Partigyle: XXX, XX, and X

[bransona]

Hey, all. I hope the beginner's forum is appropriate for this thread. I'm looking to brew my first partigyle and I want to go with the traditional English three-beer batch. Strong ale, common, and mild. I do strictly biab, so keep that in mind.

I'm thinking something like a Wee heavy, a hoppy ale for the common, and then something imaginably like an Irish red/mild. Or, a Russian imperial, a porter, and a dark mild.

So, how the heck do I do this?!

My inclination from research is to mash my first (XXX), drain bag but don't sparge, move to another kettle of heated strike water, mash for the common, then repeat for mild and actually sparge this one.

Will this make three beers? Will there be enough enzymes for each batch to convert? Should I be adding part of the first batch to the second two for gravity and enzymes?

I feel basically clueless beyond "mash, mash, mash and sparge." I'm really taking a shot in the dark here. I honestly have no idea how to calculate gravity for these, and thus I don't know how to handle hop additions. They don't have to be perfect beers the first time, but I don't want swill or something that's 2.5% abv. I could recharge the grains each time, but that defeats the purpose of saving money.

I'm considering aging each of these on a different wood, but that won't come until I have a partigyle down pat.

Any and all help is greatly appreciated

 

[Revvy]

Read my old thread Let's Partyyyy(gyle) that is!!!! Pumpkin Porter AND Ale from one mash!?! from beginning to end, and you'll see how I started with not being able to get my head around how to do it, to figuring it out in "real time" while I was literally posting to the thread.

 

[broadbill]

Hey, all. I hope the beginner's forum is appropriate for this thread. I'm looking to brew my first partigyle and I want to go with the traditional English three-beer batch. Strong ale, common, and mild. I do strictly biab, so keep that in mind.

I'm thinking something like a Wee heavy, a hoppy ale for the common, and then something imaginably like an Irish red/mild. Or, a Russian imperial, a porter, and a dark mild.

So, how the heck do I do this?!

My inclination from research is to mash my first (XXX), drain bag but don't sparge, move to another kettle of heated strike water, mash for the common, then repeat for mild and actually sparge this one.

Will this make three beers? Will there be enough enzymes for each batch to convert? Should I be adding part of the first batch to the second two for gravity and enzymes?

I feel basically clueless beyond "mash, mash, mash and sparge." I'm really taking a shot in the dark here. I honestly have no idea how to calculate gravity for these, and thus I don't know how to handle hop additions. They don't have to be perfect beers the first time, but I don't want swill or something that's 2.5% abv. I could recharge the grains each time, but that defeats the purpose of saving money.

I'm considering aging each of these on a different wood, but that won't come until I have a partigyle down pat.

Any and all help is greatly appreciated

I think partigyle is not multiple mashes, but a Mash-sparge-sparge deal:

Strong-liquor/first runnings from mash
Common-first sparge
Mild-second sparge

 

[IslandLizard]

There was a good article in one of last year's Zymurgys on how it was done historically.

One thing that stood out the most:
All beers from the partigyle included fractions of first runnings! I think that important detail gets often forgotten or omitted and IMO, if not adhered to, can yield thin and poorly flavored beer in the lower gravities.

 

[Homercidal]

There was a good article in one of last year's Zymurgys on how it was done historically.

One thing that stood out the most:
All beers from the partigyle included fractions of first runnings! I think that important detail gets often forgotten or omitted and IMO, if not adhered to, can yield thin and poorly flavored beer in the lower gravities.

This makes sense. I've saved second runnings before, but it wasn't what I thought it would be. I didn't have any extract to add, so I basically threw it out.

If you want to do a 3-way partigyle, then I recommend mashing a LOT of grain, and collecting as much first runnings as possible. Then you can add some of it to the second and third runnings to adjust your gravity.

You can also add second runnings to a second mash and mash with it. Not sure what that's called.

 

[IslandLizard]

This makes sense. I've saved second runnings before, but it wasn't what I thought it would be. I didn't have any extract to add, so I basically threw it out.

If you want to do a 3-way partigyle, then I recommend mashing a LOT of grain, and collecting as much first runnings as possible. Then you can add some of it to the second and third runnings to adjust your gravity.

You can also add second runnings to a second mash and mash with it. Not sure what that's called.

I often use 3rd runnings to steep and sparge dark grains (>200°L) on the side, outside the boil. The dark potion gets added after flameout, at around 180°F. I think it tastes smoother that way and has none of the boiled coffee flavors I can detect in many, but not all, dark brews.

 

[botigol]

I came across the following article and sample recipe/procedure a couple of weeks ago:

https://beerandbrewing.com/VUpBSygAANqiT-1n/article/practical-parti-gyle-brewing

https://beerandbrewing.com/VUppQSgAANqiULPV/article/no-math-parti-gyle-old-ale-ipa-and-esb-recipe

The article gives the math.

 

[bransona]

Read my old thread Let's Partyyyy(gyle) that is!!!! Pumpkin Porter AND Ale from one mash!?! from beginning to end, and you'll see how I started with not being able to get my head around how to do it, to figuring it out in "real time" while I was literally posting to the thread.

Thanks for the link!! I've been through the thread a couple of times, and it's incredibly helpful. I'm gonna be brewing my house porter tomorrow morning, and I was thinking about running a practice partigyle.

I've been tweaking it for a while now, and this time the malt bill is pretty extensive. I bet it'd make a good mild/brown partigyle, and I'm not after perfection on a first attempt :fro:

1.5 Gallons
3lb 2-row
7oz Pale Chocolate
5oz Munich
2oz Aromatic
2oz Melanoidin
1.5 C120
1oz Black malt

It started from Founder's porter recipe and is on it's 5th remake now. Gravity is estimated at 1.075, but that's at 75% efficiency. I frequently end up with about 82%, but I'd rather underestimate if anything. At that gravity, I'm thinking I'll batch sparge once as normal, then sparge a third time (more thoroughly) and make a smaller, maybe 1 gallon, batch. I'll mix in some amount of the main beer, likely a pint or so, just to make sure it's got enough flavor and body. Like I said, perfection isn't the goal. I'll just play with it and see. At worst, I waste some time and hops and still wind up with beer :rockin:

 

[passedpawn]

My experience: If you make X gallons of a beer with an OG of Y, the second beer will be X/2 gallons of a Y/2 OG beer.

E.g., if you make 10g of a British Wee Heavy (17C) at 1.080, you can use the same mash to make 5g of a 1.040 Scottish Heavy ale (14B).

 

[bransona]

My experience: If you make X gallons of a beer with an OG of Y, the second beer will be X/2 gallons of a Y/2 OG beer.

E.g., if you make 10g of a British Wee Heavy (17C) at 1.080, you can use the same mash to make 5g of a 1.040 Scottish Heavy ale (14B).

That's about what I've read. Awesome! Affirmation is good for planning tomorrow's imprompt-brew. Ok, bad puns aside... That estimate makes a hop schedule easier, and I certainly don't mind not having much of the mild. It's really just to help keep the fridge stocked because I have so many brews that need age right now.

 

[bransona]

Here's the recipe, tweaked for the partigyle at 35% efficiency (since I'm using the 3rd runnings, only mixing a pint of the strong beer, and making a gallon instead of .75). I figure it'll be anywhere between 30-40%.

 

[bransona]

Brewing up my practice run! The porter is boiling and that bucket is full of my porter-gyle. I figure I'll end up with beer at the very worst :fro:

 

[Bobby_M]

Using BIAB to do it makes it a little harder to plan for but I would max out the kettle with grain and make the most high gravity wort you can get out of it. Then do a dunk sparge in another pot or bucket with the other half of the total volume you'll need. Now you have a large amount of super high gravity and then moderate/low gravity You can blend proportions of those into three distinct gravities with some precision once you know the strength of both.

You can easily modify the hopping schedule on the fly to stay within the common GU:BU ratios for the style you are brewing.

 

[Revvy]

You can easily modify the hopping schedule on the fly to stay within the common GU:BU ratios for the style you are brewing.

I was just going to post the chart and say the same thing...that's how we did the second running beer on the 5 year barleywine...just too a grav reading and hopped it on the fly with beersmith and this chart.

Take a reading of the runnings, decide what you're shooting for in terms of IBU, then calculate how to get there, with additions.

 

[bransona]

Thanks for the help, guys

 

[bransona]

I think I overshot my volume. 1.025 OG. Ultra mild. I pitched it and will check in a week. Hopefully it's drinkable. If not, I didn't lose much

 

[specharka]

Subscribing to this thread.

My next brew is gonna be a weizenbock / dunkleweizen partigyle (my first as well) so I'd like to see how it's done before I go plowing ahead.

 

[Mexibilly]

I've made several partigyles, one is 15 days into fermentation now and nearing dry hop.
This one is an all cascade pale ale I drew off the grains of a DIPA.
I mashed and sparged the DIPA per normal and heated ~3 gallons of parti gyle RO.
I simply added the water, stirred for a few minutes, drained slow and did a 45 minute boil. This has been my technique so far and generally yields 5 gallons of 7% - 9% and 2 gallons or so of 4% or 5%.
I have a couple of big stouts on deck that I hope to do the same with.