Belgian Blond Ale Revvy's Belgian Blonde (Leffe Clone)

[JWasheville23]

I am doing a PM version of this recipe today:
OG: 1.064
IBU: 22.51

Mini-Mash at 158 for 45 minutes in brew kettle with 1.25 qt per # of grain
2.5 # Pilsner
5.5 oz Melanoiden
5.5 oz Biscuit
1 # Munich

Sparge at 168 (by "dunking the grains" in a separate kettle for 10 minutes, then pouring that same water over them into original kettle)

Boil 90 Minutes
6.6 # Pilsner LME (90 min)
2 oz Styrian Goldings - Alpha 3.7 (60 min)
1 oz Saaz -Alpha 3.6 (15 min)
10.6 oz Sugar (15 min)
Yeast Nutrient and Whirlfloc (10 min)

Abbey Ale Yeast (White Labs)

I will let yall know how it turned out in a month or so . . .

 

[Kharnynb]

great recipe, tastes lovely, it's been bottled for 3 weeks and gives a decent head and a nice taste.

I brewed this as a way to have enough 530 for a belgian quad, but it definately is worth it just on it's own merit.

 

[brew703]

BIAB brewer here (not that it makes a difference). I want to brew this next weekend. I've looked at other Belgian Blonde recipes and this is the first one that shows a mash temp of 158. What, if any, difference would it make if I mash at 150-152 for 60 minutes?

Also, the OG shows 1.068 and FG of 1.010. When i entered into brewers friend the OG is 1.061 and FG is 1.017. Would mashing lower reduce the FG?

 

[Kharnynb]

the lower the mash temperature, the lower the final gravity.

Higher mash temps mean less alcohol, but more body.

 

[brew_darrymore]

BIAB brewer here (not that it makes a difference). I want to brew this next weekend. I've looked at other Belgian Blonde recipes and this is the first one that shows a mash temp of 158. What, if any, difference would it make if I mash at 150-152 for 60 minutes?

Also, the OG shows 1.068 and FG of 1.010. When i entered into brewers friend the OG is 1.061 and FG is 1.017. Would mashing lower reduce the FG?

If you use WLP530, your final gravity will be way below 1.017. This yeast is a monster. Beersmith estimates but obviously cannot predict your FG. I usually get 80-85% attenuation with WLP530.

Higher mash temperature means less fermentable sugars and more body. If you mash at 150-152F, and you add sugar on top of that, and you use WLP530, you'll end up with a very dry beer.

 

[brew703]

If you use WLP530, your final gravity will be way below 1.017. This yeast is a monster. Beersmith estimates but obviously cannot predict your FG. I usually get 80-85% attenuation with WLP530.

Higher mash temperature means less fermentable sugars and more body. If you mash at 150-152F, and you add sugar on top of that, and you use WLP530, you'll end up with a very dry beer.

A Belgian Ale is supposed to be dry correct? I do plan on using WLP530 and i plan on adding sugar per recipe.

 

[brew_darrymore]

A Belgian Ale is supposed to be dry correct? I do plan on using WLP530 and i plan on adding sugar per recipe.

Not that dry. As per BJCP style guidelines,

Belgian Blond Ale Vital Statistics:
OG 1.062 - 1.075
FG 1.008 - 1.016
ABV 6-7.5%


Of course, you can make it as dry as you like, if that's what you prefer.

 

[brew703]

I want to try and keep it as close to the guidelines as possible. Lately my gravities have been up so if I can get 1.015 or so I would be happy.

 

[Revvy]

I've looked at other Belgian Blonde recipes and this is the first one that shows a mash temp of 158. What, if any, difference would it make if I mash at 150-152 for 60 minutes?

I provided the explanation in the very first post on this thread as to the mash temp. And yes, it would make a difference, it wouldn't be the same beer, it wouldn't taste like mine, it wouldn't have the same body. People always ask, "if I do this, if I substitute this..." And the answer is "then you'd be making a completely different recipe."

Nothing wrong with that, experimentation is fine... But when you want to make a specific recipe, be it food, or assembling a model kit, or building something from plans, if you want to make it exactly as the person intended, then you follow their instructions.

In this case it's a clone of a specific beer. And to approximate the taste of that beer, THIS is what I did to get there... If you want to make a clone then follow my lead... if you want to make a nice Belgian Blonde then tweak to your heart's content.


On National Homebrew Day I brewed a Belgian Beer based on this original recipe, except I wanted to make a Mesquite Smoked Pineapple Belgian Blonde. I changed the hops to Citra because they tend to have to me a pineapple note to them, and I changed the yeast as well (and I don't have my notes here) to a different yeast that when fermented at a certain temp my research said it tends to create a pineapple flavor as well.

Then on Friday I sliced two pineapples up and macerated them overnight in brown sugar. On Saturday I smoked them in a stovetop smoker for 30 minutes with mesquite chips. I tossed the pineapple back into the plastic baggie with the brown sugar pineapple syrup that had formed overnight. Yesterday I sanitized a hop bag and added the pineapple to the fermenter and then poured the syrup in along with it. I'm going to keg it this weekend, and possible throw either that pineapple or perhaps fresh pineapple into my randall and run my beer through it.

Looking forward to trying it. But I know it's not the same beer it's not going to be a clone of Leffe.

This is a great recipe to experiment with, it's a good base. But if you're trying to achieve a close approximation of what I was trying to achieve (and think I did really well with this one...took a lot of trial and error and research) then sticking to the recipe is the way to go.

 

[brew703]

I provided the explanation in the very first post on this thread as to the mash temp. And yes, it would make a difference, it wouldn't be the same beer, it wouldn't taste like mine, it wouldn't have the same body. People always ask, "if I do this, if I substitute this..." And the answer is "then you'd be making a completely different recipe."

Nothing wrong with that, experimentation is fine... But when you want to make a specific recipe, be it food, or assembling a model kit, or building something from plans, if you want to make it exactly as the person intended, then you follow their instructions.

In this case it's a clone of a specific beer. And to approximate the taste of that beer, THIS is what I did to get there... If you want to make a clone then follow my lead... if you want to make a nice Belgian Blonde then tweak to your heart's content.


On National Homebrew Day I brewed a Belgian Beer based on this original recipe, except I wanted to make a Mesquite Smoked Pineapple Belgian Blonde. I changed the hops to Citra because they tend to have to me a pineapple note to them, and I changed the yeast as well (and I don't have my notes here) to a different yeast that when fermented at a certain temp my research said it tends to create a pineapple flavor as well.

Then on Friday I sliced two pineapples up and macerated them overnight in brown sugar. On Saturday I smoked them in a stovetop smoker for 30 minutes with mesquite chips. I tossed the pineapple back into the plastic baggie with the brown sugar pineapple syrup that had formed overnight. Yesterday I sanitized a hop bag and added the pineapple to the fermenter and then poured the syrup in along with it. I'm going to keg it this weekend, and possible throw either that pineapple or perhaps fresh pineapple into my randall and run my beer through it.

Looking forward to trying it. But I know it's not the same beer it's not going to be a clone of Leffe.

This is a great recipe to experiment with, it's a good base. But if you're trying to achieve a close approximation of what I was trying to achieve (and think I did really well with this one...took a lot of trial and error and research) then sticking to the recipe is the way to go.

Thanks for the info Revvy.

Experimentation is all part of the brewing process and I only asked because there are other Leffe clones that I've read where the mash temp was in the low 150's and a mash time of 60 min- Yours show 45 min I believe.

I just got my hands on a 6 pack of Leffe Saturday and that was the first time I ever tasted a Belgian blonde or any Belgian. I did try Stella a couple weeks ago but actually prefer the Leffe.

Before I go ahead and brew this I just wanted to make sure it turns out like a Leffe and not something else. I'm fairly new to brewing and all of my previous brew's were mashed in the low 150's so this would be my first time venturing higher than 154.

 

[brew_darrymore]

I did try Stella a couple weeks ago but actually prefer the Leffe.

Stella is not a real representative of the Belgian family of beers. It's a lager fermented with lager yeast. Nothing wrong with that, of course.

Belgian blonde, pale ale, and strong dark ales are brewed with Belgian ale yeast strains, producing clove and pepper flavour profiles.

And don't be afraid to go higher with your mash temperature. 154F is not even that high.

 

[brew703]

I'll go ahead and brew as the recipe states. Don't like making changes on a first brew. Just wasn't sure on the mash temps.

 

[Kharnynb]

my batch is almost gone, and it was a great succes taste wise.

Just one thing, has anyone else noticed this beer travels bad? the few bottles i've given to friends to take home have always turned out to be geysers, even though none of the ones at home were and they did rest them for several days in the fridge.

 

[BandonBrewingCo]

Incase anyone is looking for a metric version of this (hops and grain as available) I did it up on Brewtoad

Thinking of trying Mangrove Jack's M47 - Belgian Abbey (dry yeast). Does anyone have any experience or should I stay with the liquid?

Or if anyone can recommend any of the other dry Abbey yeasts?

Edit: I see the dry yeast question has already been discussed

 

[Revvy]

Incase anyone is looking for a metric version of this (hops and grain as available) I did it up on Brewtoad

Thinking of trying Mangrove Jack's M47 - Belgian Abbey (dry yeast). Does anyone have any experience or should I stay with the liquid?

Or if anyone can recommend any of the other dry Abbey yeasts?

Edit: I see the dry yeast question has already been discussed

I'm curious about Safbrew Abbaye Yeast. Here's a comparison article between it and Belle Saison yeast for a saison.

 

[GurraG]

Thinking of trying Mangrove Jack's M47 - Belgian Abbey (dry yeast). Does anyone have any experience or should I stay with the liquid?

Or if anyone can recommend any of the other dry Abbey yeasts?

I am very curious about the Mangrove Jack's Abbey yeast, and have thought about trying it in a Dubbel. If you decide to try it, let us know how it turns out!
I have used Danstar's Abbaye yeast in a dark strong belgian, and wasn't too impressed.

 

[Kharnynb]

danstar abbaye works okay for pale ales to give them a bit of "belgian" flavour, but not for a blonde or real trappist style beer.

 

[griffi]

I brewed a nearly identical recipe last weekend which I found on beersmith. I pitched Safbrew Abbaye because it's what I had. Hoping for the best.

Also did a step mash with Protein rest and mash at 152...

 

[BandonBrewingCo]

I am very curious about the Mangrove Jack's Abbey yeast, and have thought about trying it in a Dubbel. If you decide to try it, let us know how it turns out!
I have used Danstar's Abbaye yeast in a dark strong belgian, and wasn't too impressed.

Will do

I brewed a nearly identical recipe last weekend which I found on beersmith. I pitched Safbrew Abbaye because it's what I had. Hoping for the best.

Also did a step mash with Protein rest and mash at 152...

Let us know how it turns out!

 

[mstrelan]

I'm thinking of brewing this on Sunday, but wondering if anyone here has tried Jamil's Lefty Blond? It seems to be quite a different recipe. There is a write-up about it at http://byo.com/mead/item/2827-belgian-blond-style-profile

I'd be interested to see how they compare. I might just have to brew them both.

 

[griffi]

Mine is on tap now and it's fantastic!

 

[griffi]

Sorry it's sideways but you can see it's got a nice color and a nice head

 

[Baja_Brewer]

I just picked some WLP530 up. Been meaning to try and brew thus for sometime now. Very excited.

 

[zmanzorro]

Brewing this right now. I dropped the table sugar because I don't want the ABV too high because I don't need wedding guests swinging from the rafters. I'm also adding some raspberries in the keg.

 

[Revvy]

Brewing this right now. I dropped the table sugar because I don't want the ABV too high because I don't need wedding guests swinging from the rafters. I'm also adding some raspberries in the keg.

The sugars there to balance the body...leaving it our is going to make for a "heavier" feeling beer. It's less about the alcohol and more about thinning it a tad since it's a rich, dextrinous gainbill for such a "light" colored beers...

 

[zmanzorro]

The sugars there to balance the body...leaving it our is going to make for a "heavier" feeling beer. It's less about the alcohol and more about thinning it a tad since it's a rich, dextrinous gainbill for such a "light" colored beers...

Thanks, I might just boil some table sugar and water on the stove and add it in.

 

[Revvy]

Thanks, I might just boil some table sugar and water on the stove and add it in.

I say it all the time, especially with people wanting to boost a kit recipe with sugar. Recipes are about balance, everything from flavor, color, body, bitterness, head retention is a synergistic interplay of the ingredients, so leaving out, or adding more of one thing, without balancing out the other ingredients will throw the recipe off from the original...

Since we're talking a recipe here as opposed to a kit where people are stuck with the ingredients at hand, we can alter the recipe to suit our needs. Just like you can easily scale a recipe up or down to make a smaller or larger batch with beersmith or other good software, or by hand, we can alter aspects of the like in your case the ABV, without throwing off the, for lack of a better word, "integrity" of the recipe.

In beersmith, you have several buttons right at the top that allow you to convert an existing recipe to extract/pm/ag as well as adjust an entire recipe in terms of Gravity (which is the one you'd want to use) or Bitternes or even Color.... These buttons will allow you to shift an entire recipe based one on of those paramaters, but will do so while at the same time maintaining the other aspects of the recipe...

So lets say you wanted the same recipe profile of the recipe, but in 3.2 abv strength, it would shift ALL the quanities, hops, malt, sugar, etc to accommodate the lesser gravity.. It would still have the same body, bitterness, color, etc. but the abv you desired....

Think about that for future batches, and all your beers.

 

[Baja_Brewer]

I'm curious about Safbrew Abbaye Yeast. Here's a comparison article between it and Belle Saison yeast for a saison.

Did you ever try this? I'm going to do back to back batches and pit it against the WLP 530 I have... Just wondering if I should build a starter for the dry yeast since I will be for the liquid yeast (I have two expired vials)...

Edit: I'll probably just pitch it after rehydrating, per instructions http://www.fermentis.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/SFB_Abbaye.pdf

 

[zmanzorro]

I say it all the time, especially with people wanting to boost a kit recipe with sugar. Recipes are about balance, everything from flavor, color, body, bitterness, head retention is a synergistic interplay of the ingredients, so leaving out, or adding more of one thing, without balancing out the other ingredients will throw the recipe off from the original...

Since we're talking a recipe here as opposed to a kit where people are stuck with the ingredients at hand, we can alter the recipe to suit our needs. Just like you can easily scale a recipe up or down to make a smaller or larger batch with beersmith or other good software, or by hand, we can alter aspects of the like in your case the ABV, without throwing off the, for lack of a better word, "integrity" of the recipe.

In beersmith, you have several buttons right at the top that allow you to convert an existing recipe to extract/pm/ag as well as adjust an entire recipe in terms of Gravity (which is the one you'd want to use) or Bitternes or even Color.... These buttons will allow you to shift an entire recipe based one on of those paramaters, but will do so while at the same time maintaining the other aspects of the recipe...

So lets say you wanted the same recipe profile of the recipe, but in 3.2 abv strength, it would shift ALL the quanities, hops, malt, sugar, etc to accommodate the lesser gravity.. It would still have the same body, bitterness, color, etc. but the abv you desired....

Think about that for future batches, and all your beers.

Yeah, I get that. With this recipe, I'm not as concerned OG/IBU ratio, as the style tends to be more on the malty side (since the added sugar would throw off the current bitterness). I wasn't necessarily going for an exact Leffe Clone with this brew, just a proven Belgian Pale Ale. Thanks again for the recipe!

 

[Revvy]

I just discovered the "convert button" on Beersmith which will convert recipes from one form to another, so I just attempted to convert this recipe from AG to Extract...this is what came up...

If anyone wants to brew the all extract version and let us know, that would be really helpful. I'm surprised it doesn't use pilsner extract, but if this works it's easier for most brewers to get than pilsner extract.

Extract version.

5 lbs 9.9 oz Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract 2 57.8 %
5.9 oz Amber Liquid Extract (12.5 SRM) Extract 3 3.8 %
3 lbs 7.1 oz Sugar, Table (Sucrose) (1.0 SRM) Sugar 4 35.4 %
1.18 oz Styrian Goldings [5.40 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 5 19.3 IBUs
0.62 oz Saaz [4.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 6 5.7 IBUs