this is gonna be a disaster

[Ster]

Brewed a stout from a kit tonight.

First time I used liquid yeast from a vile. I followed the instructions, and when I opened the vile it exploded all over my sink, not sure how much actually got in to the beer. I am guessing about 2/3 of the vile.

Also, had a bright idea. I froze pitchers of water in sterilized containers and dumped the frozen gallons in to the partial boil. Success, cooled to pitching temps in under 10 minutes.

So then go to the fermentation chamber to get the ice I didn't use, and notice black specs in it. My only explanation is dirty condensation froze and hailed in to the water, and is now in my beer. Should have used a lid.

This is bound to be my firest absolute disaster.

 

[ong]

It will probably turn out fine. Your fermentation might take a bit longer to start if you underpitched. The specks will probably not ruin anything -- we're just trying to skew the odds in the yeast's favor as much as we can, but mistakes happen.

 

[zzARzz]

I had a White Labs vial explode on me when I shook it and left it out for an hour before opening it. Won't make that mistake again, but plenty of the yeast made it into my starter. To ong's point it took an extra day for the starter to populate, so I wouldn't sweat it.

 

[BigFloyd]

Those lids are sometimes on pretty tight, making it tough to crack it open just a bit at first to let the pressure out.

Next batch, if you're going to use liquid yeast, you really ought to make a starter. One vial, even w/o any exploding into the sink, isn't enough cells for a 5 gallon batch of ale (and not even close for a lager). If making a starter doesn't appeal to you, the best bet is to use dry yeast.

 

[Ster]

48 hours later.. no airlock activity...

 

[Rhumbline]

I've had this twice with White Labs yeasts. Same explosive response when cracking the vial. Same lack of activity days later.

Both cases were the yeast had been overheated in shipping, I had to repitch. Good news is that both brews turned out well.

 

[duboman]

You need to slowly crack the lid like you would a 2 liter soda bottle to relieve the pressure, slowly!

As mentioned it is highly recommended to make starters for liquid yeast to ensure proper pitch rate

 

[k_mcarthur]

I used to pitch the white labs vials without a starter, and it would normally take 3-4 days before it really got going. Airlock activity notoriously makes beginners nervous about fermentation starting. Pop the lid a little and shine a light in there, if there is foam on top of the wort your good. If not wait two more days and check again, if none still then look into repitching. Definitely look into starters, you will know that you are pitching a large healthy population of yeast cells. Mine starts churning and bubbling in 6-12 hours.

 

[Ster]

No bubbling or foam. No drop in gravity. Will repitch I guess.

Have to learn how to make a starter. I usually just sprinkle in dry yeast.

 

[k_mcarthur]

No bubbling or foam. No drop in gravity. Will repitch I guess.

Have to learn how to make a starter. I usually just sprinkle in dry yeast.

Give it a couple more days, your yeasts are multiplying and soaking up the oxygen you introduced when you aerated. Since you pitched a third the required cells its gonna take more time. Have faith in the yeast! What temp are you fermenting at?

 

[Ster]

I was @ 65ish... I cranked it up to 70 to 74 range hoping to get em going.

 

[k_mcarthur]

I was @ 65ish... I cranked it up to 70 to 74 range hoping to get em going.

I'd get it back to 65 before it starts. Fermentation is exothermic meaning it creates its own heat, once it starts you will be battling up hill to cool it down.

 

[k_mcarthur]

Its bubbling away when you got home tonight isn't it? Have to trust in the yeast, brewers make wort and yeast makes beer.

 

[ballsy]

Stories like this are what keep me happy with my dry yeast...did a starter before w/ a re-pitch and you can't help but love just rehydrating and pitching some dry yeast. My time is too short now for messing with starters. Sorry to hear about your debacle!!

 

[k_mcarthur]

I hate to hear these stories also, I have only used liquid yeast and I love the variety. But I remember my first few batches thinking one little thing I did is keeping my yeast from doing what they are supposed to do. Given enough time your yeast will prevail. I have only had to repitch once in three years, it was lager which at day nine still didn't have krausen. I knew the bottle of yeast said it was two weeks out of date and my starter just didn't look right but I pitched anyway. Lesson learned.

 

[Ster]

You are correct.

Opened the chamber and took a whiff of that sweet smell of fermenting beer.

Airlock gurgling away.

I agree about dry yeast. I don't even hydrate. I sprinkle on and get activity within 12 hours, always reach FG within 2 weeks, and also get very clear beer.

I may be done with liquid yeast for everything except special strains.

 

[kombat]

I agree about dry yeast. I don't even hydrate. I sprinkle on

I don't want to start a pile-on, but you should always rehydrate your dry yeast. If you sprinkle it dry directly into your beer, you're reducing their viability by about 50%, meaning you're grossly underpitching.

If you refuse to rehydrate, then at least pitch two packets to ensure you're pitching enough cells.

 

[Ster]

What.. just pour in a cup of water? Let it sit for how long?

From my understanding, dry yeast has about 3 times the active cells as liquid yeast. So even if taking a 50% hit, I am still pitching 50% more than if I pitched liquid yeast...???

 

[kombat]

You rehydrate it in 10 times its weight of sterile water at around 80° F and let it proof for 15-30 minutes. So for a typical 11.5g packet of US-05, you'd rehydrate it in 115 mL of sterile water.

The cell density of dry yeast at packaging is around 6 billion cells per gram. So an 11.5 g packet contains around 69 billion cells, if properly rehydrated. If you sprinkle it directly in and reduce viability by 50%, you're only pitching 35 billion cells.

A 5 gallon batch of 1.050 ale wort would ideally require 200 billion cells. So by sprinkling a single pack in dry, you'd be pitching about 17.5% of the optimal cell count. Even rehydrating, you'd be pitching 35%. Fresh liquid yeast (as in, packaged yesterday) would contain about 100 billion cells, and would get you to 50% of the ideal cell count, which is why we make starters.

(My information on US-05 cell count comes directly from the data sheet on their website).

So if even a properly rehydrated packet is grossly underpitching, why does it still work? Quite simply, because yeast are tenacious little guys. They'll struggle and grow to the required colony size, but they'll be stressed in doing so, which can cause off-flavours and a delayed start to fermentation (providing an opportunity for contaminants to infect the wort). It will still work, it's just not ideal. Try pitching the recommended cell count and see if you notice a difference in lag time, fermentation vigor, and flavour of the resulting beer. If not, or if you don't really care, then feel free to ignore me. I'm just parroting what's already been researched and published countless times by professional brewers, yeast researchers, and the manufacturers themselves.

 

[Ster]

Wow.. Great info...

That's not what I thought because I've read many instructions that said "if you use liquid yeast, you need to pitch 2 viles."

The last BYO said both under and over pitching can cause off flavors.

I wish the yeast companies would simply make a single pack that was adequate for any OG under 1.060

 

[kombat]

That's not what I thought because I've read many instructions that said "if you use liquid yeast, you need to pitch 2 viles."

I'm not sure I understand. If each vial contains 100 billion cells, and a 5 gallon batch of 1.050 ale requires 200 billion cells, then 2 (100% viable) vials would be perfect, would it not?

Of course, our yeast is rarely perfectly fresh/viable, and starters have other benefits too (mainly ensuring yeast viability before wasting a batch of wort with dead yeast), but in theory, 2 vials should be sufficient.

The last BYO said both under and over pitching can cause off flavors.

I'd be interested in reading that. I'd always believed that underpitching was worse than overpitching. Underpitching results in stressed yeast as they struggle to reproduce. I would think overpitching should simply result in a more vigorous fermentation, which can be controlled by running the temperature slightly lower.

I wish the yeast companies would simply make a single pack that was adequate for any OG under 1.060

Where's the profit in that?

 

[Brewtah]

Wow.. Great info...

That's not what I thought because I've read many instructions that said "if you use liquid yeast, you need to pitch 2 viles."

The last BYO said both under and over pitching can cause off flavors.

I wish the yeast companies would simply make a single pack that was adequate for any OG under 1.060

But then we would only buy 1 packet instead of 2. The cost of packaging has got to account for a large pertentage of the cost of a packet of yeast, so add a little more yeast, increase the price a bit and everyone is happy.

 

[IslandLizard]

...The cell density of dry yeast at packaging is around 6 billion cells per gram. So an 11.5 g packet contains around 69 billion cells, if properly rehydrated. If you sprinkle it directly in and reduce viability by 50%, you're only pitching 35 billion cells.

A 5 gallon batch of 1.050 ale wort would ideally require 200 billion cells. So by sprinkling a single pack in dry, you'd be pitching about 17.5% of the optimal cell count. Even rehydrating, you'd be pitching 35%. Fresh liquid yeast (as in, packaged yesterday) would contain about 100 billion cells, and would get you to 50% of the ideal cell count, which is why we make starters.

(My information on US-05 cell count comes directly from the data sheet on their website).
...

I just double checked that spec sheet...

...and am surprised to see this declaration of such low cell count in their dry yeast. The consensus as far as I remember has been over 200 billion viable cells per 11.5 gram sachet. Mr. Malty also reports that amount. At only 69 billion, one packet of dry would be grossly underpitching. You'd need almost 3 dry packets to get the required 200 billion cells!

Now in real life I've always experienced good and fast fermentation from 1 packet of re-hydrated S-05 yeast, even if it was over 1 year old (freezer stored).

In comparison, a single fresh vial or smack pack has 100 billion cells--50% more than the alleged count in a 11.5 gr dry pack--and has never been sufficient. That's why we make starters.

I know these are minimum amounts they guarantee. But at the same time, are we being subtly manipulated to buy more dry yeast?

 

[Ster]

Update...

Yes fermentation started in a few days.

However I have been @ 1.025 for 9 days now.
Last time this happened I repitched with no results.

I went ahead and bottled tonight.
OG 1.058, FG 1.025

Approx 4% ABV.

Don't really have high hopes for this. Wanted a dry stout.

 

[ballsy]

Update...

Yes fermentation started in a few days.

However I have been @ 1.025 for 9 days now.
Last time this happened I repitched with no results.

I went ahead and bottled tonight.
OG 1.058, FG 1.025

Approx 4% ABV.

Don't really have high hopes for this. Wanted a dry stout.

Did you stir up the yeast cake back into suspension? Try that next time...I went from where you were down to 1.018 after stirring.

 

[Ster]

No didn't stir or warm.

Will next time.

Very tasty though even if not a "dry" stout.