Putting together an electric home brewing system

[mmahu]

Hello there,


I am putting together my first ever electric system, which I plan on ordering from https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/

I need help choosing the right mash tun, HLT, boiler, fittings, hoses, temp controller to control temp when mashing and boiling, etc.

Would it be possible to get some assistance with the complete list of equipment I need?

 

[cegan09]

Need a lot more info to be able to help give suggestions.

What size batches do you want to make? How complicated do you want the system? Do you want it to be in any way automated, or everything manual? How much experience do you have putting together systems like this? (meaning can you build a controller, or are you looking to buy a pre-assembled one)

Start with the vessels. Sounds like you're looking to do traditional HERMS 3 vessel? Decide on batch size, then find vessels that meet that requirement. What elements you choose will depend again on batch size, and what power you have available.

 

[kh54s10]

If you are going to order stuff from Brew Builder, I would think that they would be happy to assist you. You will get better advise from them, especially about what equipment that they sell, that will give you what you want.

Advise given here might include things that they cannot supply.

 

[mmahu]

I knew I forgot something. The batch size would be from 10 to 20 L / 5 US Gallons ), which is the smallest of the mash tun offerings.

I am in the process of inquiring the owner, but I thought I would get a few tips from you.

I only want a simple system, with a HLT, Mash tun and Boiler, connected for easy transfer from one to another. All 3 vessels should have temp control, as I do not want to take temp measuments all the time. Valves and fittings, hoses, a plate chiller ( can see they have more than enough ), etc.

NOTE: I wrote 33 L as the batch size, but I was actually thinking of the smallest mash tun available for the brew builder, which is 33 liters. That would allow batches from 1 to 5-6 US gallons. ( wort in the fermenter )

 

[kh54s10]

If you are truly looking for a simple system I would continue researching. A BIAB system would be far simpler and require only one vessel.

That said, my ideal setup would be a 3 vessel electric. I am only looking to do 5 US gallon batches so I wouldn't need as big pots as you will.

 

[mmahu]

If you are truly looking for a simple system I would continue researching. A BIAB system would be far simpler and require only one vessel.

That said, my ideal setup would be a 3 vessel electric. I am only looking to do 5 US gallon batches so I wouldn't need as big pots as you will.

I corrected my last reply, as I wrote 33 L batch, but that is the capacity of the mash tun, resulting in 5-6 gallons or less per batch.

I put some things in the basket and it seems it goes up to about 1500-2000 pounds, which is not neccesarily expensive.

 

[highland_brewer]

Don't know if this is helpful or not but you might be able to convert over the parts on one of the parts lists here to your vendor?
Parts lists

Its a start at least...

Cheers
Brian

 

[mmahu]

I am reviving this thread. I have looked on the https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/index.php? website and I think I want the following:

1 x Mash tun: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/high-end-mash-tuns.html - 50 L
The mash tun needs a false bottom to size: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/custom-cut-false-bottom.html
Thermowell ( due to the double walls on the mash tun ): https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/thermowell.html
Flexible temp dial: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/3-flexible-any-angle-temp-dial.html
Recirc tap: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/3-way-ball-valve-l-port.html

2 x TC kettles: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/tc-tanks.html
Taps: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/weldless-3-piece-tap-kit.html
2 x Temp dials: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/3-flexible-any-angle-temp-dial.html
2 x Pick up tubes: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/1/2-pickup-tube.html


Plate chiller: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/125kw-30-plate-chiller.html
HERMS coil: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/25ft-herms-coil.html
2 x HERMS fittings: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/herms-bulkhead-fitting.html
2 x Pumps: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/ts5-mini-mag-pump.html

2 x Electric elements: http://www.ebrewsupply.com/complete-heating-element/ ( 4500 or 5500 ULWD )

And some hoses, fittings, barbs and anything else needed.

Would that work?

 

[doug293cz]

I am reviving this thread. I have looked on the https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/index.php? website and I think I want the following:

1 x Mash tun: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/high-end-mash-tuns.html - 50 L
The mash tun needs a false bottom to size: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/custom-cut-false-bottom.html
Thermowell ( due to the double walls on the mash tun ): https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/thermowell.html
Flexible temp dial: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/3-flexible-any-angle-temp-dial.html
Recirc tap: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/3-way-ball-valve-l-port.html

2 x TC kettles: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/tc-tanks.html
Taps: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/weldless-3-piece-tap-kit.html
2 x Temp dials: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/3-flexible-any-angle-temp-dial.html
2 x Pick up tubes: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/1/2-pickup-tube.html


Plate chiller: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/125kw-30-plate-chiller.html
HERMS coil: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/25ft-herms-coil.html
2 x HERMS fittings: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/herms-bulkhead-fitting.html
2 x Pumps: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/ts5-mini-mag-pump.html

2 x Electric elements: http://www.ebrewsupply.com/complete-heating-element/ ( 4500 or 5500 ULWD )

And some hoses, fittings, barbs and anything else needed.

Would that work?

Unless I missed it, I don't see anything about a control panel in there. You need to be able to control the amount of power going to your heating elements in order to maintain your HLT temp and control your boil vigor. Manual switching, or plugging/unplugging, is not a viable option.

Brew on

 

[mmahu]

Thank you, doug293cz.

I presume I need a control panel for 2 elements. How much would such one cost?

Can I order it from US or would it be able to order it from Europe as well?

Any links you can provide, I would be very grateful.

PS: I know http://www.ebrewsupply.com/ have them, but they sound a bit overpriced?

I admit, I have no idea what it should cost.

 

[cegan09]

The controller is going to be a fairly substantial portion of your cost. They are not trivial, however there are options.

1. Full blown all in one controller
These are like the ones you see on The Electric Brewery, or like the ones you listed on eBrewsupply. Basically this is one control panel that you connect everything to at once and you cycle things on and off as you get to different steps. Most expensive but the least work during brewing.

2. Smaller controller that you swap around during stages
You can save some money and go to a single controller with single output like the one that Auber sells. Downside here is you will be swapping which element is plugged in depending on where you are during brew day. Same with temp sensors. Works just as well, but requires more work during brew day.

3. Bare Bones
Auber sells some bare bones table top kits. These are a single controller, a single temp sensor, and a single output for an element. You'll need to power all pumps manually through other means. You'll need to swap around what is plugged in depending on what stage you're at in brewing. Most work on your end, but most cost savings.

4. DIY for any of the above.
You can build your own or any of the above by sourcing the parts from any of a number of sources. However you need a good understanding of wiring and electricity. You do not want to end up hurting yourself. I went this route and I'm happy with the outcome.

5. Fully automated controllers
I know the least about these. But you can build panels that are highly automated using something like the BCS-460 or 462. Probably the most expensive and time consuming to construct, but cool if you want crazy control over everything.


Note there are plenty of other places to buy kits or complete panels. I just happen to know the Auber site well and have done a lot of reading at the electric brewery. Those are good places to get a baseline before deciding a route you'd like to go.

 

[doug293cz]

As @cegan09 stated, the cost of a control panel will depend on how much functionality it has, and whether you build yourself, or buy pre-built. The simplest DIY controller can be built for less than $100 - $150 (depending on choice and source of components.) You can spend up to several thousand $ if you want lots of function. The first questions you need to answer are about the minimum level of function that is acceptable to YOU.

• Are you willing to plug and unplug the elements and temp sensors for your HLT and BK to switch between them?
• How many pumps do you need? Do you want them to be controlled by the same panel as the elements?
• Do you need timer and/or alarm functions for your panel?
• Do you want lighted switches (light up when they are on), or plain switches?
• Do you want a volt, amp and/or power meter?
• Do you want interlock circuitry to protect you from consequences of operator error? If so, what kind of interlocks?

As you can see, you can rapidly make things more complicated and more expensive.

I have designed numerous control panels for US use, and could design the basics for a UK panel, but am not familiar with the different plugs, receptacles, etc. used outside of the US. If you want to continue discussing just what you want, I am willing to help where I can.

One last item from one of your earlier posts; You mentioned using a plate chiller. I suggest you think very carefully about this choice. Plate chillers are very effective, but they can clog very easily, and are almost impossible to clean completely. Counterflow chillers are almost as effective as plate chillers, but their internal wort flow path is much simpler and more open, and thus they are more resistant to clogging, and easier to clean internally.

Brew on

 

[mmahu]

cegan09 and doug293cz : very insightful replies and I thank you both.

The shop I am trying to buy from has these: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/hlt-temperature-control.html - from what I gather, it can cotnrol a 3500 W element, whcih should suffice my needs. The Boil kettle element can simply run 100% and I will adjust the sparge water to compensate for the vigorous boil off.

 

[augiedoggy]

This is overkill for you and your current needs since a $40 stilldragon kit will do everything you need currently but..

I have built a few budget controllers including the one in my avatar pic for under $300... I now use a "Brucontrol" software based control panel which even thought the software cost like $100, is still cheaper that a hardware based system if you plan on controlling more than 2 elements. Its also WAY more flexible in adding upgrades down the road. I used a $12 arduino mega as the brain and a $16 relay board along with a few ssrs and 25a relays for most of it. I can automate if I want down the road but currently Im just using it to control my brewery and conical temps via a chiller and heat strips on a few conicals.

I also use a plate chiller. As mentioned they clog easily if you dont use some sort of filtering for the hops like a hop spider..

 

[doug293cz]

cegan09 and doug293cz : very insightful replies and I thank you both.

The shop I am trying to buy from has these: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/hlt-temperature-control.html - from what I gather, it can cotnrol a 3500 W element, whcih should suffice my needs. The Boil kettle element can simply run 100% and I will adjust the sparge water to compensate for the vigorous boil off.

That thing is way overpriced for it's function. Should cost $50 US at most.

Also, according to the linked site, ordinary UK domestic outlets are limited to 13A max. This is not enough to drive a 3500W element (14.6A @ 240V, 15.2A @ 230V, or 15.9A @ 220V. Sorry, don't remember offhand where UK mains voltage typically falls.)

Finally, folks are starting to question the wisdom of "over boiling." Apparently there is some data to indicate that over about 10% total boil-off can start to thermally stress the wort and create precursors that accelerate staling. 3500W may be enough to bring this into play, so there may be a reason to want to reduce power during boil. Also, some people suggest using an element with just enough power to boil your batch size, but then heat up to boil takes a really long time, and you have little batch size flexibility.

Brew on

 

[kh54s10]

Another consideration is that you will NOT want to run the element at full power during the boil. Especially at the height of the hot break. There are simple controllers that will have a power control. You run the element on full power until near boiling then turn it down.

I don't know any UK sources, but there must be some.

A simple one is going to be similar to this: http://www.highgravitybrew.com/store/pc/Wort-Hog-EBC-130-Electric-Brewery-Controller-272p5041.htm

 

[BrunDog]

I ageee with Doug, plus you can't really temperature control at the boil.

 

[augiedoggy]

cegan09 and doug293cz : very insightful replies and I thank you both.

The shop I am trying to buy from has these: https://www.brewbuilder.co.uk/hlt-temperature-control.html - from what I gather, it can cotnrol a 3500 W element, whcih should suffice my needs. The Boil kettle element can simply run 100% and I will adjust the sparge water to compensate for the vigorous boil off.

I also am willing to bet that controller is for controlling fridge temps with a mechanical relay and does not use a solid state relay which is really needed for a reliable long term solution where rapid switching of the element is needed for temp control and an even boil.

It appears to be a cheaper single control $12 STC1000 variant in a $7 box for well over $100 US..

Something like this is really what you should be looking for if keeping it simple and cheap is your goal.

http://stilldragon.com/index.php/diy-large-controller.html

heres the European version but apparently all the components are sold separately there.
https://www.stilldragon.eu/en/23-controller-parts