Roast 'em, Toast 'em, Smoke 'em If you Got 'em

[Schlenkerla]

Just Dough'd in with this grist....

Hefe Weizen Mit Rauch


Edit :

I mashed for 90 minutes instead of the normal 60 minutes. I thought the diastatic power would be diminished from the smoke and the hotter temps. That was wrong.

Target 1.052 OG @ 5 gallons. Refractometer was 9.0 Brix; converted its at 1.034 @ 6.21 gallons off the sparge. So 81.21% Efficiency. I'm pretty f'ing happy. :rockin:

Just tasted this beer. It's still carbonating, however it has a great smoke flavor and aroma

 

[Jayjay1976]

Wow what a fascinating thread! smoking+DIY+homebrewing, It's a hobby inside a hobby inside a hobby, A turducken of fun! man just when I thought I was about to hop off the spending treadmill, my plans for the next year have just now changed!

 

[Schlenkerla]

Smoked Weizen...oh so tastey

 

[MaxStout]

OK, why haven't I found this thread before? I'm a big fan of anything brewed by Schlenkerla, particularly the Eiche (oak) Doppelbock. Just picked up a bunch of bottles of that from Total Wine yesterday.

I brewed a rauch a while back, using almost 100% Weyermann malt. It was good, but still didn't turn out as smoky as I would've liked. Maybe the smokiness dissipates over time while it's shipped to the US.

Now I need to go back through this thread and pick up some ideas. Need to figure a way to oak-smoke a bunch of base malt without over-doing it.

 

[Schlenkerla]

OK, why haven't I found this thread before? I'm a big fan of anything brewed by Schlenkerla, particularly the Eiche (oak) Doppelbock. Just picked up a bunch of bottles of that from Total Wine yesterday.

I brewed a rauch a while back, using almost 100% Weyermann malt. It was good, but still didn't turn out as smoky as I would've liked. Maybe the smokiness dissipates over time while it's shipped to the US.

Now I need to go back through this thread and pick up some ideas. Need to figure a way to oak-smoke a bunch of base malt without over-doing it.

Glad you found it. I'm surprised there hasnt more interest in this. Anyhow, read through this if you have questions ask me. I'm going to post more about roasting a variety of specialty grains shortly.

Often people make a batch of smoked malt. Then use about 20%. Then step it up down on taste. I'm at 40-50% and liking it. I could go higher. I need to run the gamut of smokes. Right now I've only done apple, maple and cherry. I have oak, pecan, alder and beach to try.

The most important points are to wet grain with distilled or filtered water (must be de-chlorinated water) and smoke without a wicking flame. Then dry it to flash off acetic acid.

What kind of smoker do you have to smoke malts?

 

[Schlenkerla]

Yeah aged grain looses it's smoke but it needs about a year to be significant from what I've read.

Did you add black or roast malt to that beer? I've made a few smoked pale ales without roasted malts. They don't seem that smokey when roasted malt is left out of the grist.

 

[MaxStout]

Glad you found it. I'm surprised there hasnt more interest in this. Anyhow, read through this if you have questions ask me. I'm going to post more about roasting a variety grains shortly.

Often people make a batch of smoked malt. Then use about 20%. Then step it up down on taste. I'm at 40-50% and liking it. I could go higher. I need to run the gamut of smokes. Right now I've only done apple, maple and cherry. I have oak, pecan, alder and beach to try.

The most important points are to wet grain with distilled or filtered water (must be de-chlorinated water) and smoke without a wicking flame. Then dry it to flash off acetic acid.

What kind of smoker do you have to smoke malts?

I don't have a smoker--yet. Something on the to-do list as I expand my brewing ideas. I might try to go ghetto on this, convert an old Weber or something of that sort.

I have lots of scrap cutoffs of various hardwoods (I do some woodworking). Lots of oak, maple and cherry around.

Pulled up my recipe in Beersmith. It was about 95% Weyermann smoked malt, and about 2.5% each of Carafa II and Melanoidin malts. Hallertau Mittelfrueh to about 25 IBU, and WY2308. It definitely was smoky, but the smoke wasn't as strong as I had hoped, kind of muted. I used to do very vigorous boils--maybe that drives off some of the flavor. I used the malt within a month or so of purchasing from Northern here in town. Not sure how quickly that malt rotates in stock--maybe it had been there a while. In any case, I think DIY smoking is the only way to go. Besides, I've never seen oak-smoked malt in stores, only the beech and some cherry-smoked. Never tried the cherry. I believe Schlenkerla smokes all their own.

 

[Schlenkerla]

I don't have a smoker--yet. Something on the to-do list as I expand my brewing ideas. I might try to go ghetto on this, convert an old Weber or something of that sort.

I have lots of scrap cutoffs of various hardwoods (I do some woodworking). Lots of oak, maple and cherry around.

Pulled up my recipe in Beersmith. It was about 95% Weyermann smoked malt, and about 2.5% each of Carafa II and Melanoidin malts. Hallertau Mittelfrueh to about 25 IBU, and WY2308. It definitely was smoky, but the smoke wasn't as strong as I had hoped, kind of muted. I used to do very vigorous boils--maybe that drives off some of the flavor. I used the malt within a month or so of purchasing from Northern here in town. Not sure how quickly that malt rotates in stock--maybe it had been there a while. In any case, I think DIY smoking is the only way to go. Besides, I've never seen oak-smoked malt in stores, only the beech and some cherry-smoked. Never tried the cherry. I believe Schlenkerla smokes all their own.

You're right. The Schlenkerla malts all of their grain. Their kiln process of the malting is what gives it the smoke flavor. They have a fire box about the size of a foot locker that they jam full of wood. The adjacent heat and smoke of the fire does the job of killing the germinated grains. However the heat of kiln is not uniform as they don't add anything to grain bill to make their beers black. Some of the barley kernels just really get brown and some get black from the heat kiln. They use beech most of the year and oak just for the Doppelbock.

If you have a grill you can cold smoke with tin can, pellets and a torch. You just need a space big enough to spread out the grain and be able to contain the smoke. My first batch of smoked meats this year was done on the grill cold. Steaks and chops.

I've done grain both ways. Hot and cold on my new smoker. The cold smoke really amps up the volume of smoke. My work buddies have smokers but have adopted the cold smoking here and there for certain foods. Two of them cold smoked cheese and hard boiled eggs for thanksgiving.

Ah you said you've got oak you want to use. Soak it for a day, meanwhile buy a small hot plate and pie tin. Fill the tin with chips, set it on the hot plate and turn it on. Hot plate would just sit on the grill grates next to the grain. In ten minutes you'll be oak smoking.

Frys electronics has this one for $19.

That would work for using whatever wood chips you have laying about.

The wood you have is not treated right? If it is, you should get wood chips. Oak is pretty common anywhere that sells smoking supplies should have some.

 

[Schlenkerla]

I have noticed that my beers are the smokiest right after pouring a nice head. I think our palates adjust. After awhile I don't notice it as much. That's a pretty much the experience with drinking smoked beer. Both authors of the books I sited said the same thing.

 

[MaxStout]

The cold-smoking on a grill idea sounds great. Perhaps spread the grain over a piece of screen inside the grill. I've heard of some people putting the wet wood chips in a can and dropping a couple lit charcoal briquets into the chips. I have lots of oak scraps, nothing treated. In fact, I might run some of the wood over my router table and collect the shavings.

 

[Schlenkerla]

The cold-smoking on a grill idea sounds great. Perhaps spread the grain over a piece of screen inside the grill. I've heard of some people putting the wet wood chips in a can and dropping a couple lit charcoal briquets into the chips. I have lots of oak scraps, nothing treated. In fact, I might run some of the wood over my router table and collect the shavings.

Sounds like you're ready to make yourself a set of baskets. I bought aluminum screen to make baskets. Then folded them and stapled the corners.

The mesh baskets are a bit flimsy but can be carried on a cookie sheet. Then just slip them onto the grill. Same with taking them off the grill.

 

[MaxStout]

Sounds like you're ready to make yourself a set of baskets. I bought aluminum screen to make baskets. Then folded them and stapled the corners.

The mesh baskets are a bit flimsy but can be carried on a cookie sheet. Then just slip them onto the grill. Same with taking them off the grill.

I like that basket idea. Quick n' dirty and gets the job done. How deep can the grains be in the basket and still get good smoke infusion? Do you stir the grain during the cold-smoking?

 

[Schlenkerla]

I like that basket idea. Quick n' dirty and gets the job done. How deep can the grains be in the basket and still get good smoke infusion? Do you stir the grain during the cold-smoking?

Mine are usually about an inch deep with grain. I could take it up to an inch and half I wanted. I don't stir. You could if you wanted to do so. I don't think it's necessary if you don't have a hot spots beneath the grain. It would help expose more grains to smoke. You'd loose a lot smoke just to open and stir. I think the smoke nestles it's way through the grains.

The grains are a little soft after wetting them so I decided to not stir. It's like shove them in the smoker and then crack open a Schlenkerla, kick back and watch the smoke billow out for a bit.

I smoke my grain about two hours typically.

 

[MaxStout]

Mine are usually about an inch deep with grain. I could take it up to an inch and half I wanted. I don't stir. You could if you wanted to do so. I don't think it's necessary if you don't have a hot spots beneath the grain. It would help expose more grains to smoke. You'd loose a lot smoke just to open and stir. I think the smoke nestles it's way through the grains.

The grains are a little soft after wetting them so I decided to not stir. It's like shove them in the smoker and then crack open a Schlenkerla, kick back and watch the smoke billow out for a bit.

That sounds like a good plan.

I'm already on the kick back with a Schlenkerla part right now. All this talk got me jonesin' for one.

 

[Schlenkerla]

That sounds like a good plan.

I'm already on the kick back with a Schlenkerla part right now. All this talk got me jonesin' for one.

View attachment 549944

Nice glass. I like stem wear and glasses with a wide opening to smell the smoke.

 

[MaxStout]

Nice glass. I like stem wear and glasses with wide opening to smell the smoke.

I like 'em too. Have several similar Duvel glasses. I keep getting a gift of their boxed set with 4 bottles and a tulip glass.

Off topic, but curious about how you traded your Twitter handle for 5 cases of Rauchbier. Did the brewery send a cease-and-desist, or did they just reach out and offer the beer?

 

[Schlenkerla]

I like 'em too. Have several similar Duvel glasses. I keep getting a gift of their boxed set with 4 bottles and a tulip glass.

Off topic, but curious about how you traded your Twitter handle for 5 cases of Rauchbier. Did the brewery send a cease-and-desist, or did they just reach out and offer the beer?

They offered beer and swag.

At first Wiehenstephaner's export manager asked for it belligerently and accused me of wanting to make money. I told them Matthias Trum needed to contact me. I asked why would I give it to another brewery not affiliated with Schlenkerla. Do you want to make money, *******?

Eventually two years later Matthias contacted me we talked and agreed to beer and glasses and a free tour when I visit Germany. I really didn't want much other than beer. I told him that from the start and let him be the first one to make an offer. He told me a bunch about his brewing practice without divulging centuries of family secrets. He seems like a genuinely nice guy.

BTW - You have too have a Schlenkerla glass to drink this beer. LOL

 

[MaxStout]

It's nice to be able to amicably settle differences like that without bringing in lawyers. And I'm an IP lawyer. Glad it worked out, win-win. Interesting that Wiehenstephaner wanted the handle. Probably wanted to use it as leverage against the competition. I've seen that happen with domain names, where a cybersqautter is a direct competitor to the trademark's owner.

If I ever get back to Gemany, Bamberg is on the hit list.

You're right, I do need a Schlenkerla glass. Maybe a couple. I'll look for their swag online.

 

[Schlenkerla]

This morning I soaked a bunch of beachwood. It's a nice light colored wood without any kind of defects and very smooth cut chips. Smoking grain tonight!

Gonna stock up on beech smoked grain for January brewing activities. Good thing with the weather, I'm not going to have to be all that concerned about the risk of high temperature during this session.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Smoking the grain with beech now. Its my first time using beech.... Smells fricken good as hell. It's mild, steamy, and hard to describe, it's smells more like a fruit wood than hickory or maple.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Adding more roasting instructions with lovibond values.

See post 22.

Let me know if this can't be opened. Ok
Thanks.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...sXMOFILbuLpJ3c3SaOOVDVIdD8A/edit?usp=drivesdk

 

[TANSTAAFB]

@Schlenkerla this thread is so full of awesome information, thank you [emoji482]

I see a smoked brew or 5 in my future!

BTW, I made some home toasted malt a couple of weeks ago for a club competition where I couldn't add outside ingredients

While perusing home coffee roasting (cuz I need another hobby...) I came across the idea of using a whirlypop for coffee and immediately thought about using it for grain!

 

[TANSTAAFB]

 

[Schlenkerla]

@Schlenkerla this thread is so full of awesome information, thank you [emoji482]

I see a smoked brew or 5 in my future!

BTW, I made some home toasted malt a couple of weeks ago for a club competition where I couldn't add outside ingredients

View attachment 551711View attachment 551712View attachment 551713

While perusing home coffee roasting (cuz I need another hobby...) I came across the idea of using a whirlypop for coffee and immediately thought about using it for grain!

You're Welcome! - I need another thread participant to bounce ideas off of now and then. You and MaxStout are the only ones who've posted lately. Make me feel less OCD.

My first brew with a home roasted 2-Row was on a Club SMaSH Competition. I converted pale malt to Munich in an IPA triple hopped with Summit. Took first place. Afterwards they asked about the malt, as I told them about converting pale malt to Munich. They considered it cheating, however it was half joking, half serious. I argued its still single malt, 2-row, or pale malt. It was a 10lb grist for 5 gallons. I used 1lb as converted Munich and 9 lbs as plain pale. It was a good tasty, roasty IPA with a nice orange tangerine bite.

For what its worth, I hate buying grain online, don't like having to pay the shipping. My local HBS is fairly disorganized and specialty grains are hit and miss. Getting crystal 20L and 40L are hard to get at times. I've been buying 2-Row for awhile in 55lb bags, so I've decided to make my own roast/specialty malts along with my smoked malts. It adds a uniqueness to all of my beers. Its also very gratifying to say its made only from pale malt.

Cheers!

 

[Schlenkerla]

View attachment 551714

It so funny you were looking at this. Just this morning I have been scouring the web looking for this with 110VAC. These are all 220VAC.

I like the idea a temperature control and the whirly-gig spinning for even browning.

I was thinking of using this only for making darker specialty malts; Chocolate, Black, Crystals over 120L.

Its about $152 on Amazon but you need to buy a step-up transformer to use in the US.

High Quality 220V 1200W Household Coffee Roasters Coffee Bean Roasting Machine Baking Machine

 

[Schlenkerla]

Crap.... 1200 watt step-up transformers are close to 1/2 the cost of the roaster.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Might just have too buy a stir crazy popper and a convection roaster instead....

... then do it like coffee beans.

Look at this link; http://www.uroastem.com/cooling-pan.html.

Or this one; http://coffeegeek.com/forums/coffee/homeroast/15383

 

[TANSTAAFB]

Nope, that's the good ole hand crank popcorn maker! $20

https://express.google.com/product/...campaign=gsx&dclid=CMqW3LipstgCFUt9Ygod_5oP2A

 

[Schlenkerla]

Nope, that's the good ole hand crank popcorn maker! $20

https://express.google.com/product/...campaign=gsx&dclid=CMqW3LipstgCFUt9Ygod_5oP2A

I'm lazy and I can't crank that and hold my beer at the same time. LOL

Looks like a three hand operation.

I need electric ....

 

[TANSTAAFB]

I'd prefer electric too but I've got a Whirlypop I've never used sitting in a cupboard! I'll be very interested if/when you come up with something affordable and workable