Reliable source for lower AA British-style hop cones?

[BryanMaloney]

Returning to brewing after decades' hiatus. I see pellets and cry everywhere. Is it always a treasure hunt to find Goldings and Fuggle cones, or are there reliable sources in the present day?

 

[DuncB]

I have to grow my own!

 

[Bobby_M]

Returning to brewing after decades' hiatus. I see pellets and cry everywhere. Is it always a treasure hunt to find Goldings and Fuggle cones, or are there reliable sources in the present day?

The longevity of whole cone is abysmal. What is your motivation for using them over pellets?

 

[BryanMaloney]

The longevity of whole cone is abysmal. What is your motivation for using them over pellets?

Yes, the inevitable response from the pellet-devotee. First, I have never had hops around long enough for there to be problems. In addition to brewing beers, they are excellent cooking herbs. I happen to brew beers that use aged hops, as well, so, I've intentionally kept them around for a year or so. Second, I don't like dealing with hop sludge. I get it, I'm a bad person for not being hip and with it. It's funny, when I ask about hop cones, NO MATTER WHERE, there must be some pipsqueak who has to pipe up and wonder WHY ON EARTH I DARE to deal with those nasty-wasty, ickypoo old hop cones. I mean, it's positively PRIMEVAL of me, isn't it?

 

[DuncB]

If a top brewery uses Whole cones rest assured they work.
Jaipur by Thornbridge is stuffed with whole cone hops, Timothy Taylors and Harveys use loads as well. They act as a great filter bed as well. I'd use more if I could get them.

 

[BryanMaloney]

And don't forget how they help with a cold break. It turns out that they can help proteins nucleate as you chill the wort.

 

[mac_1103]

It's funny, when I ask about hop cones, NO MATTER WHERE, there must be some pipsqueak who has to pipe up and wonder WHY ON EARTH I DARE to deal with those nasty-wasty, ickypoo old hop cones. I mean, it's positively PRIMEVAL of me, isn't it?

Dude, chill. Seriously. Bobby is not a pipsqueak and he didn't jump down your throat. He just asked a simple question. And he also happens to be one of the most knowledgeable and helpful regulars on this board.

 

[kevin58]

Yes, the inevitable response from the pellet-devotee. First, I have never had hops around long enough for there to be problems. In addition to brewing beers, they are excellent cooking herbs. I happen to brew beers that use aged hops, as well, so, I've intentionally kept them around for a year or so. Second, I don't like dealing with hop sludge. I get it, I'm a bad person for not being hip and with it. It's funny, when I ask about hop cones, NO MATTER WHERE, there must be some pipsqueak who has to pipe up and wonder WHY ON EARTH I DARE to deal with those nasty-wasty, ickypoo old hop cones. I mean, it's positively PRIMEVAL of me, isn't it?

Dude! Chill the *** out! Bobby is one of the most respected members on this or any other beer forum. He gave you one daw back for whole hops and then asked a simple question.

I have an answer for you as to why English whole hops are difficult to find but you don't deserve it.

 

[Bobby_M]

Yes, the inevitable response from the pellet-devotee. First, I have never had hops around long enough for there to be problems. In addition to brewing beers, they are excellent cooking herbs. I happen to brew beers that use aged hops, as well, so, I've intentionally kept them around for a year or so. Second, I don't like dealing with hop sludge. I get it, I'm a bad person for not being hip and with it. It's funny, when I ask about hop cones, NO MATTER WHERE, there must be some pipsqueak who has to pipe up and wonder WHY ON EARTH I DARE to deal with those nasty-wasty, ickypoo old hop cones. I mean, it's positively PRIMEVAL of me, isn't it?

Yeah. Sorry. My mistake. I asked because I have owned and operated a homebrew supply shop for the last 11 years and curiosity got the best of me. I'll learn to just shut my mouth if I don't have the exact answer you were looking for.

 

[Kickass]

Cranky doesn’t normally last long here. Entertaining, but short lived.

I’m another vote for grow your own. It’s fun, rewarding and satisfies your goal.

 

[kevin58]

Yeah. Sorry. My mistake. I asked because I have owned and operated a homebrew supply shop for the last 11 years and curiosity got the best of me. I'll learn to just shut my mouth if I don't have the exact answer you were looking for.

Your input is always valuable Bobby. Don't let the ass-hats keep you silent.

 

[hungupdown]

Home grown, is good for late additions. But with an unknown AA, they're dodgy to use for bittering.

Not sure if 'hop cones' you mention, is the same as 'leaf hop' in UK. Here, leaf hops are readily available for Fuggles and EKG, and maybe 25% of the hop types (though you have to shop around).
I'll often buy hard to get leaf hops if I see them available, even when not planning on using them for a while. I store them cool.

I much prefer leaf to pellets. As others have said (about cones), they (the leaves) act as a filter bed. Meaning less trub is is transferred, rather than adding hop sludge.
When using leaf, I know for sure (I can see), that no boil hops go to the fermenter.

 

[Bobby_M]

Home grown, is good for late additions. But with an unknown AA, they're dodgy to use for bittering.

Not sure if 'hop cones' you mention, is the same as 'leaf hop' in UK. Here, leaf hops are readily available for Fuggles and EKG, and maybe 25% of the hop types (though you have to shop around).
I'll often buy hard to get leaf hops if I see them available, even when not planning on using them for a while. I store them cool.

I much prefer leaf to pellets. As others have said (about cones), they (the leaves) act as a filter bed. Meaning less trub is is transferred, rather than adding hop sludge.
When using leaf, I know for sure (I can see), that no boil hops go to the fermenter.

If they're called "leaf hops" it's definitely a misnomer because there are no leaves in there. The industry term is "whole cone hops". The cones are harvested and dried are packaged short of pelletizing. Most of the imports from Europe to the U.S. are pelletized because it's cheaper to ship as they are volumetrically about 4x smaller. Pelletizing also purges the oxygen out so they stay fresher for longer. This has nothing to do with how fast the end user brewer will use them. From a supply chain perspective, a distributor doesn't want a product that's dying quickly in storage. Most U.S. brewers have adapted their process and equipment to deal with pellet hops, primarily by whirlpooling post boil. As an example, this is the wort I transferred to my fermenter today and it had 4 ounces of pellet hops in a 5 gallon boil. I'm not seeing a problem.

So as not to trigger any sensitivities, be clear that I'm not suggesting anyone is inferior for liking whole cone hops.

Of course you'll find whole cone Fuggle and Goldings in Europe. Any U.S. grown hops found in Europe will likely be pelletized. Any whole cone you find in the U.S. are likely to be grown here as well. Freshops.com for example. I understand that mimicking older processes can be a fun side-aspect of the hobby but it's quite practical to adapt to modern techniques and enjoy the fresher products that are available year round.

Afterall, are we trying to brew the best beer possible or doing a historical reenactment project?

 

[Snuffy]

I would love to try whole hops in a brew, but I would know going in that I’m increasing the complexity and reducing the effectiveness of the hopping process. I’m not a sludge fan either, but I can recognize the benefit of the exposure to more hop essence in a pellet vs flower. I would probably try and grow some if this was important to me. It’s not. I’m for quality vs quantity every time. You should be given a break for not understanding the landscape. I am also awaiting the answer to your initial question. Might be valuable info - even if it’s like preferring 8-tracks to CDs.

 

[Witherby]

Returning to brewing after decades' hiatus. I see pellets and cry everywhere. Is it always a treasure hunt to find Goldings and Fuggle cones, or are there reliable sources in the present day?

I have bought them directly from Stocks Farm in the UK. Shipping was outrageous but very nice hops.
https://stocksfarm.net/shop/

I have been able to source whole cone hops from Slovenia and Germany also. I really like to use them for late hop additions.

This year I finally have hops on my Fuggles, Goldings, and Sterling hop bines growing in my backyard. So excited!

 

[Yooper]

Yes, the inevitable response from the pellet-devotee. First, I have never had hops around long enough for there to be problems. In addition to brewing beers, they are excellent cooking herbs. I happen to brew beers that use aged hops, as well, so, I've intentionally kept them around for a year or so. Second, I don't like dealing with hop sludge. I get it, I'm a bad person for not being hip and with it. It's funny, when I ask about hop cones, NO MATTER WHERE, there must be some pipsqueak who has to pipe up and wonder WHY ON EARTH I DARE to deal with those nasty-wasty, ickypoo old hop cones. I mean, it's positively PRIMEVAL of me, isn't it?

I'm leaving your post here, but mostly to show what NOT to say to others who are helpful and respectful.

Just because you prefer one ingredient and feel them (and yourself) superior does not give you the right to rude to others. And you calling someone a pipsqueak is still name calling, and deserves to be called out.

 

[G_robertus]

If they're called "leaf hops" it's definitely a misnomer because there are no leaves in there. The industry term is "whole cone hops". The cones are harvested and dried are packaged short of pelletizing. Most of the imports from Europe to the U.S. are pelletized because it's cheaper to ship as they are volumetrically about 4x smaller. Pelletizing also purges the oxygen out so they stay fresher for longer. This has nothing to do with how fast the end user brewer will use them. From a supply chain perspective, a distributor doesn't want a product that's dying quickly in storage. Most U.S. brewers have adapted their process and equipment to deal with pellet hops, primarily by whirlpooling post boil. As an example, this is the wort I transferred to my fermenter today and it had 4 ounces of pellet hops in a 5 gallon boil. I'm not seeing a problem.
View attachment 881825
So as not to trigger any sensitivities, be clear that I'm not suggesting anyone is inferior for liking whole cone hops.

Of course you'll find whole cone Fuggle and Goldings in Europe. Any U.S. grown hops found in Europe will likely be pelletized. Any whole cone you find in the U.S. are likely to be grown here as well. Freshops.com for example. I understand that mimicking older processes can be a fun side-aspect of the hobby but it's quite practical to adapt to modern techniques and enjoy the fresher products that are available year round.

Afterall, are we trying to brew the best beer possible or doing a historical reenactment project?

Botanically speaking flowers are mostly made up of modified leaves (petals and sepals, though I'm actually not sure hops have both) so technically they do contain leaves. Hopefully not the ones used for growth, but the term is not wrong even though you wouldn't call pellets "shredded leaf hops".

Here in Europe it's hard to find anything in whole form actually. Wholesalers do have them at times, but smaller stores do not always have as many options. Even at wholesale the options are far more limited compared to pellets. We do get some American varieties in whole form, but it's a lot rarer. Not to mention hops from the southern hemisphere, although I could only source whole cone Rakau when I was looking for it last year.
I'd suggest checking any store you can really, or looking for local growers and ask if you can get them before they're pelletised. You won't have UK terroir, but it's something.