True Brew All Malt Amber

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seapro22

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Maybe someone can give some advice--I brewed a true brew all malt amber, my first attempt at home brewing, on 11-7-10. I racked it to a secondary on 11-14-10. The beer settled nicely and was clear seemed to be reddish amber in color. Everything seemed to be progressing nicely. Fast forward to this past weekend 12-3-10. The beer had remained the same for 3 weeks in secondary and I was going to bottle the beer along with another batch. The amber had become cloudy overnight from friday to saturday and there was increased activity in the fermentation lock. The beer is not quite as red as it was. I now have foam which I assume means the beer is fermenting again. My question is do I let it run this course? Will I have to add yeast to it again when I bottle? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.:confused:
 

BigB

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I am curious if you did anything on Thursday or Friday? Did you move anything? Stir it? Is the room temp warmer? Did you stick anything in it like a wine thief?

Letting it run its course is difficult to say... depends on what is really the cause. Adding more yeast for bottle conditioning? No, not after only 4 weeks.
 

birvine

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I may be wrong, but you may want to use the hydrometer over the next few days to see if the FG has been reached and is steady.
 
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seapro22

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The brew seems to be clearing up. I have just left it alone this week. I am going to assume it was just fermentation activity in secondary.
 
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seapro22

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Beer cleared up and bottled today. Taste very bitter though. Will this subside with conditioning? Thanks for your thoughts.
 

VTBrewer

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Taste very bitter though. .

That's hard to answer without knowing the recipe. Bitterness will normally subside as it conditions, which can be viewed as a good or bad thing. Hop heads will tell you to drink an IPA as soon as it carbs to enjoy the bitterness.

It strikes me as odd though that you had a second fermentation 3 weeks into the process. While it may *seem* logical to have one in the secondary, its a pooly named apparatus and no fermentation should really take place there. That's why someone asked if you'd moved it, disturbed it etc and another person was thinking infection.

If it's just bitter but tastes like beer you're most likely good, and yes it should subside. If some nasties got in there it may not.
 

stumpwater

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I'm a greenhorn brewer also and brewed the same kit as you on Dec.1.Just botteled it and it's pretty bitter also.The lme was hopped and it came with 1 oz. of cascade that i added after the extract quit foaming then let it boil for 30 min.Tasted purdy good, i drank about 8 oz.lol Maybe just the hops.
 

JRems

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I made this kit a couple months ago. It took 2 months in the keg before the bitterness went down and was really good. Unfortunately I had already drank 3/4 of it by then. Just let it sit in tge keg or bottles for a couple months and you will be much happier.
 

Buck33

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i just bottled this today and it was super bitter, im hoping it mellows out because this is my first attempt at brewing
 

butler1244

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i just bottled this today and it was super bitter, im hoping it mellows out because this is my first attempt at brewing
I bottled this on Sunday and it was bitter. I've heard from several others that the bitterness goes away after bottle conditioning a few weeks
 

Justibone

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Bitterness takes a very long time to go away. Hop aroma, not so long, but bitterness... yes, a long time. Sorry!

If you really can't stand the bitterness you can blend it with another beer, maybe a sweet stout, to make black and tans or something.
 

jimlin

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Did you guys follow the recipe and still find it bitter? I just brewed this myself (Sat), but I added a few things: steeped some dark crystal malt (135L), brought that to a boil adding the 2 pounds of light dried extract (kit provided), half the hopped amber LME (saved the other half for flameout), additional .5 lb of Briess Amber DME, added the 1 oz of First Gold hops (kit provided) for 30 minutes, then an additiona oz of Centennial hops with 7 minutes left. After flameout I poured in the remainder of the LME and cooled in an ice bath in the sink.

Wasn't expected an Amber kit to be all that bitter, and after adding the dark crystal and .5 lb of amber DME, I figured the additional Centennial would help balance it out and give a little added hop flavor/aroma.
 

jimlin

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Ugh... just subscribed to the Brew Strong podcast, and found one in which Jamil and Palmer discuss brewing with kits. Basically they both said DON'T boil the HME. Pretty sure the True Brew kit instructions indicated to add the DME and liquid HME to the boil. I saved half the liquid HME for flameout, but half was in the boil. Not looking forward to the off flavors this could have added. :(
 

Justibone

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Boiling extract shouldn't give off flavors, IMO. It can darken the beer and make it finish at a higher gravity, but I don't think you have anything to worry about.
 

jimlin

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Boiling extract shouldn't give off flavors, IMO. It can darken the beer and make it finish at a higher gravity, but I don't think you have anything to worry about.
Here's hoping. They were saying boiling hopped extract in particular wasn't a good idea. At least it was only half the can of hopped extract, and only maybe 20-30 minutes.
 

Justibone

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Oops, I missed that it was hopped extract. I don't have experience with hopped extract, since I haven't used it except for my very first batch ever. I did boil it, though, and it was fine.

Still, I don't think it's time to panic. Even they will tell you it's better to let a mistake ferment all the way, and it could still be quite a good beer. :)
 

Buck33

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I tried a on of my beers, They have been conditioning in bottles for 2 weeks, still very bitter, I had to pour half down the drain I couldn't finish. I'll try one more next week, if still bad I'll just forget about it for a month
 

unionrdr

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Well,they say you shouldn't boil hopped LME,since it supposedly destroys the hop profile of said LME. But I've read of a lot of folks boiling DME's to do hop additions. But,it's my thought that they were liquid wort when they were made. Already had a hot break,etc,before they were dried,or concentrated. So there shouldn't be a need to do it again,it's already been done. Just my thoughts...
 

Justibone

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If it's too bitter then the best solution is usually to mix it as a beer cocktail or some other use. Don't use it for beer bread, though... bitterness really comes through in beer bread.
 

jimlin

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Well,they say you shouldn't boil hopped LME,since it supposedly destroys the hop profile of said LME. But I've read of a lot of folks boiling DME's to do hop additions. But,it's my thought that they were liquid wort when they were made. Already had a hot break,etc,before they were dried,or concentrated. So there shouldn't be a need to do it again,it's already been done. Just my thoughts...
Exactly. That's what I've been getting from various forums and podcasts. Boil the DME to give the hops something to boil in other than just water, and then dump in the LME at flameout as it's already been through the whole process in manufacturing the LME.

http://www.beersmith.com/blog/2008/02/20/better-beer-with-late-malt-extract-additions/
 

jimlin

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Bottled the true brew amber today after two weeks in the primary. Not high gravity by any means (OG of 1.044, FG 1.012). Krausen had completely fallen back in. Had lots of activity over the first few days, but little bubbling after that. The 135L caramel malt (steeping) definitely gave it a deep amber, almost brown ale color (LME was "amber", plus, in addition to the kit's 2lb of light DME, I added .5lb of Briess sparkling amber DME). DME boiled for maybe 35-40 minutes, and the LME was added late, which tends to produce a darker color than a full boil.

Smelled relatively sweet, so I'l have to see how it conditions out.
 

unionrdr

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Bottled the true brew amber today after two weeks in the primary. Not high gravity by any means (OG of 1.044, FG 1.012). Krausen had completely fallen back in. Had lots of activity over the first few days, but little bubbling after that. The 135L caramel malt (steeping) definitely gave it a deep amber, almost brown ale color (LME was "amber", plus, in addition to the kit's 2lb of light DME, I added .5lb of Briess sparkling amber DME). DME boiled for maybe 35-40 minutes, and the LME was added late, which tends to produce a darker color than a full boil.

Smelled relatively sweet, so I'l have to see how it conditions out.
Wow. De ja vue,man. I made my "pale ale" with a can of Cooper's OS lager LME,3lbs of munton's plain extra light SDME,& 15min boil for 1oz of Kent Golding. After 6 days in primary,I got an amber/coppery light brown color. The light brown krausen was up to the lid till yesterday or so. Now down to about 1/2",& lighter krausen color. (tan-ish). And mine started with an OG of 1.044 as well. I'm gunna take an FG in 1-3 days just to see where mine is at. Wild that it reads as if we're getting similar results. Looks like I may wind up with something like an amber ale,salvator doppel bock (which we've been drinking lately,an ale as well),or...maybe an English ale,since it has that slightly toasty/buiscuty smell with the Kent Golding under that. Can't wait to see how it is after the 1oz Willamette dry hop. Buckinator anyone? Or an ami maibock? lolz...
 

jimlin

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uniondr, so your Coopers LME was hopped? I assume so if you only needed the 15 min boil for the Kent Golding. Just like my Muntons/True Brew amber kit. Surprised that yours has any amber color given the lager LME and extra light DME. I expected mine considering it was an amber kit and I added more darkening ingredients.
 

unionrdr

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uniondr, so your Coopers LME was hopped? I assume so if you only needed the 15 min boil for the Kent Golding. Just like my Muntons/True Brew amber kit. Surprised that yours has any amber color given the lager LME and extra light DME. I expected mine considering it was an amber kit and I added more darkening ingredients.
Yeah,weird,huh?! Only the Cooper's can was hopped. It usually gives a straw to light golden color. But,adding the unhoped (read "plain") extra light Munton's SDME Should've,to my reconning,just gave it a bit more golden color,lil more flavor,body,etc. Instead,it's more of a dark,but clear amber to coppery light brown. Not to mention,the wonderful slight toasty/biscuity smell with a nice melding of the KG hops. Since the Cooper's ale yeast produces some fruity esters,I thought the Kent Golding & Willamette hops would give that quality a bit more complexity. Kinda like the hop bitterness right at the end of a Paulaner Salvator Doppel Bock,being a late addition,& a dry hop. And the fact that both hops are low AAU,4.5% & 4.7% AAU's respectively.
 

jimlin

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How long was the DME boiling? I believe the longer it's in the boil, the lighter the resulting color, but late additions can lead to darker than intended color.
 

unionrdr

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After getting conflicting answers on whether or not to boil DME,I made a strong tea out of the Kent Golding in 1 1/4 gallons of water,then added the SDME,& LME. Maybe being late additions gave the darker color? Pleasant color,though. Seems to fit the aromas so far...
 

jimlin

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yeah, I find different opinions on just about ever question I have.

Listened to a Brew Strong podcast with Jamil and Palmer on brewing from kits, and I think they pretty much said LME can be added at the end, but DME should be added earlier in the boil if boiling hops too. I guess that while extracts don't need to be in full boils, the dark color is a result of late additions, so if brewing to a style, you need to take that into account. But if you don't really care about nailing a particular style's attributes, it doesn't matter. As long as it tastes good!
 

unionrdr

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yeah, I find different opinions on just about ever question I have.

Listened to a Brew Strong podcast with Jamil and Palmer on brewing from kits, and I think they pretty much said LME can be added at the end, but DME should be added earlier in the boil if boiling hops too. I guess that while extracts don't need to be in full boils, the dark color is a result of late additions, so if brewing to a style, you need to take that into account. But if you don't really care about nailing a particular style's attributes, it doesn't matter. As long as it tastes good!
LME's pretty much have to added at the end,especially if they're hopped. And,I saved the BJCP site for style guidelines. I was toying with 10A-American Pale Ale. It says appearance should be pale golden to deep amber. Looks like I'm right in there. Moderately large white to off white head with good retention. It's a tan color at the moment. Alright here. Generally quite clear,but a lil hop haze is ok. Looks like I may be ok here so far. It says it should be refreshing & hoppy,but with sufficient supporting malt. I doubled the malts with no added sugars to see how it'd go. should be fine here as well. But time will tell. I'm not out to conquer the beer world,but if it turns out great than I just might give it a go...:mug:
*PS-I just did a hydrometer test today. See my other thread "pale ale revisited" in extract brewing forum for the results/impressions as of now...
 

rented_mule73

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I added 1 cup of dark brown sugar as well as 8 ounces of unsulfered molasses.. let sit in primary for 16 days... now have racked it into secondary with 1 vanilla bean, 3/4 tbl spoon cinnamon, 1 tbl spoon of cloves and 3/4 tbl spoon of nutmeg. Was very cloudy going into secondary not red at all... gonna leave it in secondary for at least 3 weeks then bottle and forget until after thanksgiving......
 

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