Spike Conical- observations and best practices

[Nate R]

Thanks. That is exactly the info I am looking for. What other accessories do you like for the Spike?

I would get:
-Cf5
-Pressure package ( this is a must!) with carb stone save a few $$
-Temp.package i did not get heater as i am in nor cali. Then i found hornidal kviek.. so... maybe later.
- blow off cane stainless. (I got mine from i think Jaybird/ norcal brewing it was cheaper).

If you already have a good pump you could go CIP but i dont. Scroll back this thread we debate it. Cf5 is pretty easy to clean. Get some gentle sponges, a little pbw, youre good.

Others may have a 0.02 here to add

 

[Beardless]

Thanks. That is exactly the info I am looking for. What other accessories do you like for the Spike?

I am a big fan of the pressurized transfer setup as well. Filling 2 kegs from my CF10 is a breeze.

 

[jturman35]

I’m it sure what all the hype is for the carb stone? Can someone elaborate?

 

[iancl]

Thanks. That is exactly the info I am looking for. What other accessories do you like for the Spike?

Temp control and the pressure transfer kit fo sho.

 

[Nate R]

I’m it sure what all the hype is for the carb stone? Can someone elaborate?

Two things:
#1 add oxygen to your wort before (or right after) you pitch yeast. Closed system so no more shaking, wands, etc. Hook a gas ball lock to either: an oxygen tank (via a regulator) or an aquarium pump and done.

#2: once you have dropped yeast/trub after you have cold crashed, hook up gss ball lock to stone again. Set your psi according to chart on spike.com. wait 24 hours. Rack beer as it is now carbed and ready to serve!! You could serve it right from the conical, rack to kegs, or bottle.
I do suggest ensuring your c02 is exactly where you want it before bottling.
Note- wash carb store between uses!

 

[Beardless]

FWIW- I think in this thread there was a lot of debate over the carb stone.

I personally use it as described above and am very satisfied, others don’t see the point or don’t get good results? For me, I carb in the CF10 after cold crash and let it sit. Then I pressure transfer to kegs. The one thing to consider is that some have had issues with how high they can get pressure before the relief pops (as low as 12# from what I saw, designed for 15#), making the carb stone less effective over broader range for force carb, it is practically ineffective if you aren’t temp controlling.

People have also stated they get a lot of foaming during the pressure transfer, which would lead one away from force carb before transfer. I use it exactly as the spike instructions (video on their website) and go pretty much wide open on the valve and haven’t had any significant foaming issues.

 

[mongoose33]

FWIW- I think in this thread there was a lot of debate over the carb stone.

I personally use it as described above and am very satisfied, others don’t see the point or don’t get good results? For me, I carb in the CF10 after cold crash and let it sit. Then I pressure transfer to kegs. The one thing to consider is that some have had issues with how high they can get pressure before the relief pops (as low as 12# from what I saw, designed for 15#), making the carb stone less effective over broader range for force carb, it is practically ineffective if you aren’t temp controlling.

I have a carb stone, I've never used it. Partly because I close up the system when I have 5-7 points of gravity to go, and it self-carbs. After crashing I have about 7psi in the beer, which is already drinkable. I pressure transfer then put the keg on the gas to finish. Sometimes I'll juice it with 35 psi for four hours, then back down again, sometimes I'll just set and forget. Takes maybe 5-7 days to get to proper carbonation.

I could use it for oxygenation, but I have a long wand and I use that through the 4" top port. I have no idea what rate to use if I oxygenated with the carb stone. I suppose .5 lpm for 2 minutes, but not sure. How do you do it? Where do you connect it? Where the sampling port would go? Via the racking valve?

People have also stated they get a lot of foaming during the pressure transfer, which would lead one away from force carb before transfer. I use it exactly as the spike instructions (video on their website) and go pretty much wide open on the valve and haven’t had any significant foaming issues.

Do you use a spunding valve? I do, it makes the difference. I also just open the valve all the way.

The PRV on my spike releases about 13 or 13.5 psi, which is as much pressure as I can get it to take. To make it a pressure transfer I'd need the beer's carbonation to be less than that. What's the pressure difference when you transfer, i.e., between headspace pressure you apply, and the beer's carbonation pressure?

 

[ZmannR2]

Thanks. That is exactly the info I am looking for. What other accessories do you like for the Spike?

The clear 4" TC cap on the lid for viewing your beer is a MUST. Also the racking arm. Also depending on your tubing setup definitely get some 1.5" TC adapters (for me it was an adapter to a male camlock). Leg extensions and casters as well!

 

[ZmannR2]

So my lager is fermenting away (according to what I'm seeing through the site cap I mentioned above) but I'm not seeing any bubbles forming in the Star San my blow off hose is sitting in. Now it's 50 degrees so I imagine it's pretty slow. Being that this is my first lager, I'm not used to seeing any bubbling. Is it really THAT slow?

 

[mongoose33]

The clear 4" TC cap on the lid for viewing your beer is a MUST. Also the racking arm. Also depending on your tubing setup definitely get some 1.5" TC adapters (for me it was an adapter to a male camlock). Leg extensions and casters as well!

I have to disagree here. I don't have that clear cap. I have the temp control system, and if I'd bought the cap, I would have just wasted the money.

Among the things I think are a must is the pressure manifold with the PRV, gas post, and pressure gauge. I attach a gas QD to the gas post on it, connect to a piece of tubing, and terminate in a blowoff jar filled with star-san. I like seeing the progress with bubbles, and you can tell when fermentation slows and stops by this.

If I had my conical in a refrigerator to control temp, maybe I might have the clear cap, but even then, it would likely be hard to see what's going on, unless your head is shaped, and swivels, differently than most people's.

Here's a 4-second video showing the bubbles:

 

[mongoose33]

So my lager is fermenting away (according to what I'm seeing through the site cap I mentioned above) but I'm not seeing any bubbles forming in the Star San my blow off hose is sitting in. Now it's 50 degrees so I imagine it's pretty slow. Being that this is my first lager, I'm not used to seeing any bubbling. Is it really THAT slow?

You have a leak in a seal somewhere. Did you tighten down the lid enough? A couple times after cleaning I reinstalled the lid and the band clamp, but I didn't tighten it down all the way. I wasn't getting any bubbling in my blowoff hose until I tightened that down.

You may also have a loose gasket someplace else. Did you use a gasket with your clear top cap? How about the pressure manifold? Tightened down well?

 

[itsnotrequired]

get the racking arm, wish i had gotten it sooner, beers are way clearer. before, i would dump/cold crash and fill kegs via the racking port. some yeast/trub inevitably found its way into the valve so i ran the first few ounces of finished beer to drain and then hooked up to the keg. i could visibly see material in the racking hose as the keg filled and they beer to forever to clear in the keg. i'm guessing it was material on the fermenter walls that was sluicing off as the level dropped. anyway, went to the racking arm and leave it in the down position the whole time, beers have been way clearer.

i don't have the carb stone. i use an oxygen bottle and diffusion stone on tubing through the t4" lid opening, just like i did with my old carboys. i burst carb the filled kegs so i get beer pretty fast as is, not too worried about changing the process.

i also don't have the stainless blow off cane or clear lid. i use the cooling coil so the clear lid is a non-starter and as for the blow off, i just use tubing on the 90 degree lid barb into a jar of starsan. once blowoff ends, i swap the 90 degree barb for the gas manifold and use the ball connector with tubing into startsan. i don't use the manifold right away, don't want to gum it up if i get blowoff.

insulated jacket is better than nothing but could offer better insulation. it works fine if i am heating but when crashing, i find the need to wrap the whole thing in heavy blanket to get temps down to where i want.

leg extension is great for placing a sight glass in the vertical orientation and just getting everything higher off the ground (less bending over). if you go with leg extensions, definitely get the bracing shelf. casters are your call, depends on your process. i use cip and the fermenter is close enough to my sink that i don't need to roll the conical around. in fact, i used a piece of conduit clamp to hold one of the legs against the wall, extra protection from tipping over.

 

[Bad Bubba]

Thanks for all the good feed back. Anyone try the new, improved shelf or the short legs? Any thoughts on the sight glass? I have a pressure transfer kit that I put together myself for my chronical and it is really handy. I also have a sight glass for my chronical but do not use it anymore - I found I could dump until I saw beer coming out the valve.

 

[ZmannR2]

I have to disagree here. I don't have that clear cap. I have the temp control system, and if I'd bought the cap, I would have just wasted the money.

Lemme further explain when the cap is amazing! Pitching yeast or dry hopping you can look in there to make sure its not just sitting on top of the krausen or bubbles.....also you can check for signs of infection at will.....also it's super interesting to see the phases of the beer during fermentation. But yes in anyone's case with the temp control system it's a waste for sure.

 

[ZmannR2]

Thanks for all the good feed back. Anyone try the new, improved shelf or the short legs?

I have the standard shelf because I was afraid the wide one wouldn't fit in my ferm chamber (which I later discovered would have fit fine) but I do have the shorty legs because my ferm chamber is high enough where I can still fill kegs from it using the shorty and everything is very stable

 

[mongoose33]

Lemme further explain when the cap is amazing! Pitching yeast or dry hopping you can look in there to make sure its not just sitting on top of the krausen or bubbles.....also you can check for signs of infection at will.....also it's super interesting to see the phases of the beer during fermention......and another thing, it's what? $20? lets not act like it's a super expensive addition. And I'm sure cheaper versions can be had

The beauty of all this is everybody gets to make the choices that make sense to them.

 

[ZmannR2]

The beauty of all this is everybody gets to make the choices that make sense to them.

ya my apologies I edited it I didn't read that you were using the temp control system

 

[Nate R]

The beauty of all this is everybody gets to make the choices that make sense to them.

Bingo!!! Well said.
And... you can order as you go!
But try to maximize free shipping threshold!

 

[logdrum]

Bingo!!! Well said.
And... you can order as you go!
But try to maximize free shipping threshold!

That's why I ordered mine pretty much fully loaded

 

[Beardless]

I have a carb stone, I've never used it. Partly because I close up the system when I have 5-7 points of gravity to go, and it self-carbs. After crashing I have about 7psi in the beer, which is already drinkable. I pressure transfer then put the keg on the gas to finish. Sometimes I'll juice it with 35 psi for four hours, then back down again, sometimes I'll just set and forget. Takes maybe 5-7 days to get to proper carbonation.

I could use it for oxygenation, but I have a long wand and I use that through the 4" top port. I have no idea what rate to use if I oxygenated with the carb stone. I suppose .5 lpm for 2 minutes, but not sure. How do you do it? Where do you connect it? Where the sampling port would go? Via the racking valve?



Do you use a spunding valve? I do, it makes the difference. I also just open the valve all the way.

The PRV on my spike releases about 13 or 13.5 psi, which is as much pressure as I can get it to take. To make it a pressure transfer I'd need the beer's carbonation to be less than that. What's the pressure difference when you transfer, i.e., between headspace pressure you apply, and the beer's carbonation pressure?

I have not used spunding valve, but am getting a setup for it. I’ve read somewhere (maybe on this thread?) people using it for the pressure transfer and for force carving at the end of fermentation like you do. It has me very interested.

I’m looking back at my post, i didn’t intend to allude that I use it for O2 yet. Currently I just put the hose in the top of the CF10 and let it splash a whole bunch when filling. I do have some fittings put together that was intended to be used for connecting the small red O2 bottles to the stone though. I would install the carb stone to the racking arm, just like when I force carb (I always start with the arm up, not sure it matters, but it makes me feel better?)

I was recently thinking of making up a fitting to add CO2 with the stone to the beer as I do the pressurized transfer, not sure it will amount to any gain in efficiency of carbing. (I am thinking about the blingmann quick carb- only it would just be co2 pressure connected to a tee while the beer goes through the lines to the keg).

I have had my CF10 up to 15#, so it looks like my PRV opens a bit higher than most people’s. Usually I set the CO2 to the stone to provide ~11-12# pressure (usually by the end the CF10 head space reads about that). Then when I transfer I put about 15# on the top and transfer with the valve open wide. Part of the reason I can transfer wide open as well is the lower delta between beer and head space pressure, so it goes nice and slow during transfer.

Sorry for the long post- my local store just started carrying Lawson’s Sip Of Sunshine. Typically I save those beers, but I bought like 30 yesterday, so I knocked back a few today to make room for tomorrow’s Tavour delivery. Then I had a Mai Tai with dinner.

 

[Beardless]

I attach a gas QD to the gas post on it, connect to a piece of tubing, and terminate in a blowoff jar filled with star-san. I like seeing the progress with bubbles, and you can tell when fermentation slows and stops by this.

Are you f-ing kidding me... mind freaking blown.

That’s genius....I currently use:
-the stainless blowoff arm
-a piece of tubing connected to it
-a bucket of sanitizer
-an empty growler with the end of the tubing through the handle to keep the tubing from floating

What I will use next time:

a gas QD to the gas post on it, connect to a piece of tubing, and terminate in a blowoff jar filled with star-san.

 

[Nate R]

Are you f-ing kidding me... mind freaking blown.

That’s genius....I currently use:
-the stainless blowoff arm
-a piece of tubing connected to it
-a bucket of sanitizer
-an empty growler with the end of the tubing through the handle to keep the tubing from floating

What I will use next time:

Yeah... agree... really great call.
Now i do not have to swap pieces. One less oxygen exposure! (Yay lodo!).

Nice job Goose! Also one less piece to clean!

 

[cubsfan16]

You can also put a gas disconnect on the other end and attach it to a keg full of starsan and purge your serving keg into a 6gal bucket. Works great and saves co2.

 

[FswBG]

Thanks for all the good feed back. Anyone try the new, improved shelf or the short legs? Any thoughts on the sight glass? I have a pressure transfer kit that I put together myself for my chronical and it is really handy. I also have a sight glass for my chronical but do not use it anymore - I found I could dump until I saw beer coming out the valve.

I added the short legs and new bracing shelf onto my CF5. It's sturdier than I would have expected. I don't have any concerns since it will be stationary for the most part. I didn't personally have a need for casters.

 

[logdrum]

Just a follow up on shipping; I ordered the Penguin on Tuesday night & the CF-10 on Wednesday, both arrived on Friday! Pretty darned impressive.

 

[logdrum]

Just put 5psi of c02 on the CF-10 overnight, lost a couple of ounces pressure. Do any of you lube the threads on you TCs or band clamp? I have a RIMS Rocket that uses the same band clamp & Blichmann advises that the threads MUST! be lubricated every time it is disassembled.

 

[Nate R]

Just put 5psi of c02 on the CF-10 overnight, lost a couple of ounces pressure. Do any of you lube the threads on you TCs or band clamp? I have a RIMS Rocket that uses the same band clamp & Blichmann advises that the threads MUST! be lubricated every time it is disassembled.

Yes lube to the band clamp (i use nsf grade sprat from a can. So easy!).
Also- in my experience my cf always loses psi from the lid gasket/clamp. Make sure the flat part is down inside the lid. I also hit the gasket with a touch of lube. Gotta clamp it down hard to hold psi.

I have never lubed the tri clamps.

 

[logdrum]

Yes lube to the band clamp (i use nsf grade sprat from a can. So easy!).
Also- in my experience my cf always loses psi from the lid gasket/clamp. Make sure the flat part is down inside the lid. I also hit the gasket with a touch of lube. Gotta clamp it down hard to hold psi.

I have never lubed the tri clamps.

Thank you!

 

[Blazinlow86]

Thank you!

You definitely need to tighten the band clamp pretty tightly. Just to clarify your seeing a pressure drop when empty correct? If there is liquid inside it will absorb the co2 appearing to be a leak. Cheers

 

[Nate R]

You definitely need to tighten the band clamp pretty tightly. Just to clarify your seeing a pressure drop when empty correct? If there is liquid inside it will absorb the co2 appearing to be a leak. Cheers

I always forget about this!!! Thanks

 

[logdrum]

You definitely need to tighten the band clamp pretty tightly. Just to clarify your seeing a pressure drop when empty correct? If there is liquid inside it will absorb the co2 appearing to be a leak. Cheers

Yes, empty. I’ve retightened all clamps & it appears to be holding [emoji1360]

 

[Jag75]

About the lid gasket being loose. After the first use I soaked it in hot pbw water. Once I rinsed it off it seemed bigger like it stretched a tad. I dont know if it was because of the hot water . I tossed it in cool water then let it sit and dry out . It fit like it's supposed to . Dont know if this makes sense or if I was just so tired that night .

 

[Nate R]

About the lid gasket being loose. After the first use I soaked it in hot pbw water. Once I rinsed it off it seemed bigger like it stretched a tad. I dont know if it was because of the hot water . I tossed it in cool water then let it sit and dry out . It fit like it's supposed to . Dont know if this makes sense or if I was just so tired that night .

Yeah... somebody here mentioned put it in the freezer for 5 to 10 mins. Same thing. Shrinks it just a touch.

 

[Vale71]

About the lid gasket being loose. After the first use I soaked it in hot pbw water. Once I rinsed it off it seemed bigger like it stretched a tad. I dont know if it was because of the hot water . I tossed it in cool water then let it sit and dry out . It fit like it's supposed to . Dont know if this makes sense or if I was just so tired that night .

Assuming an 18" gasket at 20°C if it's warmed up to 50°C (a 30°C increase) it will then measure about 18.142". Not a huge difference but it will definitely be noticeable assuming a perfect fit at 20°C.

 

[FswBG]

So I am currently fermenting a session IPA under pressure in my CF5 and I'm noticing the pressure sitting exactly at 15psi on day 3 of fermenting. I was under the impression the spike prv would trigger at 13psi, but I have released the pressure down to 10 a few times already today and it keeps creeping up to 15 on the dot. I guess I need to invest in a tc spunding, but has anyone had problems with this or going north of 15psi?

 

[Nate R]

So I am currently fermenting a session IPA under pressure in my CF5 and I'm noticing the pressure sitting exactly at 15psi on day 3 of fermenting. I was under the impression the spike prv would trigger at 13psi, but I have released the pressure down to 10 a few times already today and it keeps creeping up to 15 on the dot. I guess I need to invest in a tc spunding, but has anyone had problems with this or going north of 15psi?

It thimo 15 psi is closer to what it is supposed to blow at. It is not a precise device however. I would not suggest relying on it as a spunding valve. Instead it is designed to blow before the cf does.

Note- ss brewtech has some cool looking spunding valves. Also there are two home made ones for sale here over on the for sale thread.

 

[Blazinlow86]

So I am currently fermenting a session IPA under pressure in my CF5 and I'm noticing the pressure sitting exactly at 15psi on day 3 of fermenting. I was under the impression the spike prv would trigger at 13psi, but I have released the pressure down to 10 a few times already today and it keeps creeping up to 15 on the dot. I guess I need to invest in a tc spunding, but has anyone had problems with this or going north of 15psi?

15 psi is the correct psi. You should ideally be using a spunding valve to keep it below the 15 psi however. You'll also need the spunding valve in order to transfer finished beer into kegs. Cheers

 

[KyleF318is]

Some awesome stuff on this thread! Thank you all for sharing. My current dilemma (?) is whether to get the CF5 or CF10. I use the Grainfather right now so I can’t Brew 10G batches but that’s not to say I won’t increase later. I also do a lot of fruited kettle sours and NEIPAs.

I’ve secured my spot with the Stasis Kickstarter glycol chiller. Which is forcing my hand to finally pull the trigger. I don’t believe the stasis has the ability for 10G batches but most people recommend going to a CF10 because it does 5gallon batches. Is this still true? Or are the coils freezing still, since they’re exposed to the air above the wort.

Thanks for helping me! Already a great thread!

 

[ZmannR2]

whether to get the CF5 or CF10.

I will say this....I started out at 5 gal batches and VERY quickly realized how fast those 5 gals dissappear. And for literally the exact same amount of work you can double your output. 3 hrs of work minimum to brew and clean up so why not go 10 gals?

 

[Yesfan]

For those with chillers, can one rig up something from a small dorm fridge to keep the glycol cold(er)?

I've had my eye on these for a couple of years, but don't know if I would want to shell the same amount of money for an additional glycol chiller. The cheapest Penguin chiller can cool 4 conicals. I think one will be all I ever have when I pull the plug, so I wonder if something utilizing a small cheap dorm fridge (or my current keezer) could be made.