. I've read that beano operates slowly but surely. Don't put it in your 90* garage.

 

[OLDBREW]

Beanos for farting not brewing.

 

[TrickyDick]

Thanks for all the recommendations.

As far as blending, I did do this with a previous batch of beer. I found that it made the good beer I was blending it with worse, and would rather have just pitched the offensive beer.

I think I am going to try to "save" the beer by racking into a bucket and adding some amylase and then give it a week and pitch a dry yeast pack then see what happens. Ill need to take a gravity reading too to see where it's at to start with.

I think I'll avoid the beano.

I was surprised nobody had ever tried mashing in with beer that hadn't been fully converted. My concern with this step is that I might end up with 2 bad batches.

thanks

TD

 

[TrickyDick]

Heck maybe I'll even rack it onto a fresh yeast cake from the latest batch and add the amylase! Yeah I think that's my plan..

 

[dcp27]

sounds like a good plan. ive used the amylase a few times with good results.

I'd expect using it as mash water would work as well, but I'd test it on a small scale first just to be safe.

 

[Irrenarzt]

wouldn't freeze distilliation exaggerate the sweetness even more?

Probably to some degree as you are only removing water by this method. The bonus is that this method is relatively cheap. You don't have to buy any new equipment unless you don't have a freezer.

Distill the crap I say.

 

[TrickyDick]

I think the problem with my batch, is that with high gravity, there has likely been very little fermentation, and thus, likely little alcohol to distill if I even had such an apparatus.

 

[Irrenarzt]

Good point. What's your current ABV?

 

[TrickyDick]

I got to look that up when I get home. I never took a FG reading when I kegged, but know the yeast had def finished their job. It had been in the secondary, in ferm fridge for 3-4 weeks. I guess I should take better notes and records. At work now so I can't look for the high tech clipboard I use to file this important data, like the starting OG.

 

[corkybstewart]

Maybe some brett or bugs can eat those unfermentables, this may be a good time for a sour beer.

 

[Irrenarzt]

Rule number one: ALWAYS take an OG and FG measurement. You'll never know the health of your product without this information.

I know people get lazy but this is important schit. If you like drinking under-attenuated beer, then by all means, don't take gravity readings.