Unusual question about filling a keg.

[baabaa]

Hello everyone!

Tl;Dr: is there a way to fill a keg with water without disassembly and without specialized equipment?

I work at a place that throws out a lot of unikegs. They are a brand of single use plastic kegs that are meant to be recycled, but I have a different use case for them.

If anyone here knows much about gardening and greenhouses you might know if you put barrels of water in a greenhouse the mass of the water will heat up during the day and slowly release the heat at night, acting like a thermal battery.

My plan was to fill with water and lay some on their side in the greenhouse where they would fit the best.

After not being able to figure out how to get the first one apart I cut off the top to try to figure it out from the inside. I filled it with water and just covered the top, but for it to stand up it has to be in an awkward spot.

It seems pretty impossible to get apart without destruction. There appears to be one layer of plastic bottle, they put the top parts in, and the place a cap on top and shrink wrap the second layer on top.

So is there any way to get this thing filled with water so I can lay it on its side? Hopefully without tla tool that is too pricey.

Thanks for reading.

 

[mac_1103]

Those are basically plastic sanke kegs, right? So you would need a sanke coupler to get liquid into them unless you remove the spear.

 

[baabaa]

Those are basically plastic sanke kegs, right? So you would need a sanke coupler to get liquid into them unless you remove the spear.

So yes they are this same style as the snake kegs, but they are built so they aren't able to be reused. You cannot remove the spear, in any normal fashion. Unlike the other style of plastic keg, when this is assembled all plastic clips are inside of the keg and completely inassassable.

I will check out the snake coupler and see if I have any reasonable options there. Thanks for the response, really appreciate it.

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

If you can empty one of those kegs you should be able to fill it.

 

[Broken Crow]

Here's the 'official' filling video:

Assuming you don't need to drink the water, you can omit the sanitation and CO2 (don't bother putting a wye fitting on it, just your straight water line...leave the CO2 barb open...
Here's a picture of a typical sanke coupler:
remove the check-valve ball; #2 and the CO2 check-valve; #9

then you should be ok to just use a water hose in the top.

 

[tdf]

I know you're filling it with water and not gas, but be careful with those plastic sanke kegs and any amount of pressure. They have killed people.

https://www.fosters.com/story/news/2012/04/25/worker-killed-when-keg-explodes/37746243007/

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

I know you're filling it with water and not gas, but be careful with those plastic sanke kegs and any amount of pressure. They have killed people.

https://www.fosters.com/story/news/2012/04/25/worker-killed-when-keg-explodes/37746243007/

Interesting article and a good reminder of safety in our home breweries. Other than over consumption of alcohol there's many dangers in our hobby we need to be aware of.

 

[kevin58]

How big are these kegs you intend to use? I know a gardener who uses 55 gallon drums filled with water in his greenhouse (about 12'X12' at most) and it takes three or four of them to make a difference.

 

[baabaa]

Here's the 'official' filling video:

Assuming you don't need to drink the water, you can omit the sanitation and CO2 (don't bother putting a wye fitting on it, just your straight water line...leave the CO2 barb open...
Here's a picture of a typical sanke coupler:
remove the check-valve ball; #2 and the CO2 check-valve; #9
View attachment 875289
then you should be ok to just use a water hose in the top.

Really appreciate the guidance. I'm sure I can borrow a coupler from work for a day or 2.

I know you're filling it with water and not gas, but be careful with those plastic sanke kegs and any amount of pressure. They have killed people.

https://www.fosters.com/story/news/2012/04/25/worker-killed-when-keg-explodes/37746243007/

I have seen people say this a few times now while trying to figure this out so I am aware and have no need to pressurize the keg.

I am curious though, that article doesn't say anything about a plastic keg. I wonder if that's what it was, or if it was just an assumption by the community that has spread. According to the officials filling video, there is no need for a sanitation step at wherever is filling it, id assume they come sanitized from the factory.

All of that being said. Is there a method of sanitizing a keg without high pressure or removing the spear? I'm guessing there is with just oxyclean. My area just experienced a pretty brutal ice storm and it was a reminder to keep water on hand and these are free and easy to fill.

As a side note you have no idea how much water it takes to flush a toilet until you are without power/water for a week.

 

[baabaa]

How big are these kegs you intend to use? I know a gardener who uses 55 gallon drums filled with water in his greenhouse (about 12'X12' at most) and it takes three or four of them to make a difference.

These are probably 1/4 kegs that are all going to the landfill anyway. Someday I'll have a proper greenhouse, but for now I have one that probably won't last that long and is barely big enough to sleep in. But it does keep us from having to move all of the plant starts in every single night to protect from frost.

 

[OakIslandBrewery]

These are probably 1/4 kegs that are all going to the landfill anyway. Someday I'll have a proper greenhouse, but for now I have one that probably won't last that long and is barely big enough to sleep in. But it does keep us from having to move all of the plant starts in every single night to protect from frost.

So you're using the water filled kegs for heat retention?

 

[baabaa]

So you're using the water filled kegs for heat retention?

Yeah. Our last frost date isn't til June, and even 2° makes a difference for us.

 

[Deadalus]

A low cost easy way I can think of is to simply drill two holes in the sides and position the keg on its side with those two holes now at the top. Put a rubber grommet in the holes and fill using tubing with outer diameter sized for the grommet inner diameter. When full, stopper both holes.

Other options available. I think I have seen rain barrel spigots that can be inserted without having interior access. Or if you have some interior access, you could add a bulkhead fitting. Grommets work fine though when above the level and here you are just dealing with water anyway and some gas exchange if not perfectly sealed is not a problem such as with oxygen and beer.

 

[Deadalus]

Also do you use heating mats? They can be somewhat helpful around freezing but I don't have good data as to how much when the seedlings are bigger than a few sets of leaves. They are helpful when germinating seeds and can keep the soil roughly 10-15 degrees warmer. Highly dependent on how well sealed the greenhouse is. Mine is a rehabilitated tunnel style with 6 mil plastic. I can roll the sides up but I don't make much effort to seal up the corners so I do get wind blowing in at times.

 

[baabaa]

Also do you use heating mats? They can be somewhat helpful around freezing but I don't have good data as to how much when the seedlings are bigger than a few sets of leaves. They are helpful when germinating seeds and can keep the soil roughly 10-15 degrees warmer. Highly dependent on how well sealed the greenhouse is. Mine is a rehabilitated tunnel style with 6 mil plastic. I can roll the sides up but I don't make much effort to seal up the corners so I do get wind blowing in at times.

We do have heating mats, but no power to the greenhouse. We have a whole indoor setup with lights and everything, but I hate dealing with hardening off plants so for me it's worth it to keep them outside as much as possible. I've also thought about building a lightweight platform about the size of a car that I can put on bicycle wheels, put all of the plants on it and move the lighting setup to the garage and just pull the whole thing out in the morning and in at night when the days are warm enough, but I'm not there yet.

 

[Jim R]

You can buy big plastic 32 gal garbage cans with snap on lids for cheap. The black ones will even absorb more heat from the sun during the day.

 

[tdf]

Really appreciate the guidance. I'm sure I can borrow a coupler from work for a day or 2.


I have seen people say this a few times now while trying to figure this out so I am aware and have no need to pressurize the keg.

I am curious though, that article doesn't say anything about a plastic keg. I wonder if that's what it was, or if it was just an assumption by the community that has spread. According to the officials filling video, there is no need for a sanitation step at wherever is filling it, id assume they come sanitized from the factory.

All of that being said. Is there a method of sanitizing a keg without high pressure or removing the spear? I'm guessing there is with just oxyclean. My area just experienced a pretty brutal ice storm and it was a reminder to keep water on hand and these are free and easy to fill.

As a side note you have no idea how much water it takes to flush a toilet until you are without power/water for a week.

It was a plastic keg - some other contemporaneous coverage said that, but many of them have succumbed to the bit rot of the internet.

There's a surviving secondary source here: https://stateimpact.npr.org/new-ham...ces-osha-fine-in-fatal-redhook-keg-explosion/

I can also tell you from personal memory that this caused many many craft breweries to stop using the plastic sanke kegs.

 

[Deadalus]

We do have heating mats, but no power to the greenhouse. We have a whole indoor setup with lights and everything, but I hate dealing with hardening off plants so for me it's worth it to keep them outside as much as possible. I've also thought about building a lightweight platform about the size of a car that I can put on bicycle wheels, put all of the plants on it and move the lighting setup to the garage and just pull the whole thing out in the morning and in at night when the days are warm enough, but I'm not there yet.

Interesting idea, might end up costing money as trailers and wheels don't always come cheap. A good idea though to get trays moved around, it's tedious. I thought my greenhouse plants might be hardened off too but I think they still can be succeptible as even after I hardened off my tomatoes, maybe not well enough, they did seem to get sun scalded once or twice. My greenhouse gets morning shade, just a result of available placement.

Also, you may have missed my keg suggestion as I double posted.

 

[IslandLizard]

There's a surviving secondary source here: https://stateimpact.npr.org/new-ham...ces-osha-fine-in-fatal-redhook-keg-explosion/

I can also tell you from personal memory that this caused many many craft breweries to stop using the plastic sanke kegs.

Isn't there a safety valve (PRV) or rupture disc built into those plastic kegs that prevents reaching anywhere near critical pressure?

Or did these kegs explode before the PRV pressure was reached, due to damages to the (plastic) skin/structure? That seems much too likely to happen.

 

[baabaa]

Interesting idea, might end up costing money as trailers and wheels don't always come cheap. A good idea though to get trays moved around, it's tedious. I thought my greenhouse plants might be hardened off too but I think they still can be succeptible as even after I hardened off my tomatoes, maybe not well enough, they did seem to get sun scalded once or twice. My greenhouse gets morning shade, just a result of available placement.

Also, you may have missed my keg suggestion as I double posted.

For the trailer I was thinking pretty basic wood frame with chicken wire across the top, and hoping to get some bicycle wheels from the local bike shop that have lost a spoke or 2 and going to be tossed out. Not strong enough to rely on for your body at speed, but should be good enough to wheel 10ft back and forth every day.

We do pull the plants out when one of us has a day off and it's nice , but it's a lot to deal with on work days.

I did see your suggestion about filling the kegs, and I was considering something like that but didn't think of the grommets. Definitely a good option.

You can buy big plastic 32 gal garbage cans with snap on lids for cheap. The black ones will even absorb more heat from the sun during the day.

That is another good idea, but cheap is not free haha. Also it bothers me that we throw so many of these in the trash, if I can find another use for them I'd like to.