True Brew recipe doesn't add up.

[Lurioso]

Hi!

I found a recipe called Renaissance Fair Sweet Mead in the book True Brews and it states:

Target OG: 1.140 - 1.145
Target FG: 1.020 - 1.025
Target ABV: 19%

I can't really get my head around this. The listed OG and FG doesn't give 19% ABV.

It also calls for "sweet mead yeast" but is there a sweet mead yeast that can tolerate those alcohol levels?

 

[slym2none]

125 gravity points clocks in at 16.4% ABV.

Hmm...

 

[Lurioso]

Yeah, and that's what's bothering me. A missprint, perhaps? A secret mead method I don't know about? Voodoo?

 

[Zymomancer]

Brewing 1.140 OG to 1.000 FG will give you 19% ABV, so they probably forgot to account for the higher FG in the ABV calculation. Simple mistake.

 

[bernardsmith]

Hi!

I found a recipe called Renaissance Fair Sweet Mead in the book True Brews and it states:

Target OG: 1.140 - 1.145
Target FG: 1.020 - 1.025
Target ABV: 19%

I can't really get my head around this. The listed OG and FG doesn't give 19% ABV.

It also calls for "sweet mead yeast" but is there a sweet mead yeast that can tolerate those alcohol levels?

Most wine yeasts can tolerate 16% ABV without blinking. WLP720 spec sheet suggests that it can tolerate 15% which presumably means that it can go another 2 or 3 % without much effort. 4184 is spec'ed for 11% so it will likely reach 13% or thereabouts before keeling over. But that said, a mead of 19% (I am assuming that the idea is to ferment the honey dry and then backsweeten) seems a little bizarre... Cannot see that anyone would have been able to ferment a mead to that level during the Renaissance (1300 - 1700) - Would they not have used either ale yeasts or wild yeast?

 

[SerifSansSerif]

Could also be based on a different ABV calculation....

see this calculator:
http://www.brewersfriend.com/abv-calculator/

If you look at the selectors, it has a way of calculating by alternate means. Not sure why of what difference, but as a matter of screwing around with it a while back, it gave a higher ABV using alternate means.

Didn't plug in the numbers to check, but it's another rationale.

(just did. 1.45-1.025 by alternate means gave me 18.71% Again, not sure if this explains it away, but.... )

Cannot see that anyone would have been able to ferment a mead to that level during the Renaissance (1300 - 1700) - Would they not have used either ale yeasts or wild yeast?

Actually, they probably would have used wild yeast. Theoretically it's possible. mix the honey with water, leave open to the air. Probably 4-5 parts water to 1 part honey (was reading the Art of Fermentation, and the guy does some pretty..... For lack of a better word, he's a bit scary, letting molds develop on things, suggesting dumpster diving for veggies to ferment.. Nevertheless, he knows his ****.... anyway, he uses wild yeasts and open ferments with a mixture of water to honey like that).

Even though the above source seems to not use anything for nutrition, I could even see a bit of bread tossed in for NPK or some raisins (it's the only way I can see people keeping around the idea of using god awful raisins in a brew {and if you like raisins, sorry, it's personal preference, and I hate them}) or perhaps a bit of bread, thinking what allowed the bread to ferment would ferment the alcohol. (which makes more sense.. Or even a bit of bread dough, uncooked, which would be also introducing wild strains of Saccharomyces ceverisae, which probably hadn't truly been truly "domesticated" into strains like we have today into wine, ale, and bread yeasts, each with their set purpose.)

It's not too hard to see that as one ferments honey water, the next obvious step is to add more honey to get a stronger brew. It's what every brewer I've seen attempts when they first start brewing.

Every cider brewer attempts jacking, every mead maker probably stumbles upon step feeding.

 

[bernardsmith]

But I don't know that wild yeasts will be able to cope with such a high sugar concentration (1.140 is about 3.5 lbs of honey to make each gallon ) or would be able to cope with anything close to 19% ABV ... Never tried that myself...
And .. I suspect that you are right - they would very likely have added bread (acting as nutrient). I have a very old book of wine and beer and cider recipes that often suggests the addition of a slice of bread - or grain (so perhaps the wine maker was using lactofermentation rather than yeast)

 

[SerifSansSerif]

But I don't know that wild yeasts will be able to cope with such a high sugar concentration (1.140 is about 3.5 lbs of honey to make each gallon ) or would be able to cope with anything close to 19% ABV ... Never tried that myself...
And .. I suspect that you are right - they would very likely have added bread (acting as nutrient). I have a very old book of wine and beer and cider recipes that often suggests the addition of a slice of bread - or grain (so perhaps the wine maker was using lactofermentation rather than yeast)

True, but two points:

1. Most yeast varieties seem to be able to brew up to 14-16% easily. and I think this kinda sits with what I was reading in the book.

Another option might also have been to use old grape skins from fermenting wine, which does seem to attract higher ABV yeasts. Maybe even that's where the raisins came from.

2. yeast breeds fast, and multiple generations can result in mere hours. It's not too hard to believe that multiple strains of S. Ceverisae might be present in a wild fermentation, and by adding more honey, you might even be able to coax out some that are stronger than the rest.

So if your wild yeast can ferment to 15%, and you step feed and the strongest survive, theoretically, you might be able to coax it up to 18-19%.

Also, I can't remember when the monks discovered Champagne, but that is at least 18% (again, an easy 18%. Some have gotten it up to 23%)

A sweet mead makes more sense in this context too, since you'd be step feeding till you absolutely, beyond a doubt, have exhausted all possible fermentation out of your yeast, and it stays a bit sweet from the unfermented honey.

Then again, they could also have altered the recipe, hoping for much that scenario, and based it on a sweet mead yeast that they kind figured would be what people would buy, and adjusted the recipe among other things for modern tastes and convenience. I rarely trust rennaissance recreations.

My example above, again, is just a thought experiment on how it might be possible.

 

[bernardsmith]

All good points - except I suspect that raisins were used as nutrient simply because wine grapes (AKA fully hydrated raisins) are both packed with sugar and are nutrient rich for yeast... In other words, a stalled fermentation is quite rare with grapes AND the dust covering grapes is wild yeast...so such raisins could either have provided the yeast ... or if a more aggressive strain of yeast was pitched those wild yeasts could have provided even more nutrients for the inoculated yeast. Commercially made raisins today are often covered in preservatives (to kill any yeast and mold) and are often coated in oil to inhibit oxidation.. so I am not entirely convinced that adding "raisins" is always such a great idea...
But in those locales where wine was routinely made, the wild yeasts in the area would have evolved in relation to those wine makers' activities... In urban settings or rural settings here in the USA where wine making has not been as common or frequent the wild yeasts are far less likely to have been shaped by wine making... (much like sour dough yeasts in my upstate NY town won't taste like San Fransisco sour dough)...