Ninkasi Oatis Stout Clone?

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alexdagrate

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Just got my first 22 of this for the year and I'm really itching to attempt a clone. I couldn't find ANYTHING on The Google.

Any ideas?
 

jmo88

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I've been looking for this. A while back I began researching naked oats that I would be using for a smoked porter. Someone told me that this beer featured naked oats and it's the only commercial example I know of that does. That's all I got for you. Where did you buy it?
 
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alexdagrate

alexdagrate

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I've been looking for this. A while back I began researching naked oats that I would be using for a smoked porter. Someone told me that this beer featured naked oats and it's the only commercial example I know of that does. That's all I got for you. Where did you buy it?
My local bottle shop, Gravity in Olympia. I've seen it in grocery stores around here as well.
 

flashover600

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I've been looking for this. A while back I began researching naked oats that I would be using for a smoked porter. Someone told me that this beer featured naked oats and it's the only commercial example I know of that does. That's all I got for you. Where did you buy it?
I've seen Ninkasi at the Fred Meyer in Tacoma by Cheney Stadium.......Also when I was in Seattle on Pike Street, I saw they had it at a bar on the waterfront........
 

Bullshivit-brew

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I tryed to find a Ninkasi IPA clone recipe a while back. Got some help from a few guys on here and came up with one. It dosn't seem that there is much out there yet for ninkasi clone recipes. I think it has a little to do with the fact that they are more of a local brew and not available to most. If you come up with one let us know they make great beer and I would love to have it.
 

homebrewedipa

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Sorry to bump a year-old thread, but has anyone come up with an all-grain clone for Ninkasi's Oatis?
 

BendBrewer

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Ninkasi's head brewer is a good friend of mine. Unfortunately, he had to move over to Eugene and I don't see him much these days. I'll see if he'll drop a few hints and report back.
 

Boy

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NinKasi has changed their website! Ingredients for Oatis are now listed. Little surprised about Nugget being the hop choice. Just assumed it would be EKG, Chinook, or NB.
 

yessri

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From the website:
# Starting Gravity:
# Bitterness: 50 IBUs
# Alcohol %: 7.2
# Malt: 2 Row Pale Malt, Chocolate Malt, Crystal Malt, Roasted Barley, Oats
# Hops: Nugget
 

Boy

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Starting gravity was listed in the past at 1.072. To get to 7.2% it needs to finish around 1.018.
 

awheeler

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Here's one i'm trying. I'll let you know how it goes.

10 lbs 2-row pale ale
1 lbs oats flaked
1lb crystal 40
1 lb crystal 60
1 lb roasted barley
1 lb choc malt

1 oz nuggets

White labs 004 yeast, 2qt starter

I mashed at 152 for 60 min and batch sparged x2 at 180.

My preboil was 1.052
OG 1.068
I'm shooting for a final at 1.019

This is my first recipe that I have ever put together so I have no idea how this will turn out.
 

Kelpdog

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Hey awheeler-

How did this clone turn out? Anyone else playing with this a clone of Ninkasi Oatis?
 

RhythmSection

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I've been experimenting with a clone. In my last attempt I used about 6.5 percent chocolate malt, 5 percent roasted barley, 3 percent caramel 60, and the rest 2 row pale. I do 90 minute boils so I shot for about 55 ibus at 90 minutes, and around 7 at 20 (all nugget), then fermented with1968 esb yeast, I've read on this site that 1968 is primarily what they use. Mashed at 154 and fermented at 67 for the first week or so, then I raised it to about 70-72 to help it attenuate. I started at 1.070 and got it to 1.019, and it was preeeety close to the real deal. Oh, and I used a pound of flaked oats, that's what I had on hand. If anyone wants to try that recipe do let me know what you think. I might try cutting back to about 6 percent on the chocolate next time, and try to find naked oats, but either way it's a pretty darn good beer regardless
 

Kelpdog

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Thanks - the grain bill is pretty close to a stout I jad put together, but yeast and hops were definitely different. This one is a few down the queue but will let you know how it comes out when I do!
 

thadass

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I did a brew this past weekend based on awheeler's posted recipe from last year. Brought it down to a 3 gallon BIAB recipe as a calibration run for my new brew kettle. Over-estimated my boiloff so came out with over 4 gallons in the fermenter instead of 3, but that's why it's a small batch in the first place. Plus, Oatis is one of my absolute tops commercial brews so I'll be re-making this quickly anyways!

Ninkasi Oatis 3 Gallons BIAB recipe:

I double-crush my grains at the LHBS. This recipe is formulated for the around 80% eff. I get with BIAB with sparging.

Target OG 1.072

6lb 11oz 2-row
9oz Flaked oats
8oz Crystal 40
8oz Crystal 60
8oz Roasted barley
7oz Chocolate malt

Mash at 156 for 60min, withholding a gallon or so of water to use for the sparge.. Raise temp to 168-170 and hold for 10 minutes. Drain grains and sparge with 170 degree water to get to pre-boil volume

0.75oz Nugget (13%) at 60min



I substituted 6oz of Breiss Blackprinz for the 8oz roasted barley for the heck of it, to get the color right-ish and to try it out. Wasn't too worried about really matching the clone on this one since I was flying blind with the new kettle, and apparently with good reason hah.

I ended up with a bit over 4 gallons at 1.060. recorded my volumes and boiloff rate so next time should be spot on for volume... :)

I pitched some washed Wyeast 1028 from a previous ESB.

Even with overshooting the volume, I'm expecting this to still be pretty great. I'll do a full 5 gallon batch next time and post some results from that, too.
 

Kelpdog

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Finally brewed an 8 gallon batch of this yesterday. First batch over 6 gallons that I've done and this might have contributed to poor efficiency. Measured at 69% compared to normal around 80%. Made change on the fly as LHBS did not have golden naked oats. They suggested adding small amount of C10. Ended up with these percentages:

72 % 2 row
10% Flaked oats
6% Chocolate
5% Roast Barley
4% Crystal 60
2.5% Crystal 10

Target was 1.072 @ 8 gallons but came in at 1.064 @ 8.5 gallons. Pitched 1.75l starter of Wyeast 1968 London ESB into 5 gallon carboy and a packet of Nottingham into the 3 gallon. Contemplating adding French oak chips to secondary of one or the other. Have a lot to learn and understand about yeast starters. Hard to believe that the 1.75 starter recommended by Mr Malty wouldn't effect flavor, gravity, and SRM of the beer since it,is such a large percentage of final wort.
 

thadass

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Finally brewed an 8 gallon batch of this yesterday. First batch over 6 gallons that I've done and this might have contributed to poor efficiency. Measured at 69% compared to normal around 80%. Made change on the fly as LHBS did not have golden naked oats. They suggested adding small amount of C10. Ended up with these percentages:

72 % 2 row
10% Flaked oats
6% Chocolate
5% Roast Barley
4% Crystal 60
2.5% Crystal 10

Target was 1.072 @ 8 gallons but came in at 1.064 @ 8.5 gallons. Pitched 1.75l starter of Wyeast 1968 London ESB into 5 gallon carboy and a packet of Nottingham into the 3 gallon. Contemplating adding French oak chips to secondary of one or the other. Have a lot to learn and understand about yeast starters. Hard to believe that the 1.75 starter recommended by Mr Malty wouldn't effect flavor, gravity, and SRM of the beer since it,is such a large percentage of final wort.
What was your hop schedule?

My batch is in bottles right now, waiting another couple of weeks for carbing and aging. I've tested... two bottles so far I think. Pretty good, but I actually liked the hydrometer samples I took during fermentation even more (I finished every last one of them).
I think just waiting for the carbonation and flavors to mellow and meld is all that's needed. some of the sharper green beer flavors sort of detract from the body right now, which is what I'm most interested in testing with the watered-out 1.06-ish OG. Curious to see if our batches will have similarity discrepancies vs the original.

As far as the starter, I'd imagine a lot of people would chill and decant a starter of that size.. depending on the beer I spose
 

Kelpdog

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thadass said:
What was your hop schedule?

My batch is in bottles right now, waiting another couple of weeks for carbing and aging. I've tested... two bottles so far I think. Pretty good, but I actually liked the hydrometer samples I took during fermentation even more (I finished every last one of them).
I think just waiting for the carbonation and flavors to mellow and meld is all that's needed. some of the sharper green beer flavors sort of detract from the body right now, which is what I'm most interested in testing with the watered-out 1.06-ish OG. Curious to see if our batches will have similarity discrepancies vs the original.

As far as the starter, I'd imagine a lot of people would chill and decant a starter of that size.. depending on the beer I spose
My hop schedule was 1.75 oz at 60 min ( 43 IBU), and .5 oz at 15 minutes (9 IBU). 52 IBU total.

I hadn't read about chilling and decanting...most of the "how-to" descriptions I'd read focus on why to do starters and how to do them. This,was only the third or fourth one I have done. Makes good sense to chill and decant though one loses the immediately active yeast I suppose.

The Nottingham fermented hard and fast.m airlock activity stopped after 2.5 days. The London ESB stayed consistent with regular activity for six days. Both fermented at 64F. Plan to let them sit for another week or two. I usually rack to secondary, but am considering not racking unless choosing to add oak to some or all.
 

kingogames

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I agree, that's the best Oatmeal Stout I've had this year. Rogue Shakespeare Oatmeal Stout is a close second though!
 

Kelpdog

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Bottling tonight finally. The difference between yeasts is HUGE! The Notty finished at 1.014 and has a notably high bitter note on the finish. Definitely not as clean and the roast flavors lack depth. Not unpleasant but nothing special either. The Wyeast London ESB on the other hand finished at 1.020 and is smooth with lots of depth and character. I wish I had an Oatis to compare my Oatish to....by memory seems pretty close. Looking forward to a carbed version. For those who've brewed this, how long did you bottle condition?
 

Kelpdog

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What temp did you ferment at? Oatis should have a SG of 1.072 and a FG of around 1.015.
Fermented at 64F on both the Nottingham and Wyeast 1968.

My o.g. was low at 1.064. This was my first batch over 6 gallons and I thought it was due to mash/sparge water to grain ratio. However I brewed a 6 gallon batch last weekend and ended up with a 68% efficiency as well. Might be that the LHBS has changed their grain mill. Typically averaged around 80% efficiency before these batches.
 

Beernip

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With that yeast I've found that it is great to start at 63-64* and let it ferment out about 70% when the krasussen just starts to fall and then slowly ramp up to 68*. It isn't a very flocculant yeast and can get an extra two points off by using my thief to gently swirl up the yeast cake at the bottom over the last few days. We have a few breweries in town (Ninkasi and Eugene City Brewing/Rogue) that use that yeast and get dumps on occasion. From what I've been told by those brewers the first few generations are not the best. Starting around the 4-9 generation that they reuse is optimal and they don't go over 13.
 

Kelpdog

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Beernip said:
With that yeast I've found that it is great to start at 63-64* and let it ferment out about 70% when the krasussen just starts to fall and then slowly ramp up to 68*. It isn't a very flocculant yeast and can get an extra two points off by using my thief to gently swirl up the yeast cake at the bottom over the last few days. We have a few breweries in town (Ninkasi and Eugene City Brewing/Rogue) that use that yeast and get dumps on occasion. From what I've been told by those brewers the first few generations are not the best. Starting around the 4-9 generation that they reuse is optimal and they don't go over 13.
Good advice as it turns out! Despite steady hydro readings I'm guessing the 1968 had not fermented out as the bottles are gushers. No bottle bombs but something of which to be wary. Tasting side by side with an Oatis, the Nottingham is much closer. It lacks a little in mouthfeel, probably from the starting gravity difference. Both of the clones are more chocolately than the oatis. I prefer the 1968. We are hosting a stout tasting today with a mix of homebrews and commercial versions and styles. It will be interesting to learn others impressions.
 

buzzerj

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I thought you used Wyeast 1968 not 1028. Which yeast was it? I'm really getting to like the versatility of 1968 in a range of British style beers.
 

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