Secondary fermenter to large?

[Ntwkdsnr]

I have a 5 gal. recipe that needs to go into a secondary fermenter. Both my carboys are 6.5 and 8 gal. Will there be too much head space or air to use as secondaries? The recipe is a cream ale.
Thanks

 

[peterj]

I don't see any reason a cream ale needs to go into a secondary. And yes, that would be too much headspace for a secondary. You would need a 5 gallon carboy to use as a secondary. But I would definitely just leave it in the primary.

 

[LesIsMore]

Yep, exactly what he said.

 

[heckofagator]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/size-secondary-fermenter-container-does-matter-492431/

 

[metanoia]

Like peterj said, you shouldn't need a secondary as long as you're not adding something to the beer (hops, wood ships, etc.), and even then the general consensus is to just add it to the primary. It's one less time you're exposing your beer to oxygen and the environment, not to mention all of your racking equipment and a new fermenter. The old wisdom was to get the beer off the yeast as soon as fermentation was completed because the yeast strains weren't as advanced as they are today, and the pros have constantly advocated for sticking with a primary fermenter only these days. Check out the link in my signature for more info.

 

[thejuanald]

As an aside question to this, when I make IPAs or wheat beers with fruit in them, I will rack to a secondary to dry hop or for the fruit additions. Is that completely necessary or can I do that in the primary? I would think that dry hopping might be doable in primary but I should probably rack to secondary before I do any adding of fruits.

 

[GrogNerd]

As an aside question to this, when I make IPAs or wheat beers with fruit in them, I will rack to a secondary to dry hop or for the fruit additions. Is that completely necessary or can I do that in the primary? I would think that dry hopping might be doable in primary but I should probably rack to secondary before I do any adding of fruits.

it's all personal preference, but dry-hopping/oaking/fruit is adding a secondary ingredient and I think might turn out better if racked to secondary

of the 3, fruit is the only one which actually initiates a secondary fermentation, which is where the term comes from.

but, agreed. limiting headspace is more critical in secondary than primary

 

[metanoia]

As an aside question to this, when I make IPAs or wheat beers with fruit in them, I will rack to a secondary to dry hop or for the fruit additions. Is that completely necessary or can I do that in the primary? I would think that dry hopping might be doable in primary but I should probably rack to secondary before I do any adding of fruits.

Fruit is a bit of a different game since you're going to get more fermentation out of the yeast if you add all that sugary fruit to the primary. Still, people have posted good results adding fruit/puree in both primary and secondary so it's more personal preference. With hops, though, it seems overwhelmingly popular to just do it in the primary- easier, less chance of infection, and the yeast can keep cleaning up the beer.

 

[Ntwkdsnr]

Forgot to mention that the recipe calls for the addition of vanilla bean during the secondary. I'll need to get a 5 gal. Plastic carboy.
Thanks for all of the replies!

 

[JonM]

You can add the vanilla bean in the primary, too. It'll do the exact thing as it would in a secondary.

 

[beerme70]

Everyone has their methods, and reasons why. My first couple of batches I did, I bottled from the primary. I started doing secondary fermentations for clarity reasons, mainly, and also getting the beer off of the trub before lagering, and it's just been pretty much habit ever since. I have never had any issues (knocking on wood) with contamination out of the dozens upon dozens of batches due to being extremely diligent when it comes to sanitation. Even Stephen Snyder recommends using a secondary whenever possible. The less it's handled the less chance of contamination, agreed.

 

[metanoia]

Like you said, less handling means less chance of contamination. Thankfully you've been skilled (not lucky) in having no issues because you have been meticulous about cleanliness and sanitation, but that doesn't mean there's a 0% chance of contamination. In the same way, I could easily jump off a 10 foot high ledge a hundred times without hurting myself, but there's still a (slightly) larger chance of spraining my ankle if I jump instead of staying on the ground.

As for Snyder, where does he recommend the use of a secondary? I've never read any of his works, so I'm assuming it's in The Brewmaster's Bible which is the single item that comes up when searching Google. If so, that appears to be a 14 year old book, which is around the same time that John Palmer was suggesting the same usage of a secondary in How To Brew because of the weak yeast strains available at the time. Since then he's changed his stance on secondaries because of the widespread availability of liquid yeast and better strains of dry yeast, as has the majority of the homebrewing community.

If one is using a secondary for clarity purposes, the same results can be achieved through using irish moss/whirlfloc in the boil, letting the yeast finish cleaning up in primary for a few extra weeks, and cold crashing for a few days before bottling/kegging.

Nothing against you and your practices, beerme; like I said, you've never had a problem because you're cautious and skilled with your process. But as this is the beginnings forum, it's probably best not to throw secondaries into the mix until beginners are more comfortable with the process and sanitation, especially when it's unnecessary for making great beer.

 

[thejuanald]

it's all personal preference, but dry-hopping/oaking/fruit is adding a secondary ingredient and I think might turn out better if racked to secondary

of the 3, fruit is the only one which actually initiates a secondary fermentation, which is where the term comes from.

but, agreed. limiting headspace is more critical in secondary than primary

Fruit is a bit of a different game since you're going to get more fermentation out of the yeast if you add all that sugary fruit to the primary. Still, people have posted good results adding fruit/puree in both primary and secondary so it's more personal preference. With hops, though, it seems overwhelmingly popular to just do it in the primary- easier, less chance of infection, and the yeast can keep cleaning up the beer.

Great, thanks guys. That saves me from having to rack to secondary for my IPAs. I will try it out on my next batch!