Brett Beer Saison Brett

[thasnazzle]

I'm about five months out on a version I did of this with all brett c. Some tasting notes from my brew journal:

Incredibly clear golden straw color with an off-yellow head that dissipates, leaving minimal lacing. Aroma is overripe fruit, booze, and a fungal/cheese character that is a part of the overall bouquet instead of the primary smell that it was months ago. Taste begins with sweet tropical fruit yielding to some brett horsey funk that closes with a warm booziness and a sharp bitterness. Next time I'll try this with fewer hops. Mouthfeel isn't as thin as the low FG would indicate, though it is certainly dry.

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I should also note that this is all in spite of some huge mistakes on my end - didn't do a 90min boil to drive off DMS, so the DMS was overwhelming for a couple of months before it started receding. Also I drastically underpitched, I think - this was before I learned about proper pitching rates and thought that any starter would be big enough, despite the fact that my tube of brett C was almost expired and I only did a 1L starter. That my beer tastes this great is a testament to how resilient this recipe is.

 

[GabeSyme]

I was thinking about brewing this without the brett but I realized I have a bottle of Saison Brett aging in my basement! Would it be worth it at all to split a batch and pitch one with yeast+dregs and one with just the saison yeast or is this recipe just too good to change?

 

[AmandaK]

I brewed this back on September 9th, and I must say, I CANNOT WAIT to get this guy bottled! I've never used 3724 before, but sure enough, it stalled out at 1.035. I started fermentation at 68, then ramped to 80 over the course of 7 days. Left it at 80 for another week, gravity at 1.035. Pushed it up to 90, and have seen some activity, but I'm waiting until next week to take another gravity reading.

The aromas are heavenly. Pitched bottles from a 2011 and a 2012 Boulevard Saison-Brett.

 

[AmandaK]

Bottled this last night. Got down to 1.004 after 2 weeks at 90*. Hydro samples taste amazing. I'll probably have to wax dip half the batch to encourage me to save some to see if this develops in the bottle like Boulevard's version does.

 

[dwarven_stout]

I was thinking about brewing this without the brett but I realized I have a bottle of Saison Brett aging in my basement! Would it be worth it at all to split a batch and pitch one with yeast+dregs and one with just the saison yeast or is this recipe just too good to change?

Split it, but I'd do 2/3 brett if you can. You'll wish you had more when you're down to the literal last bottle like I am right now.

Bottled this last night. Got down to 1.004 after 2 weeks at 90*. Hydro samples taste amazing. I'll probably have to wax dip half the batch to encourage me to save some to see if this develops in the bottle like Boulevard's version does.

I found with mine that the brett character tends to top out after about 8-10 months. Definitely worth keeping some until then, though.

 

[Aschecte]

Without a doubt this was one of the best beers I have brewed. It also recently won a best of show as well as a 1st place in category in two different competitions. Mine was a slight variation but really really damn close. By not saving this beer for at least 1-2 years is a huge disservice to yourself as brettnomyces takes 8 months to fully develope it's charecteristic funky flavors. Don't be scared if a pellicle forms in bottle this is also sometime normal for Brett beers. Patience is key with this or any wild or sour beers but soooo worth it. Best of luck to those who brew this great beer !!!!

 

[humann_brewing]

Generally speaking, Brett B will tend to give you a more "traditional" horsey brett funk, and Brett L will either give you some sour cherry and smoky funk (wyeast) or loads of sweaty smoke (white labs). I haven't done any of that with this particular beer. I might someday, but this recipe is seriously too good to want to play with right now.

Thanks for the descriptions, so what would be the descriptor for brett c then?

 

[Aschecte]

Thanks for the descriptions, so what would be the descriptor for brett c then?

Brett clausseni ( think that's the spelling) is a close cousin in its true form and a misnomer in some cases for Brett A depending on the mfg. the profile either way is more to the aroma side lending to a cherry or pineapple like nose there is a very minimal amount of contribution to flavor. I personally love Brett c and when I made my version of this beer used Brett c from white labs and had amazing results I highly reccomend using it.

 

[AmandaK]

I found with mine that the brett character tends to top out after about 8-10 months. Definitely worth keeping some until then, though.

Well, then I guess I'll have to do another batch soon. It's so good that half the batch is already gone.

 

[humann_brewing]

Brett clausseni ( think that's the spelling) is a close cousin in its true form and a misnomer in some cases for Brett A depending on the mfg. the profile either way is more to the aroma side lending to a cherry or pineapple like nose there is a very minimal amount of contribution to flavor. I personally love Brett c and when I made my version of this beer used Brett c from white labs and had amazing results I highly reccomend using it.

Thanks, like I said, I would like to do a 11G batch of this, use Wyeast 3724 and Brett C (from white labs) with half and then Wyeast 3711 with the other 5 gallons

 

[sbuchan]

I brewed this on 1/26/13 and pulled a sample tonight. Smells fantastic, lots of funk with just a hint of tartness. The taste though... I'm getting a cidery, semi-sweet finish (at 1.004). I brewed this with White Labs Farmhouse Blend II and a started I made with Logsdon Farmhouse Seizoen Bretta. Any idea what happened? Should I just let it sit another month or so?

 

[thasnazzle]

If you fermented with sacch and brett you definitely shouldn't be bottling any time soon. The brett is going to keep eating at some of the residual sugar, it should get dryer over the next few months. Brett just takes a while when it's stressed and working with sacch.

 

[Aschecte]

If I was to do this beer again I wouldn't even think about bottling anytime before 6-8 months and even then i'd be cautious..... And besides Brett works differently when pitched with sacch and it takes a long time for for those Brett flavors to fully develop. Trust me don't rush this beer. It is a great great beer I have won a first and second place with this beer and was less than 1 point away from best of show at one competition. Patience is key with this one but the results are well worth the wait.

 

[dwarven_stout]

I brewed this on 1/26/13 and pulled a sample tonight. Smells fantastic, lots of funk with just a hint of tartness. The taste though... I'm getting a cidery, semi-sweet finish (at 1.004). I brewed this with White Labs Farmhouse Blend II and a started I made with Logsdon Farmhouse Seizoen Bretta. Any idea what happened? Should I just let it sit another month or so?

Like these other guys have said, let it run a little longer. I bottle most of my brett secondary beers around the 6 month mark (brett primaries after around 6-8 weeks). That Logsdon strain should take it down a little lower and give you some cheesy straw funk.

 

[Aschecte]

Another tidbit of info about Brett ...... No need to worry about a secondary ever unless you plan to add fruit or dry hop etc.... Autolysis will NOT happen.

Brett unlike sacch will canabalize and eat the dead Brett and Sachh as food for the long work ahead of them. This is the main reason beers like lambic or Flanders beers can remain in primary for a year plus with no problems. So no one gets confused I'm not referring to bacteria which dies off at either a higher ph or as the abv rises. Brett is the roach of the yeast world it will survive almost anything. The longer you leave the beer on the Brett the more the funk will stand out.

 

[lunshbox]

Another tidbit of info about Brett ...... No need to worry about a secondary ever unless you plan to add fruit or dry hop etc.... Autolysis will NOT happen.

Brett unlike sacch will canabalize and eat the dead Brett and Sachh as food for the long work ahead of them. This is the main reason beers like lambic or Flanders beers can remain in primary for a year plus with no problems. So no one gets confused I'm not referring to bacteria which dies off at either a higher ph or as the abv rises. Brett is the roach of the yeast world it will survive almost anything. The longer you leave the beer on the Brett the more the funk will stand out.

Indeed. I am repitching a brett trois that is in its 5th slurry iteration. I just keep dumping on the cake. Not Bandaids yet.

 

[kevin476]

So, I think I am going to brew this and some other saisons similar to it, I will keg condition some but others I will do a sacch yeast then long brett and then bottle condition with wine yeast, what do you guys add for sugar at bottling after you take a beer like this down to 1.006-1.000? Hopefully I will get to brew this within a few weeks.

 

[theveganbrewer]

I happened to have a bottle of Saison-Brett in my cellar ready to be consumed. I wonder, is one bottle enough? Should I make a tiny starter with the dregs first?

 

[dwarven_stout]

When I bottle this, I use Beersmith to calculate 3 vol CO2, and figure that the residual brett will give me more like 3.5 when all is said and done.

As far as making a starter from the Boulevard Saison Brett dregs, I have successfully used a fresh bottle's dregs, pitched at the same time as the primary yeast. If your bottle is 2010 or 11 vintage, you might want to step it up once.

 

[AmandaK]

As far as making a starter from the Boulevard Saison Brett dregs, I have successfully used a fresh bottle's dregs, pitched at the same time as the primary yeast. If your bottle is 2010 or 11 vintage, you might want to step it up once.

As another data point, I brewed this last September 2012 and co-pitched 3724, a 2010 vintage and a 2011 vintage and it's pretty funky now.

 

[Jdslep]

I brewed this in 9/2012, bottled after two months. Pitched Goose Island Sophie dregs on brew day, and Wyeast 3711 French Saison. Fermented at 68F ambient.

On 2/2013 I brought it to the club meeting and got rave reviews. It came in at 9% abv, dried out to 1.000 but has a thicker mouthfeel. Now in 5/2013: I don't know what the Brett or the saison yeast is supposed to taste like, but I get a lot of artificial cherry, a spiciness on the tongue, and some soft esters (I think). A long--over a minute--lingering taste of cherry and slight funk. Not bad for a first all-grain batch! I used the yeast cake to ferment a nice tart strawberry cider.

 

[Aschecte]

I brewed this in 9/2012, bottled after two months. Pitched Goose Island Sophie dregs on brew day, and Wyeast 3711 French Saison. Fermented at 68F ambient.

On 2/2013 I brought it to the club meeting and got rave reviews. It came in at 9% abv, dried out to 1.000 but has a thicker mouthfeel. Now in 5/2013: I don't know what the Brett or the saison yeast is supposed to taste like, but I get a lot of artificial cherry, a spiciness on the tongue, and some soft esters (I think). A long--over a minute--lingering taste of cherry and slight funk. Not bad for a first all-grain batch! I used the yeast cake to ferment a nice tart strawberry cider.

If I had to make a guess you used Brett C which is known for a sour cherry aroma and somewhat a funky sweet taste..... the spiciness was absolutely from the saison yeast you co pitched and the soft esters are probably a bit of the mix.... to me it sounds like a great beer !!! Oh yeah btw it's amazing how this beer feel thicker than it really is !!!! mine finished at 1.002 and it does not seem thin at all !!! Brett is great isn't it ?

 

[sbuchan]

I brewed mine back in January, still in the primary. I sampled it a month in and there was a distinct cider taste which is still present 6 months later. The only thing I changed in the recipe was the yeast, I used White Labs Saison II and dregs from a bottle of Seizoen Bretta that I grew up in a starter. Any thoughts? I'm assuming this isn't going to go away after sticking around for this long.

 

[Aschecte]

I brewed mine back in January, still in the primary. I sampled it a month in and there was a distinct cider taste which is still present 6 months later. The only thing I changed in the recipe was the yeast, I used White Labs Saison II and dregs from a bottle of Seizoen Bretta that I grew up in a starter. Any thoughts? I'm assuming this isn't going to go away after sticking around for this long.

I disagree if you added Brett in the mix it is just getting rolling at 4-6 months especially when mixed with Sacch strains...... give it 8-12 months to hit it's prime.... certain brett strains are known for fruity esters and saison II is definitely known for high ester production especially if brewed hot.

 

[Aschecte]

ohhh and another thing do not transfer the beer Brett will eat the Sacch and give off more of the brett character ..... do you know what strain is used in Seizoen Bretta ?

 

[theveganbrewer]

ohhh and another thing do not transfer the beer Brett will eat the Sacch and give off more of the brett character ..... do you know what strain is used in Seizoen Bretta ?

I've got some here that I'm going to put under the scope today or tomorrow to see what's in there. I'll let you know if I spot something.

 

[sbuchan]

I've got some here that I'm going to put under the scope today or tomorrow to see what's in there. I'll let you know if I spot something.

Any thought on what they might be?

 

[theveganbrewer]

I pitched them before I got to look at them, sorry.

 

[m00se]

I brewed this 5 days ago and the gravity's down to 1030. It's been fermenting in a swamp cooler set at 86F. I've read about 3724 stalling around this number. Will the brett eat through that and push it closer to 1000 or should I swirl and crank up the heat?

Gravity sample tasted really good! Great recipe. Thank you

 

[humann_brewing]

So you just did a direct pitch with both 3724 and the dredges, no starters?