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flyangler18
Well-Known Member
Got the beginnings of a pellicle forming now - I'll hold off on the pics until it's fully formed and truly a sight to behold.
VSS 9097 Old Ale
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Tonedef131
Well-Known Member
I had a nice pellicle form...then the brett got so active that it broke the pellice up.
BioBeing
Well-Known Member
I was planning an old ale similar to Theakston's Old Peculiar (based off the clone brews recipe), and my LHBS had a pack of this yeast left. So, I am going to give it a try... but having read this, I'm worried now! How long are you guys leaving this in the primary, and is the pellicle you see in the secondary? How long do you plan on secondarying for before bottling?
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flyangler18
Well-Known Member
I moved mine to secondary after about 30 days on the yeast - and plan on bulk aging in secondary for about a year.
BioBeing
Well-Known Member
I moved mine to secondary after about 30 days on the yeast - and plan on bulk aging in secondary for about a year.
'K thanks. Might need to get me a second secondary then so I can use my current one for dry hopping other beers in the meantime.
So I'm planning on doing a similar thing, but I've got a 10G oak cask that I would like to use as a secondary. Does anyone have any experince with that sort of thing.
I was thinking about 3 weeks to a month primary, then off to the oak cask for some period (not sure how long though).
I was thinking about 3 weeks to a month primary, then off to the oak cask for some period (not sure how long though).
Tonedef131
Well-Known Member
Sounds good. Just know that once you get the Brett in that barrel it's there or good. It will move 6-7mm into the wood and that will move into everything you put in that barrel post old ale. I am not saying that is a bad thing...just something to be aware of.
According to the book Wild Brews, most oak barrels, even the toasted ones, are infected with wild Dekkera Bruxellensis or Brettanomyces Claussenii before they are even used. This is where the old ales of Britain got their brett character from, and the strain itself was named after the source where it was discovered.
Yeah, that was my understanding too. I was thinking later of trying to do a belgian sour with the cask, so the fact that it'll have Brett in it isn't too big a concern for me.
Tonedef131
Well-Known Member
Good for you, I have 3 ten gallon oak barrels that are all devoted to sour brews.
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flyangler18
Well-Known Member
A lot of the definition of the pellicle is lost in these pictures, though you can see the big gnarly bubbles and formations in the second shot:
BioBeing
Well-Known Member
Got my Theakston's Old Peculiar-ish going yesterday with this yeast. Now, just sit back and wait, and drink some other homebrews...
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flyangler18
Well-Known Member
Seems that there are a number of us who have brewed using this yeast. Any interest in swapping a bottle or two a year from now?
BioBeing
Well-Known Member
I could be.
Bit scared of this though... my mash temp was all over the place, due to either a dodgy thermometer, or operator error... I was aiming for 149 for 90 mins, but think I got about 145 for the first hour, so I went up to 154 for the last 30 mins.
My preboil gravity was a bit low, so I dumped in some DME I had lying around. Ended up one point over (corrected) target though at 1.083, so maybe I just hadn't got my sugars mixed up well?
Here is what I ended up doing:
BeerSmith Recipe Printout - BeerSmith Brewing Software, Recipes, Blog, Wiki and Discussion Forum
Recipe: Theakston's Old Peculiarish
Brewer: Richard
Asst Brewer: Glen
Style: Old Ale
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)
Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 5.50 gal
Boil Size: 7.39 gal
Estimated OG: 1.082 SG
Estimated Color: 16.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 43.7 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes
Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
8.0 oz Extra Light Dry Extract (3.0 SRM) Dry Extract 3.15 %
11.0 oz Lyle's Golden Syrup (0.0 SRM) Extract 4.35 %
12 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 75.58 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 6.30 %
6.0 oz Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) Grain 2.36 %
3.0 oz Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain 1.18 %
2.00 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (60 min) Hops 43.7 IBU
1.00 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops -
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] (15 min) (Aroma Hop-SteeHops -
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] (2 min) (Aroma Hop-SteepHops -
0.50 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
0.50 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
10.0 oz Candi Sugar, Clear (0.5 SRM) Sugar 3.94 %
8.0 oz Dememera Sugar (2.0 SRM) Sugar 3.15 %
1 Pkgs Old Ale Blend (Wyeast #9097) [Starter 1000 ml]
Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out
Total Grain Weight: 13.56 lb
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
90 min Mash In Add 16.95 qt of water at 164.1 F 149.0 F
(ETA - might omit the dry hopping based on comments from this thread.)
(ETA 2 - fermenting at 70 F. Oxygenated well. Had airlock activity within 12 hours.)
Bit scared of this though... my mash temp was all over the place, due to either a dodgy thermometer, or operator error... I was aiming for 149 for 90 mins, but think I got about 145 for the first hour, so I went up to 154 for the last 30 mins.
My preboil gravity was a bit low, so I dumped in some DME I had lying around. Ended up one point over (corrected) target though at 1.083, so maybe I just hadn't got my sugars mixed up well?
Here is what I ended up doing:
BeerSmith Recipe Printout - BeerSmith Brewing Software, Recipes, Blog, Wiki and Discussion Forum
Recipe: Theakston's Old Peculiarish
Brewer: Richard
Asst Brewer: Glen
Style: Old Ale
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)
Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 5.50 gal
Boil Size: 7.39 gal
Estimated OG: 1.082 SG
Estimated Color: 16.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 43.7 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 70.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes
Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
8.0 oz Extra Light Dry Extract (3.0 SRM) Dry Extract 3.15 %
11.0 oz Lyle's Golden Syrup (0.0 SRM) Extract 4.35 %
12 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 75.58 %
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 6.30 %
6.0 oz Wheat, Torrified (1.7 SRM) Grain 2.36 %
3.0 oz Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain 1.18 %
2.00 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (60 min) Hops 43.7 IBU
1.00 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] (Dry Hop 3 days) Hops -
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] (15 min) (Aroma Hop-SteeHops -
0.50 oz Fuggles [4.50 %] (2 min) (Aroma Hop-SteepHops -
0.50 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
0.50 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
10.0 oz Candi Sugar, Clear (0.5 SRM) Sugar 3.94 %
8.0 oz Dememera Sugar (2.0 SRM) Sugar 3.15 %
1 Pkgs Old Ale Blend (Wyeast #9097) [Starter 1000 ml]
Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out
Total Grain Weight: 13.56 lb
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
90 min Mash In Add 16.95 qt of water at 164.1 F 149.0 F
(ETA - might omit the dry hopping based on comments from this thread.)
(ETA 2 - fermenting at 70 F. Oxygenated well. Had airlock activity within 12 hours.)
On for this sunday... going for a 10 gallon batch (1st time for a 10G batch). Got the Old Ale starter going, 3/4G with 12 oz amber DME + yeast energizer. I'll add additional malt to set up the starter again on sat.
Barrel is already prepped, and been water tight for a month now. I plan on bottling an additional couple of 22's with wort to set aside to replace the angles share.
Should be tasty in a year or so
Barrel is already prepped, and been water tight for a month now. I plan on bottling an additional couple of 22's with wort to set aside to replace the angles share.
Should be tasty in a year or so
BioBeing
Well-Known Member
Going to move mine to secondary today. Had 3 weeks in primary. Gravity reading was 1.015. Tasted pretty good!
Wow, 2 batch's of 6g of beer is a lot of beer. Had some setbacks along the way (treacle boiled over as I was warming it up, so had to replace with more blackstrap then I had anticipated), but everything looks good so far.
Both showed activity this morning and have both rigged on blowoffs (I think they're going to need it).
Both showed activity this morning and have both rigged on blowoffs (I think they're going to need it).
Tried my first sample after about a week and a half in the oak cask. No real oak character but the brett is starting to come through already. hopefully in a week or two I can move it back to a carboy to watch the brett continue to develop.
BioBeing
Well-Known Member
Took a hydro of mine last night - reading was 1.009! Down from 1.015 when I racked to secondary. That is 90% attenuation. It has had just over two months in secondary now. Never did see a pelicle, but there was a lot of CO2 that outgassed when I took the sample. I could bottle this right now, and it would be an excellent beer. But I'm going to leave it and let the Brett develop.
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flyangler18
Well-Known Member
Mine's got an awesome pellicle going right now - I won't transfer to packaging for at least another couple of months.
Tonedef131
Well-Known Member
Mine has been in the secondary for about 5 months now and I gotta think the gravity has gotten very low. It never formed much of a pellicle, probably because I flushed the carboy with CO2 before racking. But that brett has been very active ever since I transferred. Not sure if this will taste much like an Old Ale when the Brett is done drying it out, but I can't wait to drink it!
BioBeing
Well-Known Member
Waiting is the hard part for sure! Mine still had plenty of the sweetness of Old Peculier, but with some sort of sourness starting to develop I think. I'm really not sure what the brett will end up adding - this being my first time with it - but maybe it is starting to come in. I think (hope!) that as the sour develops the sweet will stay, and they will end up balancing out nicely. We'll see!
For those who have had a pellicle form, how long did that take? I've had mine in the secondary now for a couple of months and have yet to see any such formation. The beer has taken on a sour note for sure though.
dreadnatty08
Well-Known Member
My Oat Wine never developed much of a pellicle, just some large Brett like bubbles. I even added some bottle dregs to it (JP, FFF) to no avail. But, it tastes fantastic having sat on Oak cubes for about 4 months now. I think I'll bottle it in a couple weeks. It'll be a winter warmer for sure. OG was 1.091 and it got 1.010 in about 2 months. Haven't taken a gravity reading in a while.
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flyangler18
Well-Known Member
The recent bumps to this thread got me off my arse to go pull a sample for both gravity and the requisite sensory evaluation.
Brett has taken it down to 1.014 so far and I imagine it'll go down another couple of points. My original plan was to package this at the end of the year, now I may adjust that schedule somewhat.
Rich and vinous with a noticeable Brett presence that comes across as tart and fruity, like pie cherries. Slight alcohol warmth with some in the nose as well. Toasty and bready, too. There's some hefty body to this beer - a heaviness on the tongue. It will age splendidly.
Brett has taken it down to 1.014 so far and I imagine it'll go down another couple of points. My original plan was to package this at the end of the year, now I may adjust that schedule somewhat.
Rich and vinous with a noticeable Brett presence that comes across as tart and fruity, like pie cherries. Slight alcohol warmth with some in the nose as well. Toasty and bready, too. There's some hefty body to this beer - a heaviness on the tongue. It will age splendidly.
Racked off a gallon last night on to cherries, a second gallon onto raspberries, and 2 gallons left on french oak. Plus, I've got another 5 gallons untouched from the original recipe. This is at a little over the 3 month period.
I have to say, I'm digging the flavor of this ale. It's cleared up really nicely and it's got just a little sour/funk going on, but not overwhelming like some I've had.
I have to say, I'm digging the flavor of this ale. It's cleared up really nicely and it's got just a little sour/funk going on, but not overwhelming like some I've had.
Tonedef131
Well-Known Member
Yeah I pulled a sample of mine a couple weeks ago and love how the Brett doesn't dominate. It is there in a leather and cherries sort of way but you never forget you are drinking a big complex old ale.
visitor
Well-Known Member
I only ever had a small pellicle on mine. I brewed a smoked porter that I used this yeast on. It went from 1.084 to 1.006. I tasted this last week and it was nice and tart and had some dark fruit flavors with OVER THE TOP cherry flavors! I'll be brewing another porter to blend into this one and cut some of the cherry flavors.
visitor
Well-Known Member
Took a look at my brew this weekend as I was brewing a porter that I may blend into the old ale and after my last sample I've got a decent pellicle going. Must have exposed the brew to enough O2 during the quick sample I pulled two weeks ago to actually get a pellicle going.
Should I leave this alone some and just let is sit longer and see if some of the cherry fades or plan crash cool it down and blend in the porter I brewed after it's done fermenting?
Should I leave this alone some and just let is sit longer and see if some of the cherry fades or plan crash cool it down and blend in the porter I brewed after it's done fermenting?
I'm coming up on 5 months for this beer since brewing. I finally have some action starting on the top of one of my 5G carboys, with a white lattice forming. The two french oaked 1G haven't shown anything, and the 2 other 1G batches started fermenting again after racking one onto cherries and the other onto Rasberries.
I'm curious how long people are aging their beer until bottling them.
I'm curious how long people are aging their beer until bottling them.
Tonedef131
Well-Known Member
Mine is 7 months old now and I pulled a sample a month ago. It is just now starting to form that "leathery" character that I desire. I think I will give it a full year since it's still slightly active, and well, it is an "Old Ale" so I don't want to drink it till it's old.
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flyangler18
Well-Known Member
Mine is about 7 months at this stage as well - and I don't plan on moving it until the end of the year. It's full of leather and pie cherries right now.
Well, I bottled up mine the other day. When I originally brewed this, I made a 10g batch so I could play around with some of the base beer to experiment with flavors.
Here's the tally
9 12oz bottles of Oregon Fruit Raspberry
9 12oz bottles of Oregon Fruit Cherry
19 12 bottles of oaked
5+ gal of misc 12's and 22's of base recipe.
Initial review:
all 4 came out very clear, which I would have hoped, since they've been sitting for 6 months in the garage (which is cooler, been in the 50's for the last few months).
The raspberry was really good, though the fruit flavor is strong. It's a little tart, a little sour maybe, but very refreshing.
The cherry flavor didn't carry as well. It's pretty good, but the raspberry was better.
The french oak version came out exceptional. Just a little bit of sourness and a very pleasant, fairly full mouth feel. I'm kicking myself for not putting more on oak. I used about a half oz of med toast french oak for about two weeks, before racking it off into 1g jugs and then letting it sit for the last few months. I may have to submit this to one of the local home brew comps, just to see what the reviews would be.
Base Recipe - This is going to be a very nice beer to have around when I want something different. It doesn't have a big hop bite, nor an overall malty sweet background of the typical ESB, Stouts or IPAs that I typically enjoy. I'll be curious to see how it carbs up and how it affects the flavor.
Here's the tally
9 12oz bottles of Oregon Fruit Raspberry
9 12oz bottles of Oregon Fruit Cherry
19 12 bottles of oaked
5+ gal of misc 12's and 22's of base recipe.
Initial review:
all 4 came out very clear, which I would have hoped, since they've been sitting for 6 months in the garage (which is cooler, been in the 50's for the last few months).
The raspberry was really good, though the fruit flavor is strong. It's a little tart, a little sour maybe, but very refreshing.
The cherry flavor didn't carry as well. It's pretty good, but the raspberry was better.
The french oak version came out exceptional. Just a little bit of sourness and a very pleasant, fairly full mouth feel. I'm kicking myself for not putting more on oak. I used about a half oz of med toast french oak for about two weeks, before racking it off into 1g jugs and then letting it sit for the last few months. I may have to submit this to one of the local home brew comps, just to see what the reviews would be.
Base Recipe - This is going to be a very nice beer to have around when I want something different. It doesn't have a big hop bite, nor an overall malty sweet background of the typical ESB, Stouts or IPAs that I typically enjoy. I'll be curious to see how it carbs up and how it affects the flavor.
phished880
Well-Known Member
Does anyone possible have this on slant or maybe some "infected" oak? I never pulled the trigger on the yeast when it was released and reading this thread it making me really regret it. Please let me know. Thanks
J
J
petercarrjones
Member
Any further reviews on this one turned out for all of you who are about at a year+?
DustyRusty
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Hi,
I'm keen to brew an Old Ale with this yeast, and I'm curious as to how much it dries the beer out after extended aging. While I like sour, I want the Old to remain malty and sweet, not sour and thin.
Anyone aged this 1 Year + have any comments?
I'm keen to brew an Old Ale with this yeast, and I'm curious as to how much it dries the beer out after extended aging. While I like sour, I want the Old to remain malty and sweet, not sour and thin.
Anyone aged this 1 Year + have any comments?
