NON-ALCOHOLIC vacuum distillation of additives/sweeteners

[Ike]

Ok, ok... I KNOW the forum's rules on discussions about spirits and distillations, that's NOT what this is about.

Question: Does anyone have a system they've used to vacuum distill juices or other liquid additives before adding them to ciders or beers?

Reason: I've been interested in trying different backsweeteners and flavor additions to my ciders. Problem is, there are only a handful of juices (readily) available in concentrated form. Others are out there, but are pricey and/or involve ordering from sites that have high shipping charges.

I also have a buddy who wants me to add cucumber to my (actually not too bad-tasting by itself, ahem) ginger beer for a summertime quaffer. A test batch that involved stuffing raw cucumber into the bottles prior to capping actually tasted good (to him, I hate cukes) but would not pasteurize completely. SO, I'd also like to find a way to concentrate cucumber juice to add prior to bottling.


I just remember my high school chemistry teacher boiling water at room temp with a vacuum bell and pump. It seems like an easy way of concentrating substances without boiling them traditionally and ruining flavor profiles... but I also realize I may lose a lot of aromatics and flavors to a vacuum envrionment as well.

I can actually find what I need online at Amazon easily enough, but the bell, pump, and incidentals would cost around $300. Before I sink the cash I thought I'd reach out here to see if anyone had ever tried something similar?

Thanks!

 

[Revvy]

Not vacuum like you're talking about, but I make flavor extracts for beers and meads using something I learned from playing around with "molecular gastronomy" called "Nitrogen Cavitation," using a whipped cream maker like this,

I appeared on the Brew Bubbas podcast a couple years ago demonstrating this in front of a studio audience of brewers and mead makers. People were blown away, in fact someone wrote something up about it for BYO or zymurgy last year while I was dealing with my house fire and didn't have time to write my planned article.

A lot of mead makers in Metro Detroit have further gone on and used this for their meads. I've made orange extract for keg additions using filtered vodka as a base and a mixture of fresh and dry orange peels.

Brew Bubbas Podcast

I'd be intersted in seeing your parts list for your vacuum distillate system I've wanted to build one myself for Modernest Cuisine and for making flavor extracts for beers and meads myself.

 

[Ike]

Thanks for the link! I'm running on minimal sleep today and would more than likely fall asleep if I sat still long enough to try to listen to it, but it's on my Homebrewing To Do list!

The idea of a cider "flavor shot" was one I hadn't considered until just now... it's a bit, well, it jangles my traditionalism but it might be cool to brew a straight, "unflavored" cider, then have different extracts available for addition on a per-pour basis. So, if I want apple-cherry and the wife wants the apple-pie and a buddy wants (I kid you not) cucumber, then it all happens from the same batch. It sure beats breaking 5gallon batches into separate bottling batches.

I'd be intersted in seeing your parts list for your vacuum distillate system I've wanted to build one myself for Modernest Cuisine and for making flavor extracts for beers and meads myself.

Not that the research I did was so impressive, mind you... I'm the typical 41 year old dude, so for me "shopping" translates to "I went to Amazon and typed in what I was looking for." But...

http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B003OBYZ3K?keywords=vacuum%20bell&qid=1457722317&ref_=sr_1_1&sr=8-1

or maybe even

http://smile.amazon.com/Bel-Art-Scienceware-F42010-Polypropylene-Desiccator/dp/B002VBW9R8/ref=pd_sbs_328_1?ie=UTF8&dpID=41q%2B2VOK7zL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR160%2C160_&refRID=0D134MF40XV6YY4JRQQP

My original search included single stage pumps, reviews seem to indicate we're going to want a two-stage pump to really make things work, which adds about $100 to the price. Although, there is a complete kit available that just now caught my eye... I wonder...

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B017285DFY/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

[jddevinn]

Considering the mechanical design aspect of this:

1. Consider the properties of what you want to boil to determine the heat/vacuum requirements that you have.

using the "sealed evacuated box" method it looks like you are going for

2. If you do not care about hogging time (evacuation time) and have a completely sealed enclosure the pump volumetric capacity does not matter, if it can achieve the vacuum it will at some point. A hand pump or automotive brake pump would work.

2. You can completely seal something probably cheaper than you think. A PVC tube with properly installed end caps will hold considerable vacuum (although I can't recommend creating a vacuum in anything that has not been evaluated as a pressure vessel)
http://www.housatonicrr.com/vacchamber.htm
https://skunkpharmresearch.com/diy-vacuum-purging-chamber/
http://thefurcollectivestudios.com/~/tutorials/making-a-cheap-vacuum-chamber/

3. Alternatively use a premade lab setup.... probably best if you are thinking small small quantities. http://www.hometrainingtools.com/vacuum-distillation-glassware-kit
https://www.pelletlab.com/vacuum_distillation
DIY http://www.instructables.com/id/Build-a-Lab-Quality-Distillation-Apparatus/

 

[msayler]

I've got a mini-fridge that has a leak somewhere in the lines, and I've been considering making a vacuum pump out of the compressor. This would be an interesting application.