The HOBBIT......don't bother

[Stokes_]

I couldn't agree more. The Hobbit was by far my favorite in of Tolkiens books, but it turned out to be a lazy movie. This was what all hardcore Tolkien fans were worried about when they first announced that movies were to be made.

 

[cheezydemon3]

ONLY good thing to come of the film, are 14 minutes of AWESOME filmmaking, 5 minutes of ok filming, and my inspiration for a.....

RADAGHAST THE BROWN ale recipe

 

[GuldTuborg]

ONLY good thing to come of the film, are 14 minutes of AWESOME filmmaking, 5 minutes of ok filming, and my inspiration for a.....

RADAGHAST THE BROWN ale recipe

Where's the recipe, you tease?

I'm making a Pallando the Blue ale. It's all malt, and blue as a Smurf, and I'm not telling you how I do it.

 

[cheezydemon3]

Where's the recipe, you tease?

I'm making a Pallando the Blue ale. It's all malt, and blue as a Smurf, and I'm not telling you how I do it.

And you call me a tease!......referencing smurfs......

 

[cheezydemon3]

A sad day. This will surely halt production.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/gr...lMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:3:Default

 

[mchrispen]

OMG that made me laugh... I needed it this morning!

So now the question is - is Jackson the Mouth of Sauron or just a mislead Saruman?

 

[GuldTuborg]

Pretty sure he's Morgoth.

 

[cheezydemon3]

Now we see his true motives!

 

[HoppyDaze]

The rock mountain monster scene was so ridiculous

 

[landshark]

The rock mountain monster scene was so ridiculous

It was ridiculous in the book. I wondered how PJ would portray it. I will say, of the liberties he took with the story, that is not one I'm upset with. Although maybe it was a little too over the top.

 

[cheezydemon3]

It was ridiculous in the book. I wondered how PJ would portray it. I will say, of the liberties he took with the story, that is not one I'm upset with. Although maybe it was a little too over the top.

Creeping throught the mountains, distant rock giants......rock throwing barely discernable from thunder.....is ridiculous?

What was ridiculous was Hobbits and wizard going from: "I Wonder if that distant noise was Giants or Thunder..."

TO

Hobbits running on the knees of huge psychotic rock monsters.

Night and Day in my book.

 

[Homercidal]

IIRC the party were able to discern giants throwing rocks at each other in the distance. It wasn't that they couldn't tell if it was thunder or giants, but they were well away from the action (although nervous or scared about it).

I don't think it changes the plot or story to have them riding giant rock creature knees while they were fighting. It makes the movie more "exciting". However I do think that just showing rock-throwing giants in the near distance, with noise and such, and showing the party scared of it, would be enough to convey the excitement of the time. Nowadays if it's not an impossible extreme action shot, the studios don't think anyone will enjoy it.

Now let me refer to my copy to The Hobbit to make sure I remember that scene correctly.

 

[cheezydemon3]

My memory is IMPECCABLE....

20 years of pontification and argument have only SHARPENED my powers of recollection!! lol.

I am pretty sure I am right, but I am not beyond reproach.

Let me know what you find, but I recall the rock giants being real, but far beyond sight or real danger, and the sound being indescernable from thunder.

From a "calm but suspenseful scene" to a (YOU GUESSED IT!!!!!!) ACTION SCENE...*cue trumpets* UNFORTUNATELY.....this qualifies as the usual greed induced *********gery in my book.

 

[mchrispen]

So Cheezy, you are correct, but the is some ambiguity relative to the "stone giants" and if they were seen.

It is not explicitly stated, but described as the giants throwing boulders as part of a game, and assumed the party saw the giants, but from afar (sounds like angels bowling in heaven during a thunderstorm fairytale). Otherwise the description is quite vague, but I doubt they were giants made of stone as depicted in the movie. They had clearly made it into the lore and legend and stories of Middle Earth, and there is a description of Gandalf telling stories to a young Bilbo about various monsters - including giants. In LOTR the Hornburg was described as being hewn and carved by giants, not built by men, which would take some culture and intelligence. However, they do seem very rare, at least at the time of LOTR.

Gandalf seems to believe they are intelligent and can communicate as he was later quoted as looking for a friendly sort of giant to block up orc caves.

The latter seems to give creed to them being "real" in the world of Middle Earth, and capable of communication and reason, likely very humanoid. Later mentions in LOTR seems to support that there were other sub-races of giants as well. And Unfinished Tales names a couple of giants, and speculates that Melkor also made giants along with the other monster-races.

 

[headbanger]

greed induced *********gery

AKA the American way.

 

[urbanmyth]

The main beef I have with the whole state of affairs is how grandiose he is trying to make the whole series. The Hobbit was written as a bedtime story for JRRT's children, and it reads as such. It is very humorous and lighthearted, without being overtly so. The fact that PJ took out nearly all the dialogue for the dwarves other than Thorin and Balin (their funniest aspect, in my opinion, and also the groundwork for the history behind their hatred of Smaug) and turned them into a troupe of halfwits with hardly any lines between them.

I am rambling now, but my point is, there is a time and place for epic movie magic. Turning a lighthearted children's story that champions cleverness and bravery into a three part cinematic epic about lost kingdoms and revenge kind of defeats the whole purpose of the story.

Also, the way they treated Radagast really pissed me off. I've waited all my life for a portrayal of the brown Istari and they create him with bird doody all down his face and a team of trained racing rabbits? Have some respect for the character.

 

[cheezydemon3]

Yeah, the "Stone Giant" scene is just one example of Hollywood trodding on our beloved middle-earth. I never imagined the giants being made of stone.

This seems so implausable. Kinda the way Star Wars Episodes 1-3 made me feel. The laws of physics and the general feel of the universe we already knew were changed for the new movie.

SUCK IT!

 

[Homercidal]

My memory is IMPECCABLE....

20 years of pontification and argument have only SHARPENED my powers of recollection!! lol.

I am pretty sure I am right, but I am not beyond reproach.

Let me know what you find, but I recall the rock giants being real, but far beyond sight or real danger, and the sound being indescernable from thunder.

From a "calm but suspenseful scene" to a (YOU GUESSED IT!!!!!!) ACTION SCENE...*cue trumpets* UNFORTUNATELY.....this qualifies as the usual greed induced *********gery in my book.

Oh, my mistake, I thought I read your post to mean the Hobbits couldn't tell if they were giants throwing rocks, or thunder. I can see now that you mean they found the sound of the rock throwing to be similar to the sound of thunder, which I think is correct.

And they were in the distance. Just a bit of cool and interesting information about the realm of Middle Earth that isn't supposed to be an important part of the plot, nor an action sequence to make you roll your eyes.

IMO Bilbo and gang should have tried to hire the giants from the movie to take on Smaug. They were big enough and likely impervious to fire enough to give a jolly good effort.

 

[cheezydemon3]

No worries my friend!

And Yes, as TERRIBLE as Smaug was, now the Stone Giants have stolen the thunder. Although they psychotically hate each other, if one could be convinced to like GOLD.....well, then you would have a stone giant under the mountain....if he would fit.....

 

[Homercidal]

Here is the pasage in question. The stone-giants are barely mentioned, but there is some text included for general scene setting-up.

He knew that something unexpected might happen, and he hardly dared to hope that they would pass without fearful adventure over those great tall mountains with lonely peaks and valleys where no king ruled. They did not. All was well, until one day they met a thunderstorm - more than a thunderstorm, a thunder-battle. You know how terrific a really big thunderstorm can be down in the land and in a river-valley; especially at times when two great thunderstorms meet and clash. More terrible still are thunder and lightning in the mountains at night, when storms come up from East and West and make war. The lightning splinters on the peaks, and rocks shiver, and great crashes split the air and go rolling and tumbling into every cave and hollow; and the darkness is filled with overwhelming noise and sudden light.

Bilbo had never seen or imagined anything of the kind. They were high up in a narrow place, with a dreadful fall into a dim valley at one side of them. There they were sheltering under a hanging rock for the night, and he lay beneath a blanket and shook from head to toe. When he peeped out in the lightning-flashes, he saw that across the valley the stone-giants were out and were hurling rocks at one another for a. game, and catching them, and tossing them down into the darkness where they smashed among the trees far below, or splintered into little bits with a bang. Then came a wind and a rain, and the wind whipped the rain and the hail about in every direction, so that an overhanging rock was no protection at all. Soon they were getting drenched and their ponies were standing with their heads down and their tails between their legs, and some of them were whinnying with fright. They could hear the giants guffawing and shouting all over the mountainsides.

So, really, two sentences describing the stone giants, and no real interaction with the party at all. The next passages deal with Gandalf sending a couple of the dwarves out to find a cave to shelter in, which they do. And which provides a place for the party to get captured.

 

[Homercidal]

Oh, sorry, I forgot there was one more line about the giants...

"This won't do at all!" said Thorin. "If we don't get blown off or drowned, or struck by lightning, we shall be picked up by some giant and kicked sky-high for a football."

 

[Homercidal]

And here is where they meet Beorn, and the only place that Radagast is mentioned in The Hobbit:

"I am Gandalf," said the wizard.

"Never heard of him," growled the man, "And what's this little fellow?" he said, stooping down to frown at the hobbit with his bushy eyebrows.

"That is Mr. Baggins, a hobbit of good family and unimpeachable reputation," said Gandalf. Bilbo bowed. He had no hat to take off, and was painfully conscious of his many missing buttons. "I am a wizard," continued Gandalf. "I have heard of you, if you have not heard of me; but perhaps you have heard of my good cousin Radagast who lives near the Southern borders of Mirkwood?"

"Yes; not a bad fellow as wizards go, I believe. I used to see him now and again," said Beorn.

 

[Homercidal]

OOps, right about then, the Stone Giants are mentioned again..

we were attacked by the evil goblins*-as I was about to tell you."

"Go on telling, then!" said Beorn, who was never very polite.

"There was a terrible storm; the stone-giants were out hurling rocks, and at the head of the pass we took refuge in a cave, the hob bit and I and several of our companions…"

"Do you call two several?"

"Well, no. As a matter of fact there were more than two."

And then Gandalf gets around to introducing a few more of the dwarves, as you know Beorn wouldn't have liked it if the full party had come upon him all at one time. Gandalf had to slowly bring one or two into the picture at a time.

 

[mchrispen]

Straight to the source...

That introduction of the company to Beorn is one of my favorite sections... they better not fubar it.

 

[Homercidal]

Straight to the source...

That introduction of the company to Beorn is one of my favorite sections... they better not fubar it.

I heard they left Beorn out completely...

(ducks head)

 

[mchrispen]

Well now - then you should see the trailers... he looks like an ewok.

 

[cheezydemon3]

I have been intentionally avoiding the trailers....like shielding my eyes.

"Well, I did hear something a bout a ring and a dark lord and a female elf and barrels with no lids and the end of the world or something..."

 

[weirdboy]

The thing that has bothered me with the tie-in advertising is the way they pronounce Smaug as SMA-OOG like it's some kind of intricate two-syllable word.

 

[cheezydemon3]

The thing that has bothered me with the tie-in advertising is the way they pronounce Smaug as SMA-OOG like it's some kind of intricate two-syllable word.

Unfortunately, if it is like the LOTR, PJ actually took JRRT's pronunciation, no matter how ridiculous. It often clashed with my assumed pronunciations.

 

[mchrispen]

I find the pronunciation a bit funny, just because it seems to difficult for people to wrap their lips around... I can imagine a voice over guy pulling his hair out trying to chew out Smaug properly. Especially with writing and syntax that is particularly Queen's english, but spoken with an American accent. Take that Burger King!

I think this is one place where Tolkien the philologist and linguist would not have compromised.