uh oh. original gravity WAY higher than i anticipated.

[beanbagz1]

ok, so i made up a recipe.. i thought it looked pretty good. this is what it looks like. i will tell you more in just a moment.

Extract/fermentables-

.5#agave nectar
.5#corn sugar
2#light lme
2#wheat lme

Grains-

3#belgian pilsner
2.5#wheat malt
1#american vienna

Hops/additions-

.75oz centennial (60mins)
.25oz centennial (15mins)
1oz chinook (10mins)
1oz saaz (10mins)
1oz chinook (5mins)
1oz centennial (dry hop)
1oz saaz (dry hop)
1lb lemongrass cut up (dropped at flameout to steep)

stuff i am working with-

3.5 gallon boil in 5 gallon pot.
2.5 gallons of cold water added to wart to end up with a 5 gallon batch after boiloff.
8 gallon fermenting bucket
5 gallon secondary.


ok. so i made this recipe up, and intended for it to come out more along the lines of a belgian wheat pale, northwest, hoppy, citrusy, tasty warm weather kinda drink. i used one of the calculators online and entered that i would do a mini mash of the grains in a bag at 60m somewhere between 153 and 155 degrees. i then sparged the grains for an additional 5 minutes in 1 liter of 170 degree water. this told me that my approximate og would be somewhere around 1.053-1.055 with a final gravity of 1.013-1.015 that would leave me around 5.5%abv. went on with my hop schedule, and added all of the fermentables at 15mins left in the boil. lemongrass at flameout... SMELLS DELICIOUS.

my original gravity ended up being 1.070 after i had cooled the wort and got it into the fermenter. i dont know how that that happened... do you guys have any idea?

i used wlp 029 german ale/kolsch yeast in a vile. the max that yeast says it can handle is 1.070. i pitched the yeast while wort was at 72f. put into room which is at about 65-66f. still at around 70 in the wort but no action being seen yet in the airlock after 12 hours.



do you think the yeast will be able to do its job?

what do you think of the recipe?

do you know why my OG ended up being so far from what i had anticipated?

is it possible for a drink that starts at 1.070 to go all the way to the suspected FG? which is 1.014-1.016... wouldnt that leave my beer at nearly 8%?

is there any way that this is going to be the drinkable refreshing beverage i wanted it to be?

PLEASE assist me. i have only done a few batches but i had to try my hand at throwing a recipe together.

 

[TyTanium]

Top off water wasn't mixed all the way. Did you take a reading before adding the topoff water? I'd be willing to bet your actual OG was pretty close to your target.

 

[cheezydemon3]

(see below)

 

[cheezydemon3]

ok, so i made up a recipe.. i thought it looked pretty good. this is what it looks like. i will tell you more in just a moment.

Extract/fermentables-

.5#agave nectar
.5#corn sugar
2#light lme
2#wheat lme

Grains-

3#belgian pilsner
2.5#wheat malt
1#american vienna

Hops/additions-

.75oz centennial (60mins)
.25oz centennial (15mins)
1oz chinook (10mins)
1oz saaz (10mins)
1oz chinook (5mins)
1oz centennial (dry hop)
1oz saaz (dry hop)
1lb lemongrass cut up (dropped at flameout to steep)

stuff i am working with-

3.5 gallon boil in 5 gallon pot.
2.5 gallons of cold water added to wart to end up with a 5 gallon batch after boiloff.
8 gallon fermenting bucket
5 gallon secondary.


ok. so i made this recipe up, and intended for it to come out more along the lines of a belgian wheat pale, northwest, hoppy, citrusy, tasty warm weather kinda drink. i used one of the calculators online and entered that i would do a mini mash of the grains in a bag at 60m somewhere between 153 and 155 degrees. i then sparged the grains for an additional 5 minutes in 1 liter of 170 degree water. this told me that my approximate og would be somewhere around 1.053-1.055 with a final gravity of 1.013-1.015 that would leave me around 5.5%abv. went on with my hop schedule, and added all of the fermentables at 15mins left in the boil. lemongrass at flameout... SMELLS DELICIOUS.

my original gravity ended up being 1.070 after i had cooled the wort and got it into the fermenter. i dont know how that that happened... do you guys have any idea?

i used wlp 029 german ale/kolsch yeast in a vile. the max that yeast says it can handle is 1.070. i pitched the yeast while wort was at 72f. put into room which is at about 65-66f. still at around 70 in the wort but no action being seen yet in the airlock after 12 hours.



do you think the yeast will be able to do its job?

what do you think of the recipe?

do you know why my OG ended up being so far from what i had anticipated?

is it possible for a drink that starts at 1.070 to go all the way to the suspected FG? which is 1.014-1.016... wouldnt that leave my beer at nearly 8%?

is there any way that this is going to be the drinkable refreshing beverage i wanted it to be?

PLEASE assist me. i have only done a few batches but i had to try my hand at throwing a recipe together.

yes

 

[beanbagz1]

Top off water wasn't mixed all the way. Did you take a reading before adding the topoff water? I'd be willing to bet your actual OG was pretty close to your target.

i am not so sure about that.. i shook it up in the bucket with the cold water for a few minutes after i added it.. the wort ended up looking very thick and smelt unbelievably sweet/wheat/lemon. i sure hope you are right..

 

[kmos]

Top off water wasn't mixed all the way. Did you take a reading before adding the topoff water? I'd be willing to bet your actual OG was pretty close to your target.

+1 Let it ferment as usual and take a gravity reading in a couple days. You will probably be close to where you want to be.

 

[RUNningonbrew]

Yeast should still work you may just end up with a higher fg than expected and a sweeter beer

 

[beanbagz1]

yes

yes?? to what?

 

[beanbagz1]

Yeast should still work you may just end up with a higher fg than expected and a sweeter beer

i hope it is not too sweet. what final gravity would i want to shoot for if i wanted less sweet/ more dry..?

 

[beanbagz1]

i am not so sure about that.. i shook it up in the bucket with the cold water for a few minutes after i added it.. the wort ended up looking very thick and smelt unbelievably sweet/wheat/lemon. i sure hope you are right..

i should have taken the og of the wort before i added the 2.5gal of topoff water? wouldnt that number be crazy high? i started with 3.5 and ended up with 2.5 gallons after boiloff

 

[RUNningonbrew]

Well anything closer to 1.020 will be sweeter, closer to 1.010 will be more dry

 

[TyTanium]

i should have taken the og of the wort before i added the 2.5gal of topoff water? wouldnt that number be crazy high? i started with 3.5 and ended up with 2.5 gallons after boiloff

Yes, it'd be crazy high, but it'd tell you if your post-dilution number was off.

Say you measured 1.100 pre top-off

2.5g at 1.100 + 2.5 gallons water at 1.000
2.5 x 100 + 2.5*0 / 5 gallons = 50

So you'd expect a reading of 1.050. If you actually measured 1.070, it's a pretty good bet it wasn't mixed well. This is extremely common.

 

[beanbagz1]

Yes, it'd be crazy high, but it'd tell you if your post-dilution number was off.

Say you measured 1.100 pre top-off

2.5g at 1.100 + 2.5 gallons water at 1.000
2.5 x 100 + 2.5*0 / 5 gallons = 50

So you'd expect a reading of 1.050. If you actually measured 1.070, it's a pretty good bet it wasn't mixed well. This is extremely common.

i hope to goodness you are right my friend, sounds reasonable. though my friend was telling me he had never seen someone work up and shake there wort as much as i had on this one.. i wanted to make sure it was "well aerated" as i have never worked with yeast from a vile before so i shook the wort ferociously hoping that would help the yeast get kickstarted.

 

[abarhan]

Mix the top off water and take a reading with top off water to dilute to attempted OG. The sample you took with out the water is concentrated. You also have a bunch of sugar on top of grains. I would go with more grain less sugar unless you are doing a Belgium of some sort. The beer will probably be fine as is. If you want a drier beer you could rack to secondary after two weeks and re pitch with a basic ale yeast to bring it down even more.

 

[TyTanium]

If you want a drier beer you could rack to secondary after two weeks and re pitch with a basic ale yeast to bring it down even more.

Disagree.

...doing a Belgium of some sort.

Belgian. Belgium is the country; Belgian is the descriptor.

The beer will probably be fine as is.

Agree.

 

[beanbagz1]

Disagree.


Belgian. Belgium is the country; Belgian is the descriptor.



Agree.

thankyou brother.

 

[cheezydemon3]

do you think the yeast will be able to do its job?


do you know why my OG ended up being so far from what i had anticipated?

is it possible for a drink that starts at 1.070 to go all the way to the suspected FG? which is 1.014-1.016... wouldnt that leave my beer at nearly 8%?

is there any way that this is going to be the drinkable refreshing beverage i wanted it to be?

yesyesyesyesyesyes.....

 

[beanbagz1]

airlock is now actively bubbling after around 18-20hours. i can only hope i didnt mix the batch properly!

 

[TyTanium]

RELAX. Start working on your next batch and forget about this one for a while.

 

[beanbagz1]

RELAX. Start working on your next batch and forget about this one for a while.

lol, you got it! hmmm.. ipa it is.

 

[Jayhem]

That's a lot of fermentables especially with over 4 lbs of mini-mash grains which may have been close to 80% extraction. Agave syrup, honey and corn sugar add a lot to the OG.

 

[dbhokie]

I just ran your ingredients through my spreadsheet, I gave Agave a 1.039 specific gravity...kind of an average from a few brix ratings I found...

Nonetheless the profile predicted with 75% Mash efficiency is as follows:

1.0975 PreBoil SG (3.5 gallons) (Corrected for saccharide Additions (EG: DME, Agave, Dextrose)
1.06825 Original Gravity (5 gal)
1.0234 Final Gravity Prediction (Based on 76 % Yeast Attenuation, this strain attenuates 72-78)
Predicted ABV: 5.96%
Predicted IBUS: 53.4763 (My calculations tend to vary just a little bit from other Brew programs on IBU's, there are a couple different methods for calculation, but most round at 2 places, I don't round if possible, IBUS are affected by your kettle efficiency as well. The SG and other things are taken into account in a Bigness and BTF factor, in order to compensate)

You will end up with a heavier bodied, sweeter beer, than perhaps you planned on, but probably quite delicious.

 

[beanbagz1]

I just ran your ingredients through my spreadsheet, I gave Agave a 1.039 specific gravity...kind of an average from a few brix ratings I found...

Nonetheless the profile predicted with 75% Mash efficiency is as follows:

1.0975 PreBoil SG (3.5 gallons)
1.06825 Original Gravity (5 gal)
1.0234 Final Gravity Prediction (Based on 76 % Yeast Attenuation, this strain attenuates 72-78)
Predicted ABV: 5.96%
Predicted IBUS: 53.4763 (My calculations tend to vary just a little bit from other Brew programs on IBU's, there are a couple different methods for calculation, but most round at 2 places, I don't round if possible, IBUS are affected by your kettle efficiency as well. The SG and other things are taken into account in a Bigness and BTF factor, in order to compensate)

You will end up with a heavier bodied, sweeter beer, than perhaps you planned on, but probably quite delicious.

well shucks, i guess that is what i get for putting my recipe into play before i properly researched my mash efficiency. the site i plugged mine into said it would be closer to 40% efficiency. that makes perfect sense. i hope it is not too intensely sweet, i was really hoping for a dryer warm weather beer. i guess we will have to see.

 

[beanbagz1]

I just ran your ingredients through my spreadsheet, I gave Agave a 1.039 specific gravity...kind of an average from a few brix ratings I found...

Nonetheless the profile predicted with 75% Mash efficiency is as follows:

1.0975 PreBoil SG (3.5 gallons) (Corrected for saccharide Additions (EG: DME, Agave, Dextrose)
1.06825 Original Gravity (5 gal)
1.0234 Final Gravity Prediction (Based on 76 % Yeast Attenuation, this strain attenuates 72-78)
Predicted ABV: 5.96%
Predicted IBUS: 53.4763 (My calculations tend to vary just a little bit from other Brew programs on IBU's, there are a couple different methods for calculation, but most round at 2 places, I don't round if possible, IBUS are affected by your kettle efficiency as well. The SG and other things are taken into account in a Bigness and BTF factor, in order to compensate)

You will end up with a heavier bodied, sweeter beer, than perhaps you planned on, but probably quite delicious.

so because my og was higher that also will make the IBU's higher???

 

[abarhan]

Wow got roughed up by the board for a misspelling. Sorry guys the "m" and "n" are pretty close on the keyboard. That's my excuse and I'm sticking to it!

As for pitching in the secondary I have had good results with bringing a high FG beer down to where I wanted it. Why the disagree?

~Moving to Belgian to drink the Belgiums~

 

[beanbagz1]

could i just add another gallon of water to the wort now after almost two days in the fermenting bucket? to lower og? i have a 6 gallon carboy i could use for secondary if something like that works...

 

[beanbagz1]

Wow got roughed up by the board for a misspelling. Sorry guys the "m" and "n" are pretty close on the keyboard. That's my excuse and I'm sticking to it!

As for pitching in the secondary I have had good results with bringing a high FG beer down to where I wanted it. Why the disagree?

~Moving to Belgian to drink the Belgiums~

would i want to add another vile of the same type yeast then?

 

[dbhokie]

so because my og was higher that also will make the IBU's higher???

IBUS are very complex to estimate. Here are the equations basically:

Bigness Factor (Takes into account SG)
(1.65*.000125^(PreBoilSG-1)

BTF (Take into account Kettle, and Boil Time)
=(1-(2.71828^(-0.04*BoilTime)))/(Kettle denominator, Standard 4.15)

Hop Utilization (Basic Utilization of the Hop)

Bigness*BTF

AAU (Alpha Acid Units, takes into account boil time and AA of hops)

Boil Time*(Alpha Acid*100)


IBUS = AAU*Utilization*75/BatchVolume

By the way I had other hops in my chart earlier, your estimated IBUs with my program is 48.1846

As you can see though the SG of the boil, will matter in IBU extraction.

Of course you have a lot of flavor and aroma hops, so it should taste quite hoppy, just not really bitter.

 

[beanbagz1]

IBUS are very complex to estimate. Here are the equations basically:

Bigness Factor (Takes into account SG)
(1.65*.000125^(PreBoilSG-1)

BTF (Take into account Kettle, and Boil Time)
=(1-(2.71828^(-0.04*BoilTime)))/(Kettle denominator, Standard 4.15)

Hop Utilization (Basic Utilization of the Hop)

Bigness*BTF

AAU (Alpha Acid Units, takes into account boil time and AA of hops)

Boil Time*(Alpha Acid*100)


IBUS = AAU*Utilization*75/BatchVolume

By the way I had other hops in my chart earlier, your estimated IBUs with my program is 48.1846

As you can see though the SG of the boil, will matter in IBU extraction.

Of course you have a lot of flavor and aroma hops, so it should taste quite hoppy, just not really bitter.

perfect, beautiful. i never thought the most research i would be doing in my life would pertain to beer. haha.

 

[dbhokie]

would i want to add another vile of the same type yeast then?

Your main concern there would be if you had underpitched on your yeast. Your yeast attenuation really has more to do with how "low" it will go. No yeast is going to ferment 100%, this one does roughly 76%, so the idea is that if your total possible alcohol by volume with 100% efficiency is x. You will likely get .76x or around there (in a very generalized way of explaining).

You could pour in more water, and it technically would probably bring you down to about what you want, but you are best off with such things using a pitching calculator such as Malty or Jamil's. you can find them online. To make sure you pitch enough. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it, the beer will be a bit sweeter and fuller bodied. I'd let it run its course and chalk it up to a learning experience. Besides, it will probably still taste delicious. Who cares if it fits the exact "style" you may have been going for. Styles don't matter, what's delicious to you does.

 

[beanbagz1]

Your main concern there would be if you had underpitched on your yeast. Your yeast attenuation really has more to do with how "low" it will go. No yeast is going to ferment 100%, this one does roughly 76%, so the idea is that if your total possible alcohol by volume with 100% efficiency is x. You will likely get .76x or around there (in a very generalized way of explaining).

You could pour in more water, and it technically would probably bring you down to about what you want, but you are best off with such things using a pitching calculator such as Malty or Jamil's. you can find them online. To make sure you pitch enough. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it, the beer will be a bit sweeter and fuller bodied. I'd let it run its course and chalk it up to a learning experience. Besides, it will probably still taste delicious. Who cares if it fits the exact "style" you may have been going for. Styles don't matter, what's delicious to you does.

that is the problem, a heavy sweet beer doesnt exactly sound delicious to me..

 

[dbhokie]

I am good with calculations, someone else here would be better to answer what would be best to do to get your end desired product as they have more experience than me.

Once again I was hasty entering in some of the things you had marked.

With 5 gallons your finish should be around 1.0164 or so (I gave you a predicted finish based on your PreBoil SG, which didn't account for the tap water addition. I have corrected the mistake.)

With 6 gallons (1 gallon water added) it would (at least at time of post-boil-pre-ferm adjust your OG to 1.0569, and your finish to 1.01365

Honestly a finish at 1.0164 will not be incredibly sweet, just perhaps a bit sweeter, and bit heavier bodied. You aren't looking at a massively full bodied REALLY sweet beer.

However all of this doesn't account for pitching variables (amount of yeast you used vs proper pitching rate) etc.

Click here to see the calculations (I think I have them all corrected now). You can enter in more information to get more etc.

As you change your Batch Volume, you can see the change reflected in the OG predictions, FG predictions, and ABV predictions. If you change your batch volume any, then your OG will actually be more like what the predicted one would render on here. (EG: instead of a 1.07 OG, with 1 gallon added for calculation purposes your OG would be more like 1.0569)

 

[beanbagz1]

I am good with calculations, someone else here would be better to answer what would be best to do to get your end desired product as they have more experience than me.

Once again I was hasty entering in some of the things you had marked.

With 5 gallons your finish should be around 1.0164 or so (I gave you a predicted finish based on your PreBoil SG, which didn't account for the tap water addition. I have corrected the mistake.)

With 6 gallons (1 gallon water added) it would (at least at time of post-boil-pre-ferm adjust your OG to 1.0569, and your finish to 1.01365

Honestly a finish at 1.0164 will not be incredibly sweet, just perhaps a bit sweeter, and bit heavier bodied. You aren't looking at a massively full bodied REALLY sweet beer.

However all of this doesn't account for pitching variables (amount of yeast you used vs proper pitching rate) etc.

Click here to see the calculations (I think I have them all corrected now). You can enter in more information to get more etc.

As you change your Batch Volume, you can see the change reflected in the OG predictions, FG predictions, and ABV predictions. If you change your batch volume any, then your OG will actually be more like what the predicted one would render on here. (EG: instead of a 1.07 OG, with 1 gallon added for calculation purposes your OG would be more like 1.0569)

i actually used liquid malt extracts, not dry. would that change those numbers significantly? i do appreciate you helping with this. i used the liquid yeast white laps wlp029. i sure dont know anymore lol. i took the vile out about 5 hours before pitching, was up to room temperature and had been rolling it gently on the counter every time i walked by during the brewing process. dropped yeast at 72f

 

[dbhokie]

The grains are in a drop down, just change the light Dry extract, to Pale liquid extract, and the wheat to wheat liquid extract. It will change the appropriate values for you. Only type or change information in grey squares, all white squares have calculations, and if you change something in them, it will erase the calculations, as this sheet I uploaded wasn't protected.

 

[beanbagz1]

The grains are in a drop down, just change the light Dry extract, to Pale liquid extract, and the wheat to wheat liquid extract. It will change the appropriate values for you. Only type or change information in grey squares, all white squares have calculations, and if you change something in them, it will erase the calculations, as this sheet I uploaded wasn't protected.

for some reason it is not letting me make the changes.

 

[dbhokie]

for some reason it is not letting me make the changes.

It should, they are drop down boxes, you can't type in them, you have to click the arrow beside and select your grain. There is a grain table in another worksheet that has Sgs listed and such, the rest of the information is then looked up on that table and entered automatically.

You can click here, where I changed the grains to see.

My guess is that your final assuming a decent yeast pitch will end up between 1.017 and 1.018, so close to 1.02

RDWAHAHB

 

[abarhan]

I would just drink it the way it is. Yeast starter and Mr. Malty next time will help with under pitching. Pitching in your secondary in my experience will help bring it down if its under pitched but make sure you sanitize everything.

We could all go back and forth all day, everyone has a different process and way of doing it. Keep a log of what you did with this beer and while you are drinking it come up with things you want to do different (yeast starter, oxygen, more grain,less sugar, calculated pitch rate). Brewing is a consistent learning process and while a lot can be learned on here the best way is figuring out what works for you. There is no right and wrong for most things in brewing just different ways of coming to a good beer. Cheers

 

[dbhokie]

I would just drink it the way it is. Yeast starter and Mr. Malty next time will help with under pitching. Pitching in your secondary in my experience will help bring it down if its under pitched but make sure you sanitize everything.

We could all go back and forth all day, everyone has a different process and way of doing it. Keep a log of what you did with this beer and while you are drinking it come up with things you want to do different (yeast starter, oxygen, more grain,less sugar, calculated pitch rate). Brewing is a consistent learning process and while a lot can be learned on here the best way is figuring out what works for you. There is no right and wrong for most things in brewing just different ways of coming to a good beer. Cheers

-This . That is why I devised a spreadsheet to keep track of my brews, it helps me keep very extensive notes, so that I can see where I went wrong, (hopefully), or try to repeat and improve. The more notes you take the better you learn about your own process, which is different than anyone elses to a degree.

Here is a blank one: here

 

[beanbagz1]

-This . That is why I devised a spreadsheet to keep track of my brews, it helps me keep very extensive notes, so that I can see where I went wrong, (hopefully), or try to repeat and improve. The more notes you take the better you learn about your own process, which is different than anyone elses to a degree.

Here is a blank one: here

thankyou much fellas.

 

[beanbagz1]

i have done something that many people had said not to do here.. i just couldnt bring myself to drinking something that might end up so sweet. i added 1/2 gallon of water. i boiled just over a half of a gallon of bottled distilled water with the peels of two oranges, and filled two quart jars. capped and lid for jars then boiled an additional 20 mins. jars now sealed, cooled to 74f. added to wort on day 3. this is entirely experimental as i figured i wouldnt be happy with the outcome of the beer anyhow. do you think the orange peel will brighten up anything? i was just hoping to make sure that if i was in fact "watering down" the beer, that i would at least be infusing a little more flavor while doing so to compensate. it has been fermenting for 5 days now.. in around another 5 i wiill be transfering to a 6 gallon secondary with 1ozCentennial/1ozSaaz hops for a week.YEA>