quick question on carboys...

[the_bird]

Greetings,

Fleshing out my brew kit this weekend. First up is a glass carboy to use as a secondary (I've got a basic kit now that just comes with the standard platic primary and bottling buckets). Assuming standard 5-gallon batches, am I better off getting a 5 gallon carboy (to minimize extra oxygen), or a 6.5 gallon? The oinly reason I might go for the latter is that I'm sure at some point I'm gonna want to switch to glass for primary, just 'cause I wanna see what's going on in there...

Thanks!

 

[Boston]

You can't go wrong buying the 6.5 gallon carboy. Good for both primary & secondary.
BTW, were you able to hook up w/ any brewers from Western Mass? You may want to try the VT boys, too, there are several on this forum.
Jeff

 

[Beer Snob]

Well if your going to be using it as a secondary, then a 5 is the way to go. Generally you dont want to use a 5 as a primary cause of the mess it could cause, 6.5 gives you much more room. I've seen some people use 6.5 as secondaries but its not really the best idea. The CO2 that is in it will protect it for a little while (or so I have read people advise), but one thing thats nice about using a secondary is that you can give yourself a little more time to bottle if your life gets a bit hectic (read... you get on the lazy side). You would not want your beer sitting in a 6.5 gal though for very long. I'd stick with getting a 5. You got a bucket now and getting a secnodary will improve your beer! Get the 6.5 when you get another $18.

 

[the_bird]

Just what I expected - two conflicting answers!

Next vote decides...

 

[Beer Snob]

Not only that but we posted them at pretty much the exact time too

 

[brackbrew]

Let's make it two-to-one in favor of the 5 gallon. The extra air space is not something you want in a secondary fermenter, plus Beer Snob is right...for one reason or another you won't be able to bottle when you want; the limited amount of head space in the 5-gallon is great if you want to condition the beer in it and/or just let some of the extra 'stuff'--i.e. protein coagulations, redundant yeast, etc--settle out of the beer. You'll probably want to go all glass at some point, but when you do, buy the 6.5 gallon one then...and get a carboy bung NOT A STOPPER, so don't push it through into the beer!

BREW ON

 

[kornkob]

If you're kegging then there's nothing wrong with using a 6.5 as a secondary since you can purge the oxygen with a little push from your CO2 tank.

And as for getting a carboy bung--- skip the bung for glass carboys and get carboy caps instead. No risk of pushing it into the vessel at all. The only reason I have bungs in my kit at all is because a) dad used them so I almost have to have them because he did and b) little ones for liter bottles of yeast starters.

You'll love glass not only cause you can watch it brew but it's so much easier to show off to your non-brewing friends when you can point at it and say 'see that? I made it'. So much more dramatic than what appears to the unitiated to be a paint bucket with a wierd thingy sticking out the lid. That and I dress my carboys in cool tshirts.

 

[ajf]

Another vote for 5g, again to keep oxygen out.
In fact I'd get two 5g carboys for secondaries before thinking about getting a 6.5g for a primary as I keep my brews in he secondary about twice as long (or longer) than I do in the primary, so I need twice as many secondaries as primaries

-a.

 

[Spyk'd]

5 gallon or two(hey, they're cheap) is the way to go for all the reasons listed above, less headroom and less funky air. I would definitely have AT LEAST TWO, due to the fact that some beers you make, you're going to want to keep in the secondary longer and you don't want them to hold up your next batch. It's true you can purge 6.5's with CO2, but hey you're just starting out, right?

Bungs, stoppers, caps.....yep, they all work.

 

[Sneakysnitch]

I use both. 6.5 for primary, 5 for secondary. I'd get the 6.5 first so you can make a FULL 5 to 5.5 batch. If you are gonna do Belgians, the extra room is great and will keep you from having to clean your celing. If I make a bit too much, I just drink the uncarbonated 1/2 gal or so. You can always downsize to the 5.

 

[Sneakysnitch]

BTW, if the secondary is active at all, the co2 from the yeast will automatically purge it from the o2. Don't get me wrong, I like the 5 for secondary, but if you can only have one or two....

 

[Indiana Red]

BTW, if the secondary is active at all, the co2 from the yeast will automatically purge it from the o2. Don't get me wrong, I like the 5 for secondary, but if you can only have one or two....

Agreed. While less head space is better ingeneral, in no time youve got mostly CO2 in that space, no matter how much room there is. That said, on a full 5gal batch, I like to see my secondary/conditioning carboy, full.
HBers are allways looking for the next thing to upgrade their system, at least I am. But a nice plateau is 1 6.5 for primary which usually takes only a week or so and 2 5's as secondarys sometimes sit for a while and you don't want to get log jammed on your next batch.
Thats what I do anyway.

 

[Glibbidy]

what's 2 gallons between friends?
6.5 gallons will give you extra room if you need it.
5 will likely require a blowoff tube rigged up.
They both work just fine.

 

[olllllo]

I have a 6.5 and a 5. I use the 6.5 for primary and the 5 for secondary.
The 6.5 is great for not having to worry about blowing off your airlock. That being said, back in the day, if you used a 5 for the primary, you used a blowoff tube.

The krauesen that escapes via a the blowoff will contain resins which can cause an off bitter flavor, so you get rid of these at the expense of a few ounces of beer.

 

[SpecialEd]

A book I got about brewing, (Palmer), "there are two sizes commonly available, a 6.5 gallon size which is perfect for primary fermentation, and a 5 gallon size which is ideal for secondary fermentation. The large size typically has enough headspace to contain the krausen, while the 5 gallon size almost completely eliminates the headspace above the beer, preventing oxidation during the conditioning phase."
As for me im a newb, havent secondary fermented a batch yet but when I get a secondary it will be a 5. good luck.

 

[SteveM]

No one mentioned a six gallon one, which is what I got. I use it only for secondary. Five seemed a little small and 6.5 was bigger than I needed. The price span was not a driver, but this may be unusual. They were like $25, $27 and $29.

 

[tnlandsailor]

Ok, here is an opinion that goes against the conventional wisdom.

The biggest reason to use glass is that, if properly cleaned, it won't harbor any bacteria and won't scratch. Which makes it the perfect vessel for a primary, not a secondary. Primary fermentation is where most infections happen. Once the beer ferments in the primary and is put into a secondary, it is less susceptible to infection. Now, am I suggesting a plastic secondary, HELL NO! I think plastic fermenters should be banned from homebrewing altogether. It's just that if you are thinking about glass, go glass all the way.

Now, regarding the size issue. If you buy all your carboys in the 6.5 gallon size, you won't have to worry about all those different sizes. That is what I did. I have 3 and just pick the next carboy in sequence and it doesn't matter if it's primary or secondary. When you secondary your beer, there will be some fermentation that occurs, at least 3 or 4 points worth, which will put enough of a blanket of CO2 on top of the beer to protect it from the off chance of oxidation. Purging the carboy in advance with CO2 will elininate the risk altogether. Frankly, if you are careful, you won't notice a thing. Having your carboys all the same is worth more than the miniscule risk of oxidation with an extra gallon of head space in a 6.5 gallon carboy.

Just another in a long list of completely biased opinions.

Prosit!

 

[Beer Snob]

No one mentioned a six gallon one, which is what I got. I use it only for secondary. Five seemed a little small and 6.5 was bigger than I needed. The price span was not a driver, but this may be unusual. They were like $25, $27 and $29.

Man.... you need to buy carboys somewhere else.... your paying WAY too much for them....

 

[the_bird]

Appreciate all the comments, although I don't think a consensus was ever achieved!

Given the relatively low cost of carboys (I was originally working under the assumption they were more like $40, not $20), I'll be picking up both a 6.5 and a 5.0 this afternoon (HBS considered Sunday to have been Memorial Day, so the brew's unfortunately been sitting in the primary too long... oh well, learning experience, hopefully it's still as tasty as it was a couple days ago). I'll use the 5.0 as my main secondary (my "primary secondary?"), and the 6.5 as my "primary primary."

So, thanks again!

 

[mysterio]

6.5, I say. As kornkob says, a blast of CO2 will sort out any oxygen problems.

Plus it leaves your options open for using it is a primary, or making an extra gallon of beer - which can never be a bad thing.

We are clearly getting ripped off for carboys in Scotland. £22 ($41) for one here. No wonder most people use plastic buckets.

 

[olllllo]

If I recall correctly, the carboys we get here in AZ are made in Mexico. Not sure if that influences the prices elsewhere.

 

[Beer Snob]

Appreciate all the comments, although I don't think a consensus was ever achieved!

HA!.... if you think we can't come to a consensus about this.... ask about aluminum brew pots.....

 

[the_bird]

OK, bought a 5 gallon only for now, on the advice of the HBS guy. Will get a 6.5 at some point, but not a priority.

Here's another question, though; is there any such thing as a 3-gallon carboy? Another post today made me think of this, that I'd like to start experimenting a little bit with different things, dry hopping, maybe some different fruits in the secondary for SWMBO - but I'd rather split a 5-gallon batch into two 2.5 gallon batches, either right at the stage of primary fermentation or at the stage of secondary. (there are only so many people in the house who drink, and thankfully we're not alcoholics). I could then either have two separate experiments going, or one experiment plus a "control".

So, does anyone sell a smaller carboy, or something similar that could be used for this purpose?

 

[olllllo]

Here's another question, though; is there any such thing as a 3-gallon carboy?

Yes, its called a mug.

Better bottle has a 3. I'm considering getting 5 and 6.5 with ports at some point. There's quite a bit of discussion about these recently.

 

[Beer Snob]

Sure ....

Northern does....
http://www.northernbrewer.com/ferment.html

Austin does...
http://www.austinhomebrew.com/index.php?cPath=178_53_148

 

[the_bird]

You know, as soon as I posted, I went and Googled and found tons of them available...

D'OH!

Google - THEN post the question... I need to get that tattooed onto the back of my hands or something...

Thanks again, guys.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Man.... you need to buy carboys somewhere else.... your paying WAY too much for them....

I would tend to agree. You can call your local Culligan and they will deliver a glass carboy with brewing water to boot!!! I have not done it for almost 5-6 years though. I don't think its nowhere near $40...

Can you imagine the look on the face of the Culligan man as drops off your new clean carboy and he picks up the spent one with 1" layer of trub on the bottom of the darn thing!!!! May have to leave a couple cold ones for him....

Perfect brewing water & a sanitized carboy. What a service!!!

FYI - You have to ask for glass otherwise you'll get plastic.

Found this web site - Pretty cheap $10.55 for a glass carboy w/ 5 gallons of spring water. +$6 for deposit.

Do this once or twice to get a cheap source for carboys....

http://www.lindyspring.com/bottledwater.asp

Any local water place should do this.