Wanting to get the most Brett character(funk) possible

[Beerswimmer]

I'll be brewing another Orval clone again, I love them. But it takes so long to get where I really enjoy the stronger funk of the Brett Brux. I'm wondering what I can do to get it there faster/stronger? I want a super horsey/schweddy/melted plastic band-aids funky beer, but don't want to wait 6+ months.

Possible? Any tips, tricks, methods? Let's hear how to do it!

 

[metic]

Have a look at Chad Yakobson's research. Information at phenols near start, and also on p.35, but its all worth reading. Short version: do a ferulic acid rest (113-122), consider using a POF+ yeast, etc.

 

[40watt]

I've seen info on POF+ wine yeast, but never info on beer yeast.
Although it seems most Saison strains fit that criteria.

Do you specifically what yeasts are POF+ ?

 

[metic]

Hefeweizen yeasts often are, I'm not sure beyond that.

 

[Beerswimmer]

I'd think a Belgian yeast would be.

 

[gandelf]

Stress the Brett, it produces more funk when stressed.

 

[smokinghole]

I'm inclined to say you have to wait. I suspect the aromatic and flavor compounds produced by Brett is a function of slowly liberating bound molecules over time. The easiest way to speed that up is temp and knowing what specific enzyme/enzymes you need that are slowing down the production of your desired molecules. So unless you are in a lab doing analytical chemistry and molecular biology I think you are limited to raising the temp up to 80-85f.

 

[sweetcell]

Have a look at Chad Yakobson's research. Information at phenols near start, and also on p.35, but its all worth reading. Short version: do a ferulic acid rest (113-122), consider using a POF+ yeast, etc.

another good post from Chad that summarizes a lot of this info: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f127/understanding-brett-flavors-298943/

 

[Beerswimmer]

So acid rest, phenolic yeast, and warm temps(in secondary I'm guessing) should help get the funk levels higher. Right?

Not the Orval type I was asking about but I have a patersbier(OG 1.045-ish) I'll be brewing this week with Wyeast 3522, will add brett lambicus to it in secondary and put in my warm room, 75F+ ambient, and let it go for a while before bottling. I'll see how the warm secondary temps work.

 

[metic]

This is just anecdotal, but one time I pitched a large amount of brett brux (1 wyeast pack in a bit less than 3 gallons) at high krausen, and the result was very funky. I wonder if this perhaps gave the brett more change to work on by products from the sacch fermentation that hadn't been cleaned up yet. Anyway, I try to avoid super funky beers, so I haven't done this since, but its something you could try.

 

[dantheman13]

Is p-coumaric acid also extracted during a ferulic acid rest?

 

[metic]

Is p-coumaric acid also extracted during a ferulic acid rest?

I've been trying to find out a bit about acid production in the mash (in relation to the topics in this thread), but its pretty tough going without a background in the science. As far as I can understand, the enzymes responsible for increasing ferulic acid levels in the wort (cinnamoyl esterases) should also increase p-coumaric acid. I'm going by what I can understand from this paper.

 

[ChugachBrewing]

I have a beer that is way to horsey for me. Not sure what i'm goign to do with it. My advice? Severely underpitch, over temp, and you'll have it in a month or two.

 

[dantheman13]

I have a beer that is way to horsey for me. Not sure what i'm goign to do with it. My advice? Severely underpitch, over temp, and you'll have it in a month or two.

Blending would be the option I'd go with, but I don't know if that is a viable route for you. In fact, that is my goal here lately is to brew a very funky saison for blending with a very lactic sour that doesn't have enough funk.