New Danstar Belle Saison Dry Yeast?

[sweetcell]

sounds like this yeast is really spicy. too bad, i like my saisons on the fruitier side.

 

[DeTech]

sounds like this yeast is really spicy. too bad, i like my saisons on the fruitier side.

Me too... Does anyone have any tasting notes for the higher side of ferm temps? Anybody hit 90s?

 

[Chamuco]

Me too... Does anyone have any tasting notes for the higher side of ferm temps? Anybody hit 90s?

I got into the mid 80's and will take it higher (95*) next time. At 8.78% the alcohol is warm, not harsh at all. I taste more citrus than pepper and a tart dry finish. I tend to get more fruit out of my Saisons when under pitched and fermented at high temperatures. This yeast is definitely edgy and Impressive that one, unhydrated packet could finish a 1.070 beer so quickly...12 days from brew to fully carb'd and tasty. Now at 16 days even better!

 

[piteko]

Hello everybody!
I already have this yeast, received it as a present, and I wanted to use it. The first thought was to do a witbier. I was aiming to something like Blanche de Namur, very light, coriander and citrusy notes.

Many brews under the belt but nothing like saison or witbier so I found this thread looking for recipes and for suggestions on this yeast usage.

Some ideas:
- should I try a classic witbier with coriander and orange dried zest and keep the fermenting temps a bit lower than what suggested? Can you suggest me some thread about recipes? I suppose I should adapt them to this yeast though.
- should I radically switch to a saison and follow this recipe? I'd rather not... And I can't have Zythos, I have to find something else (Cascade for the citrus? some other hop to be more classic?);

What do you suggest?
Thanks in advance and cheers from Italy!
Piteko

 

[sweetcell]

hello piteko,

based on other's experience i don't think coriander, or any other spice, is needed - sounds like this yeast contributes lots of those on its own.

there is no one single "saison" recipe - saison is quite a diverse style of beer. you can use many different kinds of hops, Zythos is in no way a requirement to make a saison. check out this sub-forum for many recipe ideas: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/. pick out something you like there and use the dry yeast instead of whatever is listed in the original recipe. i would recommend sticking with a relatively simple recipe so the yeast can be featured. feel free to ask questions if you don't understand something in a recipe.

 

[samwhois]

piteko - check out my home brew clubs website (gonzobrewers.com) under the "forum" section and "Upcoming meetings (what will be the goings on) by Sam-Who-Is" I have a bunch of info and recipes on saisons. I have been doing a lot of witbier/saison hybrids lately. I think they are under the "Recipe Exchange" section. My personal favorite is the "Catalyst saison" it was originally done by that major vices brewer, and has been my favorite so far.

 

[piteko]

My personal favorite is the "Catalyst saison" it was originally done by that major vices brewer, and has been my favorite so far.

Perfect! Thanks!
I saw the Catalyst recipe. It's very interesting since I was convinced that styrian goldings could be a good hop for a saison/witbier but this is the first recipe I saw that includes it!

Anyway, I'm sure I cannot find the French Strisselspalts hops, the Kaffir Lime leaves and the Dried Lime Peel, so I think I will need to adjust your recipe or to find something similar.
The main thing I still have to understand is if I have/want to use spices and keep the fermentation temp down or if it's better not to use the spices and pump the yeast with a high fermentation temp. I have a little fermentation chamber that can make cold or hot, so temperature control is not a impossible for me.
I'm tempted not to use spices and let the yeast shine, but I know that I have only few packs of this yeast and I probably won't be able to have them again, so maybe an approach could be not to let the yeast shine, so I can change it and have similar results with a different saison yeast strain. Another approach could be to make the yeast shine and then see how the recipe changes using a different saison yeast strain and learn something more...
Well, many things to understand. Monday is the LHBS order day, so I will have to choose by then.

Thanks again!
Piteko

 

[piteko]

check out this sub-forum for many recipe ideas: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/.

Thanks!
Many years that I come around here and never saw the recipes sub-forum! Great!!

feel free to ask questions if you don't understand something in a recipe.

Some of my main doubts are listed above and, as you can see, not strictly related to the style. Anyway, I'll take a look and ask! I think I will now go to the cellar and try to clear my mind with a san bernardus wit. Yesterday I had an Hoegaarden and a Blanche de Namur comparison with SWIMBO (who the wit is for... as I publicize it ). The Blanche de Namur has a citrusy aroma that rocks!

Thanks again!
Cheers from Italy!
Piteko

 

[sweetcell]

Anyway, I'm sure I cannot find the French Strisselspalts hops

you can replace the hops with a different kinds. don't let the hops be an obstacle to following a recipe. you can always substitute, it's not like the recipe will be terrible with a different hop.

I know that I have only few packs of this yeast and I probably won't be able to have them again

you might want to look into yeast washing. it is possible to reuse yeast.

 

[grayhalladay]

hey guys, adding my experience here. I made a saison with super high gravity (1.088-1.090, calling it "Harvesters Paycheck") for graduation in a few months. I only pitched one package as per instructions and added yeast nutrient to help. After 3 days in the fermenter at ~72-75*F it fermented all they way down to 1.010!! I couldn't believe it! In a week i'll transfer to the secondary and let it sit till 3 weeks before graduation, cold crash for a week, then bottle and carbonate.

I'm keeping the slurry for another saison project, and then a biere de garde. I'm super impressed with the spiciness i have already detected and the completeness of the fermentation.

 

[piteko]

you might want to look into yeast washing. it is possible to reuse yeast.

I know the procedure and I tend to follow the directions heard on brewstrong: pitching the yeast as fresh as possible, so I bottle my beer directly from my primary and repitch the yeast a week after in another brew. This is ok for me because I make a lot of similar beers (I usually stay around england). I don't think I will make some saison brews one after the other, unless I can reuse the yeast to make something different like I do with my english yeast: 1st batch mild, 2nd batch best bitter, 3rd batch IPA.

I could make a yeast bank but, for many reasons, I'd rather change and buy my distributor' saison fresh yeast when I need it (3724 Belgian Saison or 3711 French Saison).

Cheers from Italy!
Piteko

 

[piteko]

The main thing I still have to understand is if I have/want to use spices and keep the fermentation temp down or if it's better not to use the spices and pump the yeast with a high fermentation temp.

I finally decided for this one:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f71/blue-balls-belgian-wit-blue-moon-clone-24978/

easy grist, very practical since I already have the pale malt and I always use ek golding. I will use spices and keep the yeast in a "normal" temp range.
I can't find the rice hulls, I need an alternative. I can find bran, I don't think it has the same efficiency, but better than nothing? Any other idea?

Cheers from Italy!
Piteko

 

[tennesseean_87]

Rice hulls are there only to help your sparge not get stuck since wheat has no husk to help form a filter bed. They don't contribute sugars. If you BIAB, you should be fine without.

 

[piteko]

Rice hulls are there only to help your sparge not get stuck since wheat has no husk to help form a filter bed. They don't contribute sugars. If you BIAB, you should be fine without.

I know, but I'm not a BIAB brewer... Standard zapap here...
I usually make a slow filtering to help efficiency so speed is not my concern. I would like to avoid any stuck, though

Cheers from Italy!
Piteko

 

[bhagen]

I am mostly posting this in order to follow this thread. I bought a couple packets of this on a whim from my LHBS and brewed on Friday evening. Fermentation was already going strong Saturday morning. I have noticed my ferment temp is relatively low, I was at 72 last evening. I don't intend to push the temp any higher than it goes naturally. I can post my results in a few weeks.

 

[Malty_Dog]

Thinking of brewing Mosher's "Saisoon Buffoon" with this yeast. Sounds like it is faster and less tempermental than Wyeast3724 or WLP565. Not even sure if I'd need that aquarium heater I was considering...

 

[DeTech]

I've got 3 batches out of this yeast at this point. I'm a fan, but it definitely finishes on the dry spicy side. Pick a sweet or floral note to bounce that off of and you can not fail.

 

[Tupperwolf]

Thinking of brewing up a batch with this yeast as the new LHBS near me has some. Any other testimonials from recent users?

 

[grayhalladay]

Thinking of brewing up a batch with this yeast as the new LHBS near me has some. Any other testimonials from recent users?

I liked my experience, flocculation was really low though, but It does hold pretty tight at the bottom of bottle. I also got really quick carbonation, so don't over add carbing sugar. It is an interesting flavor profile, that you would need to smell one one of my bottles to understand, but in true saison fashion it is funky!

Edit: if you use this in a high gravity/ imperial saison, add something to thin it out at about 75% completion. My 1.090OG to 1.012FG saison tastes great, but feels as think a syrup. Not a complaint, but not a refreshing summer nights beverage I was going for.

 

[niquejim]

My 1.090OG to 1.012FG saison tastes great, but feels as think a syrup. Not a complaint, but not a refreshing summer nights beverage I was going for.

How did you ever expect a 1.090 anything to be a "refreshing summer night beverage"

 

[sweetcell]

How did you ever expect a 1.090 anything to be a "refreshing summer night beverage"

my thoughts exactly. with saison yeast, this is going to be an imperial.

 

[bhagen]

My thoughts on this yeast.
I brewed all extract, with 6 oz of dextrine for head retention. 1.048 original gravity, got down to 1.008 Fermentation in primary only for 15 days. I fermented on the cool side for a Saison, never got above 72 degrees and spent the last week or more at 68 or below. I used Galena as my bittering hop and finished with an ounce each of Hallertau and Saaz at knockout.

I am very happy with the result. Yeast character overwhelms the hop character in my brew. Flavors skew towards the fruity profile of this yeast; fresh apricot, green plum, banana peel, lemon pith. I don't get much spice, just very mild clove or white pepper. Possibly from fermenting at low temp? Finish is sour/acidic and refreshing. It is hard not to take another sip right away.

My brew calculated to 44 IBU but I think the sour character and maybe the high attenuation make this taste more like a 25-30 IBU brew.

I'll definitely brew this yeast again.

 

[grayhalladay]

my thoughts exactly. with saison yeast, this is going to be an imperial.

yeah, my 1st batch not using a pre-established recipe, I didn't know about beer smith yet, and lots of lost H2O during boiling and none on hand to top off with make for a new brewer with some strong beer, Granted that was 2 months ago.

It is pretty good though.

 

[ChocolateMaltyBalls]

My LHBS was out of 3711, but they had just gotten Belle Saison in so I used one packet to brew this: http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2009/11/hoppy-french-saison.html (except I also keg hopped with 1oz of leaf Saaz).

It went from 1.052 to 1.005 in less than a week under ~72F ambient temp, and I've had it on tap for little over three weeks. I'm very pleased with the way it turned out. The aroma is slightly peppery and plays very well with the Saaz. It is very dry with a little tartness in the aftertaste. I don't detect much if any fruit, maybe some very light lemon notes, but hard to distinguish from the hops. Despite the low FG it has nice body.

I've brewed a lot of Saisons and Belle is very close to what I usually see from 3711, if it's not the same yeast strain it is very similar. Like 3711, Belle plays very well with hops (especially saaz) and even with super attenuation it does not seem watered down. I'll probably do another batch with 3711 for added comparison, but most likely Belle will be my new saison yeast.

 

[Krid]

Just to add some more results using the Belle Saison dry yeast. I wanted to make an inexpensive and light table saison/belgian ale for the summer. Shooting for 5% ABV at the low end of "official" saison territory, I started with an OG of 1.040. Pitched 1 rehydrated packet at 66*F and let it go to where ever it wanted. Ambient house temp right around 70*F - its been a mild spring. After three weeks in primary I kegged it. FG 1.000(!). Still waiting on carbonation, but the hydro sample was exactly what I was looking for: dominant spicy character with a kind of swirl of fruitiness. I'd say it compared favorably with my goto saison strain WLP565.

I saved 2 half gallon jars of slurry, and will be using one this weekend to ferment a beefy tripel ~9.5% ABV just to see how it behaves. Danstar says it has high alcohol tolerance...

 

[beergolf]

I've brewed a lot of Saisons and Belle is very close to what I usually see from 3711, if it's not the same yeast strain it is very similar. Like 3711, Belle plays very well with hops (especially saaz) and even with super attenuation it does not seem watered down. I'll probably do another batch with 3711 for added comparison, but most likely Belle will be my new saison yeast.
ChocolateMaltyBalls is offline

I have done three Saisons using Belle Saison. I agree that it is close to 3711. It ferments low like 3711, all three went to 1.002. I get just slightly more pepper and slightly less citrus flavor from the yeast, but very close to 3711. It is nice to have a good dry yeast option for Saisons.

 

[Molybedenum]

I brewed one up, aimed for ~1.063 OG, expected around a 1.010 FG. I hit 1.067, which isn't too far off.

Belle Saison took it down to .997 over a week. I didn't do any temp control on it, so it more than likely stayed between 75 and 80 the whole time. The beer is very tart and fruity, but with the attenuation being what it was, the bitterness from the hops is more pronounced than I aimed for.

I figure, after letting it sit for a while, the sweetness from the alcohol will balance out the hops.

 

[cwages]

I brewed one up, aimed for ~1.063 OG, expected around a 1.010 FG. I hit 1.067, which isn't too far off.

Belle Saison took it down to .997 over a week. I didn't do any temp control on it, so it more than likely stayed between 75 and 80 the whole time. The beer is very tart and fruity, but with the attenuation being what it was, the bitterness from the hops is more pronounced than I aimed for.

I figure, after letting it sit for a while, the sweetness from the alcohol will balance out the hops.

I just fermented 10 gallons of a 1.067 saison with the Belle Saison yeast (pitched 1g/L) and in four days they was sitting at .998. the hop flavor and aroma is great but the there isn't much mouthfeel. I'm going to force carbon five gallons and hope of the best.

 

[bd2xu]

I'm in my first journey with Belle Saison. Did an American Pale Ale/Belgian hybrid yrsterday,I will call it Bellvada Pale Ale since I used a Sierra Nevada Pale Ale recipe and the Belle Saison.

10.5 lbs Maris Otter
14 oz caramel 60
Mashed (too high) 156-154
60 min boil
.33 oz magnum @ 60
.5 oz perle @ 60
1 oz cascade @ 15
1 oz cascade @ 1
1 pack Belle Saison rehydrated per instructions
Fermenter at 67 in basement, no temp control
Dry hop with 1 oz cascade for 7 days
Keg

My OG was higher than expected, 1.058 vs. 1.054 prob because of my higher mash temp. I hope the yeast can work through the starches I got. I think the classic tastes on the SNPA should go great with the flavors this yeast brings, and the citrusy cascade.

 

[jmich24]

Brewed up a quick extract Hoppy Sasion with Belle this weekend. (had some LME to get rid of from my extract brewing days)
Gold LME(40%), Pilsner DME(40%), Corn sugar(10%).
1050 OG
Hit it with Belma continuously from 10 min to flame out.
Then gave a big charge of Centennial, Cascade and Sterling at 149 Degrees for a 30 min steep.
It is currently fermenting strong at 70 degrees.
Going to dry hop with a combo of Centennial, Cascade and Belma.

*3 days after pitching I raised temperature from 70 to 80.
*6 days after pitching temperature is up to 86.
*7 days since pitching down to 1004. I am going to let the temp free fall back down to 70 and then Dry hop it. I think the floral fruitiness of cascade and centennial will work perfectly with the spiciness that the yeast created. No big phenolic notes that I can detect this far(which I prefer).
*17 days since pitching. It is very spicy yeast. While this brew was heavily hopped for saision standards, the yeast character is dominate.

Very interested in how this yeast preforms.