Porter stalled - many reasons and no solution- advice appreciated

[nick1023]

So I brewed a porter after inspiration from Randy Mosher's Radical Brewing great book IMHO.

here are the deets:
yeast: San Diego Super Yeast WL (forgot the number) it was harvested from a previous batch and from my fridge. Yeast starter (normal size- cant remember, i looked it up the "text book" size) 3 days later small krausen, doubled wort waited 2 more days before pitch, it had a medium krausen so it was live (but maybe not ferocious)

8.5 Lbs - 2 row
5Lbs - homemade amber - using Mosher's method turned 2 row into amber
3.5 Lbs - again using Mosher's method (home baked)& 2row (buy in bulk!)
.5 Chocolate
1cup of pecans toasted and grinded (using Mosher's method)

5gal mash water @ 175 F to hit 155F which ended at 150 F after 60 min.
Sparge water was 165/170F keeping temp above 145F

OG 1.066
put 6 oz of cold brewed coffee into fermenter (per Mosher's method)
dry hopped 2 oz amarillo for the second week
after two weeks and no airlock activity gravity was 1.025

Racked to corny - using as secondary/corny-took hops out
waited another week
Gravity still 1.025 (about 60% attenuation)
temps the whole time probably around 70-73F which is COLD for Houston (indoors with my heater going) because normally it is 75-80 in the house during the spring/summer (then i use my fridge to ferment).
what shall I do?

From my research i see a few possible culprits for my problem:

-Old yeast - yeah but I reused old yeast before with a starter and it didnt stall on me.
-Higher temp to mash 155 instead of 150/145 ?
- Lower temps than what I usually ferment at?
- High proportion of these "roasted grains" ?
-Coffee added ? (also there is a weird black fuzz floating on top and I think it is coffee that got through the filter)



From the threads I see a few options:
-Pitch more yeast - I would do a dry yeast cuz Im lazy and it is cheap, English ale or another recommended strain (alcohol tolerant) this would make sense if it was the yeast that was the culprit
-Add beano - heard bad things - would dry out the beer ?
- Add Amylase powder - heard this would help if Mash didnt work right- would make sense if mash temps too high/too much roasted grains
-Do nothing - dont worry, have a homebrew...
- It tastes ok but maybe a bit on the sweet side

What do you think?
What would you do if this was your beer?

 

[kingwood-kid]

I would guess all those toasted grains added a lot of unfermentables. I would try another small starter of the San Diego and pitch it at high krausen. If that doesn't work, and it's still too sweet, you have other options. Adding more coffee or some cocoa powder would give you a little bitterness, as well as complimentary flavors. Aging on a few oak cubes will give you some drying tannins, as well as an excuse to age a big, dark beer. Carbonating it will help--CO2 is acidic.

 

[Braufessor]

I agree with repitching an active starter.... I have done that with success. It is the easiest and has the best potential.

Another possibility is barrel aging it if you have ever kicked around that idea..... You generally want a fairly sweet beer going into a barrel to start with or it will come out too thin, dry and harsh.... might be a candidate if you have ever thought about it.

 

[Rcbandl]

With the high mash temp and the home made roasted grains I wouldnt expect much better than 1.025. and roasting your own grains is touchy. especially when your using a large amount.

-Pitch more yeast
NO, if you used a starter and it was active its not the yeast. adding more yeast almost never works anyways as it needs o2 and doing anything to add o2 will oxydize the beer.

-Add beano -
No clue, doesnt sound like a good idea

- Add Amylase powder -
Too late. Goes in the mash not boiled/fermented beer.

-Do nothing - dont worry, have a homebrew...
If its drinkable, this is the way to go. It almost never works out when you start trying to fix fermented beer. Maybe let it age a bit if its not quite right.

 

[Imperator85]

From the threads I see a few options:
-Pitch more yeast - I would do a dry yeast cuz Im lazy and it is cheap, English ale or another recommended strain (alcohol tolerant) this would make sense if it was the yeast that was the culprit
-Add beano - heard bad things - would dry out the beer ?
- Add Amylase powder - heard this would help if Mash didnt work right- would make sense if mash temps too high/too much roasted grains
-Do nothing - dont worry, have a homebrew...
- It tastes ok but maybe a bit on the sweet side

What do you think?
What would you do if this was your beer?

1) Pitching more yeast wouldn't hurt.
2) I have never heard of anyone adding this, and I wouldn't expect it to be generally useful at best.
3) Past the ideal time to add amylase enzyme. It's also doubtful your FG is solely a result of your mash temp.
4) Given everything you listed for the recipe, you probably have enough flavors in there to mask the higher FG. A higher than expected FG is not necessarily a bad thing.

 

[philosofool]

If it shows residual sweetness, as from undermented simple sugar, re-pitch. If not, it's probably fermented.

Honestly, this sounds like what porter was like (minus the Brett) around 1850. By the way, if you hate what youhave and you like Brett or sour beer, this is probably a good candidate for that. It's not sure fire, but if you have the space to try it, it's better than dumping.

 

[nick1023]

Thanks for the replies!

So just a quick update.. I posted on 2/4/15 and hadn't checked the gravity since 3 days before. I confirmed with a gravity check on 2/5/15 that indeed nothing was happening and it was still sitting at 1.025. I decided to use amylase E(based on this advice)and re pitch based on the sugguestion a few of you gave. Instead of doing another starter of the San Diego, which I feared was a little limp after a year in the fridge, I just used Safale dry American 05. I did this on 2/5/15 and here we are on 2/8/15 a full 3 days later and I have noticed a small layer of white-ish yeast forming on top of the black "foam" (it was indeed residue coffee grinds and mold). I have it in a corny that is not CO2 sealed (I'm just too lazy and the risk is low IMO) so I cannot monitor airlock bubbles but I just did a check and it has dropped to 1.023. I took a little taste of the sample and the cloying sweetness is not so harsh but I am not so sure it is just being over ridden by the fresh abundant yeast. Either way, it tastes just a little bit more like beer which I am happy about and we are heading in the right direction (lower gravity) even though it may not end up in the teens. I will post again when I rack and chill into the serving corny and probably a few weeks later for a taste note.

 

[nick1023]

reply fail

 

[nick1023]

Another possibility is barrel aging it if you have ever kicked around that idea..... You generally want a fairly sweet beer going into a barrel to start with or it will come out too thin, dry and harsh.... might be a candidate if you have ever thought about it.

I hadn't thought about this but I don't have a barrel. I want beer too soon and don't have patience this time. Where could I get one for a future endeavor?

 

[nick1023]

1 week after the repitch and it is down four points to 1.021 from the 1.025 stall point at two weeks (brew date was 1/17/15). I am going to let it go for another week to bring it into the teens hopefully. I have been tasting it at each sample and I am satisfied but think the new yeast is still working.....

My guess is that the original San Diego Super Ale re-used yeast wasn't strong enough after long storage and it pooped out early. I could've stepped up the starter two more times over an extra week but I was ready to brew that weekend. Lesson? Just buy new yeast (and dry yeast if in a hurry) and don't be a cheap ass.

 

[Braufessor]

I hadn't thought about this but I don't have a barrel. I want beer too soon and don't have patience this time. Where could I get one for a future endeavor?

You can usually google them - especially for new ones. Often though, some of the bigger homebrew stores/websites will have them for sale from distilleries from time to time.... 5-10 gallon varieties. They are not always in stock, but they do show up somewhat regularly if you watch for them.

 

[chickypad]

My guess is that the original San Diego Super Ale re-used yeast wasn't strong enough after long storage and it pooped out early. I could've stepped up the starter two more times over an extra week but I was ready to brew that weekend. Lesson? Just buy new yeast (and dry yeast if in a hurry) and don't be a cheap ass.

You don't think the amylase had anything to do with it? I was wondering about the home toasted malt and effects on fermentability as well, there's quite a bit in the recipe.