New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[brewski09]

It could be something that only some people are sensitive to so some of us won't ever taste it. Happens all the time with brewing process off flavors that someone will have a "hole" in their palate.

 

[g-star]

I don't think you need lots of yeast in suspension to make these beers and make them well. To be honest, the "yeastier" the beers are, the less I tend to like them. Some of the commercial examples I see that are murky/yeasty/milky..... I just don't think that is what the well brewed versions of this are all about. I sense people sometimes get caught up in chasing a yeast like 1318 because "you need it to make the beer hazy/cloudy." I think seeing a hazy beer that used 007 is a perfect example of that not being the case...... "Haze" comes from things beyond just having lots of yeast left in your beer. "Murky" generally comes from yeast. Often, when beers like this fail, it is because they end up overly "yeasty" as opposed to simply being hazy.

I can't tell you the chemistry behind the pH..... but, I can tell you my personal experience says 1-2 tenths of a pH on finished beer pH does seem to make a difference. I think Brulosopher's recent experiment (even though he was testing something a bit different) shows a similar thing.... If you scroll down in the experiment, look at the two beers when he measured final pH..... 4.39 vs. 4.50. The 4.50 has significant haze in it. The 4.39 is clear. I notice the same type of thing in my beers as well.
http://brulosophy.com/2016/08/08/water-chemistry-pt-5-boil-ph-in-an-ipa-exbeeriment-results/

Not to say there is no yeast left in suspension at all with conan, or other yeast.... I just don't think it is the significant player it is made to be sometimes. I also wonder if that higher pH locks up protein/hop oil/polyphenol along with holding some yeast in suspension????

I agree with almost everything you say here. As to the pH variable, I just have to believe that it is the classic correlation vs. causation effect. It just does not make much sense from a pure chemistry perspective that a difference of 0.1 pH units could alter the primary haze-forming compound formation (hop polyphenols-protein interactions) to a significant degree.

 

[Braufessor]

As to the pH variable, I just have to believe that it is the classic correlation vs. causation effect.

I agree.... I don't have anything other than my observations and some observations of others that makes me consider the role of pH. Certainly do not know a chemical pathway that would explain it. I do know that dry hopping, high levels of dry hopping can result in increase in pH. The higher pH could potentially just be a "symptom" of the process just as the haze is a symptom.

However, the one thing that does still make me wonder about whether pH is a "cause" or "effect" is ( on fewer occasions - because I have not purposely done it) - I have noticed that even in vastly different beers like blonde ales, british beers or even helles lagers...... I have noticed that if I am off on my pH high (5.4's vs. 5.30 in the kettle).... the beers come out hazier, and the breaks happen less/ddifferently, final beer has clarity issues. Not something I have purposely explored, but something I am curious about.

 

[kwadric]

I saw this article a few weeks ago when I was reading about the effect of kettle pH on beer clarity. Limited science included, but interesting:

http://beerandwinejournal.com/proper-boil-ph/

I read in a presentation about brewing German beers that some of the breweries in German adjust mash pH and then adjust the pH in the kettle to encourage better hot break. I think the goal was to avoid using kettle fining.

 

[Braufessor]

I saw this article a few weeks ago when I was reading about the effect of kettle pH on beer clarity. Limited science included, but interesting:

http://beerandwinejournal.com/proper-boil-ph/

I read in a presentation about brewing German beers that some of the breweries in German adjust mash pH and then adjust the pH in the kettle to encourage better hot break. I think the goal was to avoid using kettle fining.

Thanks for posting that link.... I had been looking for that article, but had not been able to track it down.

 

[jbedell2]

Braufessor, I've recently made two batches of this using what you described as your favorite current hop combo: Citra/Mosaic/Galaxy for the two whirlpools and Citra/Mosaic for the two dry hops. It's amazing. For my next batch, I'd like to change it up a bit just for variety. Can you give a few of your other favorite combos these days? Thanks.

 

[Braufessor]

Braufessor, I've recently made two batches of this using what you described as your favorite current hop combo: Citra/Mosaic/Galaxy for the two whirlpools and Citra/Mosaic for the two dry hops. It's amazing. For my next batch, I'd like to change it up a bit just for variety. Can you give a few of your other favorite combos these days? Thanks.

Yeah - I just keep coming back to that one.

I am just about to put a batch into the fermenter right now:
1:1:1 ratio of Citra/Amarillo/Simcoe..... never tried it, but it has to be good

Others I have liked -
* 1.5:1.5 of Citra/Mosaic all 4 additions
* Single hop versions with Citra or Mosaic ( I assume others like galaxy, Amarillo, etc. would be good too.)
* 1:1:1 of Amarillo/Simcoe/Centennial in Boil additions and then Simcoe/Amarillo 1.5:1.5 in the Dry Hops
* Did a 2:1 Citra:Columbus version that was quite good.... should do that one again sometime now that I think about it.

I did a batch with Eureka/Citra/Columbus that was just over the top and too much - did not love that one.

I have had a commercial beer that was Citra/Eureka that I really liked.... Maybe 2:1 Citra:Eureka if I tried that again.

Those are probably the ones I have settled on most of the time..... The more of these I have brewed, the more I keep coming back to combinations of:
Citra, Mosaic, Galaxy, Centennial, Simcoe, Amarillo, Columbus

I generally always bitter with Warrior... Although Columbus sometimes if I am using it or Centennial if I am using it.

 

[hezagenius]

Latest batch from yesterday

Hop schedule
0.75 oz Columbus for bittering at 60min
1:1:1:0.5 oz Citra:Mosaic:Galaxy:Columbus at 180F and 165F (30 min whirlpools for each)

Planning to do 2:2:2 Citra:Mosaic:Galaxy on day 4 when I transfer to a keg to let it finish fermenting under pressure.

I also added 0.5# lactose and 0.5# maltodextrin to boost the mouthfeel and give it a little sweetness. Maybe that's too much. We'll see in about 10 days.

Normally I've used Warrior for bittering but both packs I opened had a bad odor so luckily I had a pack of Columbus as a backup. That's the 3rd time I've had a bad packet of Warrior from BSG. I don't think I'll be going back to them for Warrior.

 

[jbedell2]

Yeah - I just keep coming back to that one.

I am just about to put a batch into the fermenter right now:
1:1:1 ratio of Citra/Amarillo/Simcoe..... never tried it, but it has to be good

Others I have liked -
* 1.5:1.5 of Citra/Mosaic all 4 additions
* Single hop versions with Citra or Mosaic ( I assume others like galaxy, Amarillo, etc. would be good too.)
* 1:1:1 of Amarillo/Simcoe/Centennial in Boil additions and then Simcoe/Amarillo 1.5:1.5 in the Dry Hops
* Did a 2:1 Citra:Columbus version that was quite good.... should do that one again sometime now that I think about it.

I did a batch with Eureka/Citra/Columbus that was just over the top and too much - did not love that one.

I have had a commercial beer that was Citra/Eureka that I really liked.... Maybe 2:1 Citra:Eureka if I tried that again.

Those are probably the ones I have settled on most of the time..... The more of these I have brewed, the more I keep coming back to combinations of:
Citra, Mosaic, Galaxy, Centennial, Simcoe, Amarillo, Columbus

I generally always bitter with Warrior... Although Columbus sometimes if I am using it or Centennial if I am using it.

This is great, thanks. I also bitter with Warrior.

Think I might try the Amarillo/Centennial/Simcoe version next (with just Amarillo/Simcoe DH) just to give the Citra a break. Thanks again!

 

[brewkinger]

I just came across this and figured this thread was as good of a place as any to post it
https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/news/new-england-ipa-haze-craze/

 

[Larzean]

I used Motueka in my last batch. Love it. Combined with Mosaic and El Dorado.

What were your hop amounts and times for this?

 

[Braufessor]

I also added 0.5# lactose and 0.5# maltodextrin to boost the mouthfeel and give it a little sweetness. Maybe that's too much. We'll see in about 10 days.

Interesting.... let us know.

 

[BaylessBrewer]

I have 4oz each Citra, Mosaic & Galaxy. What will be my best schedule for the quantities I have on hand?

 

[Braufessor]

Hmmmmm.... I would do one of two things.

* Simply go with an ounce of each, in all 4 additions.

* You could go heavier on Galaxy in kettle, and lighter on dry hop.....
2 Kettle additions:
1.5 galaxy
.75 citra
.75 Mosaic

2 Dry Hop additions:
1.25 Citra
1.25 Mosaic
.5 galaxy

 

[jjw5015]

I did citra/mosaic/azacca that had ounce of each at flameout, whirlpool, 7 day dryhop, 4 day dryhop

 

[BaylessBrewer]

Hmmmmm.... I would do one of two things.

* Simply go with an ounce of each, in all 4 additions.

* You could go heavier on Galaxy in kettle, and lighter on dry hop.....
2 Kettle additions:
1.5 galaxy
.75 citra
.75 Mosaic

2 Dry Hop additions:
1.25 Citra
1.25 Mosaic
.5 galaxy

Which would you recommend? I also have 4oz ea centennial and Azacca but I would prefer to go with C,M,G

 

[Braufessor]

Which would you recommend? I also have 4oz ea centennial and Azacca but I would prefer to go with C,M,G

I think I would go with more galaxy in the kettle and less in the dry hop (the second option). Galaxy can get a bit strong in the dry hop I think. I have done the 1:1:1 ratio in all four additions and it tasted like straight up grapefruit juice.... which was quite good. But, I still prefer less galaxy presence in the dry hop.

I would bitter with something neutral if you have it (warrior, magnum.... or something like that.) If you don't have one of those, I would bitter with some Centennial. But, save the C-M-G for the late additions.

 

[BaylessBrewer]

I think I would go with more galaxy in the kettle and less in the dry hop (the second option). Galaxy can get a bit strong in the dry hop I think. I have done the 1:1:1 ratio in all four additions and it tasted like straight up grapefruit juice.... which was quite good. But, I still prefer less galaxy presence in the dry hop.



I would bitter with something neutral if you have it (warrior, magnum.... or something like that.) If you don't have one of those, I would bitter with some Centennial. But, save the C-M-G for the late additions.

Awesome! Thanks.
I'll go with the second recommendation and report back when I have some results. I also have some hybridized Conan/644 I'll be using in this one. Gonna be a fun beer!!

 

[brew703]

Thinking about brewing #3 using the original grain bill but using Simcoe/Citra/Amarillo/Equinox. I may go with Warrior for bittering.
Would you guys use equal amounts for all additions?

 

[Braufessor]

Thinking about brewing #3 using the original grain bill but using Simcoe/Citra/Amarillo/Equinox. I may go with Warrior for bittering.
Would you guys use equal amounts for all additions?

I don't have any experience with equinox, so I can't help much with that. I did just brew Citra/Simcoe/Amarillo yesterday though.... and I intend to go equal amounts throughout.

In general, if I feel hops have the ability to overpower the beer, I scale them back - especially in the dry hop. So..... hops like Columbus, Galaxy, Eureka are ones I have use in particular that can get away from you in a hurry and just dominate everything else. Centennial is another one that I have found that (surprisingly) can over power a dry hop.

In fairness, Citra can outdo the other hops as well..... but, I love Citra, so I don't mind

So, I guess it depends on where you (or others) think Equinox fits as far as its ability to over power other hops, or blend in, or.... does it get lost?

 

[brew703]

I don't have any experience with equinox, so I can't help much with that. I did just brew Citra/Simcoe/Amarillo yesterday though.... and I intend to go equal amounts throughout.

In general, if I feel hops have the ability to overpower the beer, I scale them back - especially in the dry hop. So..... hops like Columbus, Galaxy, Eureka are ones I have use in particular that can get away from you in a hurry and just dominate everything else. Centennial is another one that I have found that (surprisingly) can over power a dry hop.

In fairness, Citra can outdo the other hops as well..... but, I love Citra, so I don't mind

So, I guess it depends on where you (or others) think Equinox fits as far as its ability to over power other hops, or blend in, or.... does it get lost?

Thanks for the info.
I may cut back on the Equinox and eliminate it from dry hop.
Did you recently brew an Amber version? If I can find some GP I may brew the Amber version or just go back with the initial grain bill and change the hops to Simcoe/Centennial/Amarillo using Warrior for bittering.

 

[Braufessor]

T
Did you recently brew an Amber version? If I can find some GP I may brew the Amber version or just go back with the initial grain bill and change the hops to Simcoe/Centennial/Amarillo using Warrior for bittering.

I am moving batch #3 of Amber to dry hop keg right now.... Still not blown away with it. Got a little ways to go on it before it is where I will be happy with it.

 

[Braufessor]

Dp

 

[Bowtiebrewery]

Wow. So I recently took my hydro sample from my primary in adding in the first dry hops... That wheat really adds some pillowy head to the beer. I was blown away by the mouth feel even just at the end of primary fermentation. Going to be in my second dry hop by this monday, but already the color, flavor and aroma are very very nice.

Even with having to save the beer with US-05.

I won't be transfering to secondary kegs with the setup Braufessor suggested, just because I don't have the spare kegs right now. But I'll purge my carboys with Co2 before I secondary for a few days. My racking cane already has a filter sock on it so I should be A-OK when I go to transfer to the keg.

Need to remember to take pictures of this stuff...

 

[specharka]

Attempt #2 on the style hits the mark quite well. A few minor deviations here:
44% Maris Otter
42% Pale 2-row
4% Flaked oats
4% Flaked barley
2% White wheat
2% Honey malt
2% Acid malt
45 IBU Warrior
1:1:1 Columbus, Amarillo, Simcoe
120:80 Chloride/Sulfate
1.055 OG 1.008 FG

Love this hop combination... Simcoe has enough dank and resinous tones to keep the beer from being a juice bomb. The weirdest thing is I purposefully underpitched (around 0.25 Mcells/mL-P) and Conan still overattenuated like a bastard. A little more bitter than I was hoping for, but thankfully the rest of the beer still shines through.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1471560823.990181.jpg

 

[anteater8]

Drinking my 4th iteration of this beer right now.

I was inspired by a few Trillium beers I had, which I knew used Columbus. They have such an interesting earthy, herbal, dank quality that not only works with but enhances the tropical fruit flavors. To move in that direction, I basically subbed Galaxy for equal parts Simcoe/Columbus

So this time I went with Citra/Mosaic/Simcoe/Columbus (2:2:1:1) for all four additions and bittered with Columbus. I think this is my favorite NEIPA I've made so far (if not tied with the original recipe), mostly peach & mango, a hint of melon and a little pine & earthy dank to balance things out. For what I was going for, I'm pretty damn happy with the results.

And for those interested, so far I've also brewed:
100% Citra (super delicious, just not as interesting as the original)
100% Nelson (not bad, but too much harsh earthiness. took a lot of mellowing out before it was really drinkinable - needs to paired with fruitier hops)

As for next time... I still really want to try 100% Mosaic and 100% Galaxy versions, if only to learn more about those hop profiles. But I think I want to continue down the dank & fruity road and try more combos with Columbus. I'm also curious about some varieties I haven't touched at all yet like Azacca, Apollo, Equinox, Galena and El Dorado.

 

[crusader1612]

looks good anteater - i like the addition of columbus.
might have to try this again, with a F/O and Dryhop of columbus added (Just add more hops)

 

[Braufessor]

Latest batch..... 1.055 version, Citra/Mosaic/Galaxy. 140 Sulfate:70 chloride. Biggest difference - I used 1272 yeast. Lots of emphasis is placed on yeast in regard to "haziness" and I have felt that the "haze" is more about the hopping and possibly pH. One of the criticisms from the "west coast only" camp is that simply using a yeast that flocs out would eliminate the haziness (and NE IPA brewers are just lazy/looking for gimics)... Well, 1272 is a yeast that flocs out crystal clear..... but, not in this beer.

At any rate, really happy with this beer. As good as any NE IPA I have brewed so far. Got the same, full, silky feel to it as using conan or 1318. About 17 days or so since brew day. Got a couple other ones going with 1272 as well. Might run some beers through 1056 in the near future too.

 

[Braufessor]

Drinking my 4th iteration of this beer right now.

I was inspired by a few Trillium beers I had, which I knew used Columbus. They have such an interesting earthy, herbal, dank quality that not only works with but enhances the tropical fruit flavors. To move in that direction, I basically subbed Galaxy for equal parts Simcoe/Columbus

So this time I went with Citra/Mosaic/Simcoe/Columbus (2:2:1:1) for all four additions and bittered with Columbus. I think this is my favorite NEIPA I've made so far (if not tied with the original recipe), mostly peach & mango, a hint of melon and a little pine & earthy dank to balance things out. For what I was going for, I'm pretty damn happy with the results.

And for those interested, so far I've also brewed:
100% Citra (super delicious, just not as interesting as the original)
100% Nelson (not bad, but too much harsh earthiness. took a lot of mellowing out before it was really drinkinable - needs to paired with fruitier hops)

As for next time... I still really want to try 100% Mosaic and 100% Galaxy versions, if only to learn more about those hop profiles. But I think I want to continue down the dank & fruity road and try more combos with Columbus. I'm also curious about some varieties I haven't touched at all yet like Azacca, Apollo, Equinox, Galena and El Dorado.

Looks great and I like the sounds of that hop combo..... I could see that being great and I have meant to try a bit more with columbus as well. I did a Citra: Columbus with 2:1 ration in all 4 additions..... it was really good. I have been meaning to do single hops of mosaic and Galaxy for about 50+ batches of this now too........ Both would be spectacular I think.... especially the mosaic. I need to force myself away from C-M-G for a few batches.

 

[armenianbrewer]

I just brewed a version of this on Saturday and fermentation (3 gallons with wyeast 1318) appears to be going well. I went with Sorachi Ace for bittering (had some leftovers from a previous brew) and then I went all Falconer's Flight for the rest of the hop scheduling. I'm going to continue with FF for dry hopping but had a question about dry hopping this beer. Is there any reason why I shouldnt dry hop 4 days in, 6 days in, and 8 days in each 1oz of Falconers Flight hops and then package/bottle on around day 12/13?