Priming a March with an 'autovent'

[Yorg]

Hi,
Here is a wee vid that shows the Watts vent seen/discussed here and on the Brewtroller board as a way of allowing a March (or any other flooded inlet type) pump to prime itself without human intervention.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Yergs?feature=mhum

(Oh and you don't need the electrics as they are part of a larger project scope, its a passive mechanical device, which avoids having to move hoses or turn valves to get the priming.)

 

[Simphoto02]

Any other links and or info? This looks cool.

 

[kladue]

Interesting to see the people using the Watts autovents after installing them on BeerThirtys rig over a year ago.https://cdn.homebrewtalk.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=25150&cat=all&ppuser=20875. These worked well venting both sides of the pumps and eliminating the priming issues you would have had with the plumbing.

 

[Yorg]

Yes, that's where I first saw them.
Do you still feel it necessary to put them on the inlet side?

 

[Yorg]

Any other links and or info? This looks cool.

Not really, other than to say you can buy them online on the Grainger site.

 

[Sawdustguy]

It's funny but when building my first rig I had some priming problems and my brother who is in the plumbing and heating business suggested an autovent. This was about 6 months before Beerthirty's post. I thought my brother was yanking my chain until I saw Beerthirty's post. I felt like an idiot after reading the post and my brother broke my chops something fierce.

 

[IrregularPulse]

Nice $10 solution.

 

[Hogcrewer]

So if you mount one of these on your rig it needs to be level correct? I have a couple on my heating system for the house. Never thought of putting them on the brew rig.

 

[Atl300zx]

also how are these being cleaned and sanitized?

 

[Sawdustguy]

also how are these being cleaned and sanitized?

Thats why he has it on a cam lock fitting. He can remove it and take it apart for cleaning and sanitizing (it comes apart real easy as the top simply unscrews).

 

[Simphoto02]

So do they have to be mounted level or can they be mounted at a 45* or 90*? Upside down?

 

[kladue]

Since they are a float actuated vent, vertical only.

 

[Bixter1]

Any part numbers? I couldn't find anything that made sense to me.

 

[BackDorr]

This is nice for someone who has priming issues. I don't have any, though, which leads me to wonder why some people have priming issues. Maybe from the way they mount the pump? I have it mounted at the bottom of the stand, outlet pointing up, just like everyone else...

 

[Bixter1]

My issues are tightening things up and air is going to get in no matter what do to the way I have things setup. An autovent for a few $$ would be a welcome addition.

 

[BackDorr]

Ah, yes, I see. Air is getting in... is water/wort coming out from anywhere? Is there some orifice above the water level (I don't know, like a tube connected to the bulkhead) that would draw air in? There's gotta be a pay of fixing the problem without buying anything.

 

[DeafSmith]

I had problems with losing prime when pumping from a kettle I use to heat strike and sparge water. The kettle had a dip tube from the center to the ball valve, then 4 feet of tubing to the pump mounted about a foot below the kettle. I noticed that if I continually stirred the water in the kettle while pumping I didn't lose prime. This caused me to suspect the dip tube might be the source of the problem, so I removed it, leaving only a coupling inside the kettle attached to the nipple, and have had no more problems. My theory is that I was getting steam or air bubbles collecting inside the dip tube.

 

[Bixter1]

I like to do both. Anyone have any links to where I can buy them?

 

[kladue]

Here is a link to the Grainger page http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/WATTS-Automatic-Dual-Air-Vent-3EJF8?cm_mmc=Google%20Base-_-Plumbing-_-Valves-_-3EJF8
Here is one from DrillSpot http://www.drillspot.com/products/602535/watts_1_4_duo-vent_npt_hot_and_cold_automatic_dual_air_vent

 

[Dgonza9]

I'm getting ready to hard plumb my system using an autovent. I'm basically going to vent it just like a sink and use the auto vent. What I wanted to mention here is that the priming issue is not about air getting into your system, from what I understand. The issue is that as water flows it must push the air already in your pipes out and creates suction behind it. This pressure created from the flow of water must be relieved by having air come into the system. Hence, the auto vent.

Please correct me if I am wrong on this. I assume it's just like any other plumbing fixture. It must be vented properly or it will gurgle and siphon other fixtures in your home, no?

 

[Catt22]

I'm getting ready to hard plumb my system using an autovent. I'm basically going to vent it just like a sink and use the auto vent. What I wanted to mention here is that the priming issue is not about air getting into your system, from what I understand. The issue is that as water flows it must push the air already in your pipes out and creates suction behind it. This pressure created from the flow of water must be relieved by having air come into the system. Hence, the auto vent.

Please correct me if I am wrong on this. I assume it's just like any other plumbing fixture. It must be vented properly or it will gurgle and siphon other fixtures in your home, no?

No, it doesn't work that way with a pump. You will be sucking air into the system with a vent on the suction side of a pump. It's not like a plumbing fixture at all. Plumbing waste systems are normally gravity flow only. Pumping liquids is an entirely different thing. Do yourself a favor and simply add a bleeder valve on the output side of the pump. It's cheap to implement and easy to use.

 

[Dgonza9]

No, it doesn't work that way with a pump. You will be sucking air into the system with a vent on the suction side of a pump. It's not like a plumbing fixture at all. Plumbing waste systems are normally gravity flow only. Pumping liquids is an entirely different thing. Do yourself a favor and simply add a bleeder valve on the output side of the pump. It's cheap to implement and easy to use.

I've been using the bleeder, and it does work exceptionally well. But I hear the auto vent works equally well. $10 and no priming sounds good to me. Sometimes bleeding is messy, and, well I could do without it.

I watched the video again and you are indeed correct. The vent is on the outlet side. So the vent just allows trapped air to escape, thus preventing the air pressure from stopping the pump from working?

Does the auto vent simply need to be anywhere on the output side of the pump or does it have to be at the highest point you are pumping to?

Thanks. Starting to understand. Not the same as an Air admittance valve in plumbing at all.

Can anyone clarify?

 

[Catt22]

The autovent won't work at all for this, regardless of where you position it. Yes, a bleeder valve allows you to purge the air from the pump head, intake hose etc. The ideal location for a bleeder valve is between the pump outlet and the flow control valve.

 

[IrregularPulse]

How can you say it won't work at all when his video shows it working great?

 

[Catt22]

How can you say it won't work at all when his video shows it working great?

Pardon the confusion. I was referring to the plumbing vent shown in this thread:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/need-help-attention-plumbers-214021/

Please disregard my comment.

 

[Flomaster]

I just called my watts rep and was told that the

DuoVent aka Autovent is going to be discontinued.

the other option is a FV-4 unit
http://www.watts.com/pages/_products_details.asp?pid=664

I can get this FV-4 in 1/2" so it would just screw into a tee which I already have.

I like the idea of auto priming and not having to worry about air in my system and for $10 its a no brainer if you ask me.

-=Jason=-

 

[Dgonza9]

Pardon the confusion. I was referring to the plumbing vent shown in this thread:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/need-help-attention-plumbers-214021/

Please disregard my comment.

That's my fault. I was using this photo as an example thinking that the dual auto vent people have used was working like an "air admittance valve" in the plumbing application. Two different devices.

 

[Dgonza9]

So where do you position this vent? Can it go just off the output valve like the bleeder valve would?

Thanks.

 

[Flomaster]

here is a quick down and dirtay MS Paint on how I plan on using my air vent.


Is this going to work for me?

-=Jason=-

 

[rtrevino]

Flomaster keep us posted on if this design works. I am very interested for an upcoming build.