What apples should I get????

[Chalkyt]

I think I have just stumbled into Aladin's Cave.

Batlow, an apple growing town on the other side of the mountains from us (3 hours away!!!) is having a "Ciderfest" (www.batlowciderfest.com.au) in a few weeks time. i.e. all the usual stuff with apple and cider tasting, "educational" sessions people dressed up as apples and wenches etc, etc.

One of the activities listed is a visit to Wilgro Orchard where they are starting to produce apples for cider. We are going, and it appears that you can buy these apples.

So, now for the good part. The apples they list are...Kingston Black, Michelin, Dabinett, Bulmers Norman, Yarlington Mill, Brown Snout, Stoke Red, Somerset Redstreak, and Brown’s Apple.

I have seen these listed in Jolicoeur and other learned places. So, before I buy everything in sight, what would be a good combination/blend?

My own small orchard is mainly eating apples (red delicious, pomme de neige, granny smith, cox's orange pippin and now some crab apples) so I am happy to "invest" in some dedicated cider apples to see what they might produce.

All opinions and advice about these apples and combinations are welcome.

 

[wasully]

I don't remember the numbers off hand, and they were kinda variable. But Jolicoeur and Lea and other Proulx/Nichols all had suggested bittersweet/bittersharp ratios. So look up the classifications for those apples and those ratios?

 

[Chalkyt]

Thanks for that suggestion. I had rather overlooked the chapter on apple varieties because they were mostly "exotic" in that they are not readily available here without growing them yourself (hence my Cox's Orange Pippin).

I had a chat with Wilgro's owner. His trees are just a few years old and have only now produced a reasonable quantity of apples. He expects that next year he will be able to sell small quantities to "craft cider" makers. At this stage they use most of the production for their own cider.

The other interesting comment was that the "exotics" have already been picked since they tend to be early maturing (late Summer and early Fall) because our climate, even up here in the mountains with frosts, is generally warmer than say, France or England (and no doubt parts of the USA and Canada).

 

[madscientist451]

Since its 3 hrs away, you might want to call the orchard ahead of time and see what they have, if they sell small amounts of cider apples and what the prices are.
Not all of the varieties listed above will ripen at the same time.
I looked at their website and they make their own alcoholic cider, fermented in barrels.
http://wilgroorchards.com.au/traditional-hand-crafted-dry-cider/
They're probably using all their apples themselves, but they may have some juice or extra apples to sell at the end of the season, its worth looking into.
If you can find the bloke who actually makes the cider, you can usually get all kinds of great information just by asking and showing an interest in what they are doing. Bring along your best homebrew to give away and ask him (or her) to give you a call if there's anything they can part with.
It may also be worthwhile to look around that area for anyone else growing cider apples.
Someday, I'm going to make a trip to NZ/Australia , and now I have another spot on my list worth checking out, thanks for posting!

 

[wasully]

had rather overlooked the chapter on apple varieties because they were mostly "exotic" in that they are not readily available here without growing them yourself (hence my Cox's Orange Pippin)..

That's pretty much everybody everywhere for cider apples. Annoyingly.

 

[Chalkyt]

I have had a chat with Ralph. We will go past his place on the way to Batlow and he will be set up at Ciderfest. At least I can get some of his cider, if not apples or juice. There are now a number of cider makers around the Batlow area which is about 250km "across the hill" from us. They are on the western (apple growing) side of the Snowy Mountains and we are on the eastern side which is cattle and sheep (and skiing) country.

We touched on the issue of "commercial" cider made by the breweries which he thinks is generally from concentrate out of China, carbonated and sweetened. I am inclined to agree... most of it isn't great. As I said earlier, he will look at sellingl fruit to "craft cider makers" once he is producing a surplus.

 

[Maylar]

Of the varietals that you mentioned, I know that the Dabinett was bred specifically as a cider apple. It's one of the few that can stand alone in a hard cider. And English cider makers lean heavily on their Kingston Black crop.

 

[wasully]

All knowledge 2nd & 3rd hand here:

But it's probably also worth mentioning that kingston black isn't generally an easy/vigorous tree or great cropper. And heavily biennial, even for an apple.

But it's also one of the few apples that can make a good/great single varietal and it's supposed to be the 'king of cider apples' so I suppose you have to grow it.

But again, this info isn't firsthand.

And even if it was, terroir is still a thing. I've heard one cidery say it's a great tree for them. Different cidery, identical climate&geological history(AKA soil), less than 50 miles away, doesn't exactly sing its praises. And most(all?) of Australia has a very different climate than the cider country of England and France. Maybe the varieties should vary a bit for Australia.