Picobrew Z

[Oleary]

I got a reply from support. Z1 is not upgradeable, 120v only. Z2 is 240v and can add on additional modules later to make it a 3 or 4.

The Z1 is not expandable to the Z2 and above due to the 120 V vs 240V electrical hookup. The Z2 is expandable to the Z3 or 4.

Hmm, I asked info@ and was told it was upgradable. I'm at work, but I'll reply to their message when I get home. I don't see me upgrading in the near future, but definitely want the capability.

 

[cubsfan16]

My guess is for the Z1 they will have you send back then send you a Z2, then from there it’s just adding a module.

 

[macgyuver]

delete

 

[macgyuver]

Ok here is the answer I got for my email I sent in, This should help several questions be answered. This will be a little long for a post...



Mike B (PicoBrew Inc.)

Feb 16, 15:58 PST

Hi!

Thanks for contacting PicoBrew. Yes, our FAQ's are woefully incomplete - we're updating them daily to address the questions.

Is the Z1 upgradable? - yes! We'll have an integrated solution, most likely a power controller. You will need 220/240V available, similar to an electric clothes dryer outlet, when you go to Z2 through Z4.

Is each ring, module, independant? - Yes the Pico-Z is modular and independent. Each system can run a different brew at the same time.

Any dimensions? - Dimensions are similar to our current Zymatic, I believe that's 20" x 18" footprint or so. Pico-Z will probably be a bit narrower. Our design spec target is to fit 19" rackmount, but if not, we'll have our solution available. You won't need racks for the Z2 stack, just Z3 and Z4.

How much grain can the filter hold? - Step filter grain limits are similar to Zymatic - 9 lbs. A good Zymatic user can achieve efficiencies in the mid-70%'s and therefore about 1.090 OG; it's more about ingredient choice, mash steps/fermentability of the wort, etc. than the equipment.
I do a high-efficiency multi-step mash with a dough-in step and a good, long beta rest for maximum fermentability. And, there's no sin in using additional malt extract or even dextrose or sucrose - that's the secret to a good, dry mouthfeel IPA as well as the trick to perfect Belgian Tripel (along with good oxygenation and a bit of zinc addition post-mash). Most larger pro craft breweries use some malt extracts to adjust post-mash gravity.

Can I use a single vessel to all units? - Each Z module uses it's own keg for the brewing process, but you can use the Z pumps to transfer your wort into a larger fermenter and combine for larger batches. I know that's what I'll be doing as I brew on a 1/2 bbl system at home and have larger fermenters.

Hope this helps!

 

[TheHygienist]

I get the impression that I could part out my Z2 into two Z1's if the purchaser bought a power controller. If that top piece is a power controller. Not that I would, but it would be nice to have that option if I rarely needed a 5 gallon batch of anything.

 

[carlk47]

 

[macgyuver]

I get the impression that I could part out my Z2 into two Z1's if the purchaser bought a power controller. If that top piece is a power controller. Not that I would, but it would be nice to have that option if I rarely needed a 5 gallon batch of anything.

I Like where you are heading, I always try and think of ways to improve something. I don't think you need a power controller though you need is the brain. If you look at the Z1 and Z2 the Z2 has extra rings on top of both sections, I believe that is the power controller but the top piece is what is controlling everything. If what we have been told on several occasions from different emails you will not have to worry about splitting it though, the Z2,3,4 actually operate separately overall. If you brew the same thing in each step filter you will get 2.5g x step filter amount of brew or if you brew different things in each step filter you get individual 2.5g brews.

 

[macgyuver]

View attachment 559078

If these are the final dimensions then I will be racking mine in a wall mount rack beside my wall mounted conical and give a single vessel a try or two...

I figured the wattage of the heaters would be around where they are. If they hope to stay in the 120v area, 240v if you are running more than one at a time, they have to be around that wattage. just wish it was a little higher.

Wifi should be in the AC range by now if not at least N, those chips are very cheap. With it being in the B/G range I will have to run another router just for the Z to keep my AC network running properly. I hope they up that chip to something newer...

 

[Oleary]

I finally received my response about the upgrade (same answer Macgyuver received with a bit more information):

Saloni (PicoBrew Inc.)
We haven't quite drilled down on the upgrade specifics and pricing for going from Z1 to Z2/3/4 but we will offer a path to do so. We will either provide a higher voltage option of Z1 or bring in your unit to make the updates necessary to upgrade your Z1 when you choose to scale up your Z.

Hope this helps!

Cheers,
Saloni

Leaning toward getting the Z2 just to avoid the hassle..

 

[Anyhowe]

I love the 2.5 gal quantity. Maybe I need to drink more or get more friends. I easily enjoy brewing once a week (If not more). So once the pipeline is set I get 3-5 beers on tap. Any more than 2.5 gallon batches and I lose some freshness. YMMV

 

[TheHygienist]

Given the capacity of the Z2 and purpose-built continuous use, I’m thinking it’s a wort-generating machine any brewers club would want to take up a collection and purchase. Granted, it would need to be housed somewhere, but can you imagine the popularity of this machine among a group of people who want to go all-grain but also don’t want to invest in their own all-grain operations? I think every brewer supply business in the country would want to have the 10 gallon system running in the back. And every brewing club would want a 5 gallon system to play with.

 

[macgyuver]

In theory I agree with you but I would wait if I was a club or Buisness. Pico has been great with their support but there have been some issues with the OGZ. So I would wait and see how the Z series performs before making plans like continuous brewing for a club/Buisness.

 

[TheHygienist]

In theory I agree with you but I would wait if I was a club or Buisness. Pico has been great with their support but there have been some issues with the OGZ. So I would wait and see how the Z series performs before making plans like continuous brewing for a club/Buisness.

It would be nice to know how the pre-sales have split out. I suspect it’s been mostly us home brewers. At $1.5K or $2K a pop, 2.4M in sales is only, let’s say around 1,400 purchasers. The number is sort of underwhelming, even if sales double or triple through July. Fortunately the Zymatic doesn’t seem to suffer from bad reviews. The issues probably weren’t that bad? as I’ve had trouble finding serious critical reviews. What were the worst or most significant? Do you have confidence in Pico to correct those issues?

 

[Denny]

I was interested, but this seems totally underwhelming. Basically stacking together multiple zymatics to increase batch size seems pretty goofy. Further, suggesting that brewers are going to start commercial breweries with a 10 gallon system is nuts.

I believe they're referring to selling Paks of your recipes, not starting a brewery.

 

[Denny]

You've always been able to do that with the Zymatic. It sounds like the 'Z' will continue with that approach. The Pico Paks were just for their smaller Pico systems.

The Z will be able to either your own ingredients of Paks.

 

[r4dyce]

Man, more power to those that want and can afford this, but I just really don't get it. I'm not being a hater I just don't see the advantage here.

 

[TheHygienist]

The advantage? 1) probably built to last 2) documentation of the process 3) cleanup cycle 4) recipe flexibility with kit or own recipe 5) mature product cycle 6) introductory price 7) personally I’m going from extract/bottles to all-grain kegging 8) automation 9) 2 or more recipes at once 10) future flexibility 11) something to blow my tax rebate on 12) lifetime cost per batch is low 13) cool gadget factor 14) makes other people feel baffled 15) wife doesn’t care 16) I’m old enough to buy cool crap for myself, and in 30 years I’ll probably be dead.

 

[Conodor]

The advantage? 1) probably built to last 2) documentation of the process 3) cleanup cycle 4) recipe flexibility with kit or own recipe 5) mature product cycle 6) introductory price 7) personally I’m going from extract/bottles to all-grain kegging 8) automation 9) 2 or more recipes at once 10) future flexibility 11) something to blow my tax rebate on 12) lifetime cost per batch is low 13) cool gadget factor 14) makes other people feel baffled 15) wife doesn’t care 16) I’m old enough to buy cool crap for myself, and in 30 years I’ll probably be dead.

Perfectly said.

Did anyone order the Distillery? i ordered a Z2 and the Distillery add on. I ordered a z2 system because due to a busy schedule this will help me be able to brew more often. Currently I'm lucky if i can brew a few times a year. I hope this will help.

 

[r4dyce]

The advantage? 1) probably built to last 2) documentation of the process 3) cleanup cycle 4) recipe flexibility with kit or own recipe 5) mature product cycle 6) introductory price 7) personally I’m going from extract/bottles to all-grain kegging 8) automation 9) 2 or more recipes at once 10) future flexibility 11) something to blow my tax rebate on 12) lifetime cost per batch is low 13) cool gadget factor 14) makes other people feel baffled 15) wife doesn’t care 16) I’m old enough to buy cool crap for myself, and in 30 years I’ll probably be dead.

I mean I'd question #1. Otherwise sure the automation is great. it's just at these volumes and price point I don't see many of these as advantages over other semi-automated or traditional systems. Regardless I hope it works out for you.

 

[macgyuver]

Perfectly said.

Did anyone order the Distillery? i ordered a Z2 and the Distillery add on. I ordered a z2 system because due to a busy schedule this will help me be able to brew more often. Currently I'm lucky if i can brew a few times a year. I hope this will help.

Distillery? Do you speak of the PicoStill?

 

[TheHygienist]

I mean I'd question #1. Otherwise sure the automation is great. it's just at these volumes and price point I don't see many of these as advantages over other semi-automated or traditional systems. Regardless I hope it works out for you.

The thing is, I could go other routes if someone made a compelling argument for a specific route to take, that wasn’t solely cost driven. If there are better outcomes to be had, I would want to consider them, cost factor aside. But clearly anyone considering this particular solution is not driven by cost. I have the coin. If I didn’t, I would try to find an equally good experience and perhaps exchange more labor for lower cost. However, when all is purchased, and time/labor factored in, I believe I will have spent close to that Z and really, close is good enough, considering other advantages of the system. There are intangibles as well. Sort of like the sound my flat-plane crank naturally aspirated V8 when I hit 8500 rpm. It makes me smile. I believe in more smiles per mile. I believe I will get some smiles out of the Z, knowing that a cruder system will still break someday, and if it did, I’d be on my own to troubleshoot and fix it. I’d rather box it up than spend hours dinking with it. At my age I’ve dinked with enough crap to keep it going. Philosophy now is drink, travel, go fishing, drive, don’t dink.

 

[macgyuver]

Dilly, dilly.....

No dinky, dinky

 

[Conodor]

Yes PicoStill.

 

[gamerc]

I went ahead and placed an order today. I'm a sucker for automation, and I've been happy with their previous offerings.

 

[TheHygienist]

There appears to be no threads on the picostill. Anyone using one and getting good results? I’d be interested if I could make a variety of flavored moonshine without going blind.

 

[Conodor]

It's not released yet. I think the release date is march or april. I ordered one, but limited info out there on it. Almost none actually.

 

[Dilbert Fizzwinkle]

It's not released yet. I think the release date is march or april. I ordered one, but limited info out there on it. Almost none actually.

The release for the PicoStill is supposed to be this month. I am also curious whether or not it will be available for the Pico Pro/S brew keg or just for the Pico C.

 

[Dilbert Fizzwinkle]

I’d be interested if I could make a variety of flavored moonshine without going blind.

Just try it until you needs glasses!

 

[Conodor]

Just try it until you needs glasses!

The little bit i found on it says it has a separate area the "bad stuff" goes. like a small jar. and you pour it out. or start a camp fire maybe!

 

[jrcrilly]

At the current discount price, I am confident that the Z2 is an even better value than my original Zymatic was when I bought it. Given how pleased with my old unit I am after 40 plus brews, I am considering the upgrade.