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humann_brewing

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I had trouble on 1 order last year but have placed many since then without a hitch.

In fact on the last one I ordered some random specialty grains some 1lb some 3lbs, I ordered 1lb of special b and got 3lbs, so I consider that an error in my favor.

Don't get me wrong, I order from several including AHS, morebeer and just placed an order with midwest yesterday.


Forest: any chance AHA members can get a discount like at Midwest?
 

kornkob

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Not that I've got any knowledge specific to HB shops but I know that I've experienced people who feel emotionally invested in a small company describe situations that would constitute unacceptable customer service in any organization I was managing. Often when people 'know' the company/owner/retail person they interact with they will make excuses for the organization to protect their emotional investment.
 

Reelale

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Austin Homebrew has a membership which gets you free shipping and 3 free White Labs yeasts.

What good is free shipping when they treat you like SH** and are always out of things. Compare total delivered price not just "Free Shipping"

I had a customer that wanted me to give 10% off because another store does that for him. I said as long as I get to match thier price. They are on average 20% more expensive than me. The bag of grain he wanted was $20 more but he got a 10% discount.

Forrest
D..n! I just placed an order last night, and did not even see the membership link. In fact, I've placed several orders lately and did not see it. I've spent more than the cost of the membership in shipping and yeast in the last month!
Forrest, is it too late to add a membership to my order?
 

dontman

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What good is free shipping when they treat you like SH** and are always out of things.
I make a post about how uncool it is when people jump on a vendor trashing bandwagon like a shark feeding frenzy and then you come on and directly trash a competitor.

Totally uncool lame move.

I just lost some respect. This is something I have never done in my 30 year career for many reasons not the least of which is that I treat others as I would hope they would treat me. You should be above this s#$%.
 

kornkob

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That and bragging about how you ripped off a customer instead of educating them isn't really showing your awesome customer service skills.
 

Brewin_CRAZY

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Thats the worst part. They ran out of the parts and didnt let me know and sent the package without it. So I waited and now I dont have the parts.
I cant brew this weekend. I have 80 gallons with no way to put o2 into it.
Well man, if you are really down and out you can get O2 parts from a varity of places. Get an O2 stone from a pet store (not the best solution but a good one time use type of thing) and you can get disposable O2 stuff at homedepot/ most hardware stores. When it comes down to the wire Macgyvering something might just be necessary. If you do go the pet stor O2 route make sure to boil the stone in water for 15mins then soak it in starsan and NEVER use it again. They are only like $2 anyway. Hope this helps and I am sorry to hear that your order got so screwed up, it makes me feel so lucky to have a good homebrew store local. I hope you take your business else ware next time.
 

TwoHeadsBrewing

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Almost one year ago, I had a similar problem with a march pump and some fittings for it. They held up shipping my order because ONE little coupler was not in stock. After a couple of days after I placed the order, I noticed the status was still "In Warehouse"...so I gave them a call. They gave me the skinny which was the part online had said "In Stock", but in fact was not. I told them they should have called ME to let me know about that and offered a different part or to ship the order without it. It's not my job to check up on their picking and packing work, and then contact THEM. The customer service agent was very kind, but explained that their web site and warehouse inventory is not "connected", but they were working on a new system to get inventory levels in sync. That was a year ago. A year.

That's why I stick with Austin or my LHBS. I know I can get good customer service from Forrest, even if it takes an extra day to get to NorCal. And if I have to pay a bit more at the LHBS for something I need right away, I'm OK with that. But although I'd like to keep my money in my home state, and support a semi-local business...I just can't justify sending any more money to those guys at B3. Maybe when they get their sh$t together I'll give them another chance.
 

kornkob

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I'm a little lost whom is this directed at?
Well-- there's this:
I had a customer that wanted me to give 10% off because another store does that for him. I said as long as I get to match thier price. They are on average 20% more expensive than me. The bag of grain he wanted was $20 more but he got a 10% discount.
Customer asked for a discount. Instead of giving the customer the best price, the retailer says that what he did do is charged the customer more than his advertised price. Then he comes on the most popular homebrew board and brags about that.

What he could have done is this: worked up a verifiable quote using competitor's prices and then applied a discount to bring that price down to what he would have charged anyway. Then the customer would have been really happy--- he would have gotten a 20% discount instead of a 10% discount. Then he could come on here and bragged about how he exceeded his customer's expectations just like he always tries to do because he loves all his customers that much.
 

springer

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Where in that post do you see that he ripped off a customer he never said he charged him the higher price . He stated clearly to the customer that he would give the customer the 10% off if he could use the other stores higher price.


You are reading things in there that aren't there.
 

McKBrew

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I make a post about how uncool it is when people jump on a vendor trashing bandwagon like a shark feeding frenzy and then you come on and directly trash a competitor.

Totally uncool lame move.

I just lost some respect. This is something I have never done in my 30 year career for many reasons not the least of which is that I treat others as I would hope they would treat me. You should be above this s#$%.
I don't think Forrest ever actually specified any business, did he? More of a general comment about all bad service. :confused:

Customer asked for a discount. Instead of giving the customer the best price, the retailer says that what he did do is charged the customer more than his advertised price. Then he comes on the most popular homebrew board and brags about that.

What he could have done is this: worked up a verifiable quote using competitor's prices and then applied a discount to bring that price down to what he would have charged anyway. Then the customer would have been really happy--- he would have gotten a 20% discount instead of a 10% discount. Then he could come on here and bragged about how he exceeded his customer's expectations just like he always tries to do because he loves all his customers that much.


Basically it sounds like he tried to do that, but the guy was more adamant about his 10% discount than the best price. Some people are like that. They see discount and fail to focus on anything else.
 

kornkob

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Where in that post do you see that he ripped off a customer he never said he charged him the higher price . He stated clearly to the customer that he would give the customer the 10% off if he could use the other stores higher price?


You are reading things in there that aren't there.
Strike 'ripped off'.

replace with 'manipulated a customer's ignorance to his own financial advantage'.

Or just consider this: good customer service would have resulted in the customer getting the best price. This retailer did not give the customer the best price and did so knowingly. So this retailer acknowledges that he does not give his customers the best customer service he can.
 

springer

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Strike 'ripped off'.

replace with 'manipulated a customer's ignorance to his own financial advantage'.
Again Forrest never said he charged the higher price and I don't think he would have anyway . I say just about the same to people who ask about a discount they get somewhere else that my company doesn't offer . Its really not a "discount" if you are still above my price for the same item after said discount.
 

Reelale

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What he could have done is this: worked up a verifiable quote using competitor's prices and then applied a discount to bring that price down to what he would have charged anyway. Then the customer would have been really happy--- he would have gotten a 20% discount instead of a 10% discount.
Isn't that "manipulating" also?
 

Evan!

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Strike 'ripped off'.

replace with 'manipulated a customer's ignorance to his own financial advantage'.

Or just consider this: good customer service would have resulted in the customer getting the best price. This retailer did not give the customer the best price and did so knowingly. So this retailer acknowledges that he does not give his customers the best customer service he can.
Uh, I don't think he manipulated him. Sounded to me like he laid all the cards out on the table and the customer made a choice.

There's a difference between giving someone "the best price" and honoring a competitor's "% off" coupon when your stuff is already lower at retail price.

For example, let's say you sold dildos for a living. The Assreamer 5000 sold for $80 at your dildo shop. Down the street, at another dildo shop, they sell the same product for $100, but they have a 20% off coupon in the newspaper. Do you think it would be reasonable for a customer to come into your shop and demand that you "match" (not really matching) the competitor's 20% off coupon, applied to your already-low price, meaning they'd get the Assreamer 5000 for $64? Of course not. That's not "getting the best price", it's asking a retailer to honor a coupon from another store that has higher base prices to begin with...which, IMHO, is unreasonable. Again, Forrest laid the cards out on the table for the guy, you can't fault him for the dude being retarded.
 

kornkob

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Again Forrest never said he charged the higher price
Valid point. I did get the impression that he was bragging up how he bagged on a customer but I can see how he might not have meant to leave that impression.

It's notable that he didn't say either way. The story reads like a 'I have a stupid customer' story, not a 'here's how I give superior service that other's do not' story.
 

Evan!

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Back on topic: add me to the list of dissatisfied Morebeer customers. I won't order from them again until I have verifiable proof that their ordering system is fixed. I lost count of how many times I placed an order, and the items I ordered said "in stock", but the entire order got held up because one of the "in stock" items wasn't actually in stock. The customer service dudes said they were working on fixing their system, but apparently, it's still a problem.
 

springer

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Valid point. I did get the impression that he was bragging up how he bagged on a customer but I can see how he might not have meant to leave that impression.

It's notable that he didn't say either way. The story reads like a 'I have a stupid customer' story, not a 'here's how I give superior service that other's do not' story.
working with customers all day I have to say some aren't the sharpest knives in the draw. But you have to make them happy.
 

JesseRC

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Back on topic: add me to the list of dissatisfied Morebeer customers. I won't order from them again until I have verifiable proof that their ordering system is fixed. I lost count of how many times I placed an order, and the items I ordered said "in stock", but the entire order got held up because one of the "in stock" items wasn't actually in stock. The customer service dudes said they were working on fixing their system, but apparently, it's still a problem.

Yup, I think the satisfied customers are the ones that ordered 1 item. I placed a couple of $200 orders last year. We're talking like atleast 30 items. They held my order up for a $.97 airlock! When I finally b*tched after 1.5 weeks, they said they'd send the order without. By that time, now my carboy was back ordered....geeez!

I guess its been exactly a year and stuff still hasnt gotten fixed with their ordering system.
 

kornkob

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working with customers all day I have to say some aren't the sharpest knives in the draw. But you have to make them happy.
Agreed.

Excellent customer service is one part respect and one part problem solving.
 

kornkob

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Yup, I think the satisfied customers are the ones that ordered 1 item.
That may be in general. In my case it is not true. The tubing was one item in a long list of items I ordered and they fixed it right quick.

Large orders do increase the chance of encountering this sort of problem though and they really should have a process in place to catch long term hold ups in shipping.


I guess its been exactly a year and stuff still hasnt gotten fixed with their ordering system.
If their stock system is not connected to their web order system then what they should be doing is dropping the 'in stock' tags on the web page at the very least. That it's been going on for over a year (and I think but can be sure that I ran into a similar instance 2 years ago-- but it cold have been a different retailer) then they know what the problem is and should take steps to correct it.
 

springer

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I will still use them for something like the 3 gallon corney sale but for everyday orders that I need right away I will order from the vendors here. Always fast on order fulfillment and great communication if a problem does come up.
 

dasein668

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What good is free shipping when they treat you like SH** and are always out of things. Compare total delivered price not just "Free Shipping"
Well, they've never been out of what I was trying to order, they haven't treated me like SH**, and their prices on many things are competitive, in my experience. Trust me, I pay close attention to the total delivered price. In most cases I've found that for the sorts of items I generally am ordering via mail, final delivered price is usually comparable or lower than other sources.

Others don't have the same experience; that's fine. ::shrug::

I do try to spread my dollars out among many vendors as I feel it's good to support competition.
 

agusus

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This whole shark feeding frenzy that starts every single time someone whines about a bad turn they take at one of the many vendors out there is often silly. Except the threads on kegkits.com that guy does seem to ripping people off

I've seen them for AHS BMW Midwest, CHI, and plenty of others.
+1 to dontman's post. For every person that had a bad experience there are probably 10 people that had fine experiences and just aren't on this forum.

I absolutely love morebeer.com. Why? Because they're the cheapest liquid malt extract provider I can find, and they ship it in sturdy plastic foil (mylar?) bags. On the other hand, on my first (and only) order with AHS they shipped LME in a plastic bucket which exploded/leaked during shipping. So I'm very happy with Morebeer's extract bags, which seem almost unbreakable. In my last shipment they actually double bagged them with an exterior clear plastic bag (this isn't necessary in my opinion, maybe it keeps a couple nervous nellie customers happy).

I've never had a problem with them. I don't buy equipment though - just LME and sometimes some dry yeast.

They get their extract prices so low by having a full time guy who takes drums of extract and bags them in the mylar bags and they have a direct connect with the malt manufacturers and distributors in their area. http://morebeer.com/search/103482/beerwinecoffee/coffeewinebeer/MoreBeers_Fresh_Liquid_Malt_Extract
 

Shooter

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Back on topic: add me to the list of dissatisfied Morebeer customers. I won't order from them again until I have verifiable proof that their ordering system is fixed. I lost count of how many times I placed an order, and the items I ordered said "in stock", but the entire order got held up because one of the "in stock" items wasn't actually in stock. The customer service dudes said they were working on fixing their system, but apparently, it's still a problem.
Let me start by noting, as I have before, that I've NEVER ordered from More Beer, because I can drive there in 35-40 minutes. I could actually drive to Williams Brewing even faster, but they don't have a retail store front!

I will also say I really enjoy going there and get great service, but the point made above is completely valid. What also amazes me is how many "out of stock" items are actually "in stock" when I go their. This is at their Concord location and the shipping warehouse is right there. I've lost count of the number of times I've walked in believing something to be out of stock, based on my online research, and, when I ask about it, one of the sales staff takes me back into the warehouse and there they are right there on the shelf, ten of them sitting there staring back at us. They REALLY need to fix their inventory system!!
 

MBasile

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I use MoreBeer because one of their retail locations is my LHBS. I thought their shops had bad customer service, but I'm realizing they are just quiet people that work there. My only complaint is that they do run out of stuff quite often, but I think thats the fault of the main headquarters in Concord, not the Los Altos shop itself. Half the stuff on their website is "Temporarily Out of Stock." Perhaps they should stop sponsoring The Brewing Network and focus that money on improving their stock.

shooter they may hold back some inventory for walk in customers . I have seen companies do this
That is still poor inventory control though. If you occasionally run low on perishable items, thats one thing. However, they CONSTANTLY run low on perishable items AS WELL AS non-perishable items such as hardware. I think they need a better warehouse manager.
 

springer

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I use MoreBeer because one of their retail locations is my LHBS. I thought their shops had bad customer service, but I'm realizing they are just quiet people that work there. My only complaint is that they do run out of stuff quite often, but I think thats the fault of the main headquarters in Concord, not the Los Altos shop itself. Half the stuff on their website is "Temporarily Out of Stock." Perhaps they should stop sponsoring The Brewing Network and focus that money on improving their stock.



That is still poor inventory control though. If you occasionally run low on perishable items, thats one thing. However, they CONSTANTLY run low on perishable items AS WELL AS non-perishable items such as hardware. I think they need a better warehouse manager.
Ya I hear you but this seems the way of a lot of companies these days keep the inventory low for fear that it may sit on the shelf for a while.
 

JKoravos

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Ordered from B3 a few times, no problems, but it really is ridiculous how much stuff is out of stock. Whoever manages their inventory should be fired. They must be losing a ton of business to better stocked stores.
 

Shooter

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shooter they may hold back some inventory for walk in customers . I have seen companies do this
Possible, but you wouldn't think they'd need to hold more than a few back, not a dozen.

I use MoreBeer because one of their retail locations is my LHBS. I thought their shops had bad customer service, but I'm realizing they are just quiet people that work there. My only complaint is that they do run out of stuff quite often, but I think thats the fault of the main headquarters in Concord, not the Los Altos shop itself. Half the stuff on their website is "Temporarily Out of Stock." Perhaps they should stop sponsoring The Brewing Network and focus that money on improving their stock.
...I think they need a better warehouse manager.
It's tough, because I like More Beer and The Brewing Network, but I think you have a pretty good point here! :(
 

Schnitzengiggle

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I have only placed one order from Morebeer, a 15 gallon kettle, and I actually received it very quickly no dings, dents or complaints. Having said that, when I am windows shopping online their website consistently has "Out of Stock" marked on quite a bit of their inventory.

Luckily, for ingredients I have a good LHBS, but I always order my equipment and parts online searching for the best delivered price.

FWIW, there should be a sticky of vendors that discount for AHA members!
 

northernlad

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Well-- there's this:


Customer asked for a discount. Instead of giving the customer the best price, the retailer says that what he did do is charged the customer more than his advertised price. Then he comes on the most popular homebrew board and brags about that.

What he could have done is this: worked up a verifiable quote using competitor's prices and then applied a discount to bring that price down to what he would have charged anyway. Then the customer would have been really happy--- he would have gotten a 20% discount instead of a 10% discount. Then he could come on here and bragged about how he exceeded his customer's expectations just like he always tries to do because he loves all his customers that much.
You misunderstand. I know others have jumped on you but let me put it another way.
As a person in restaurant equipment sales, I get asked the discount question all the time. We do not discount our floor prices, we offer our best price the first time out. When a customer is busting our balls we use the same tactic Forrest did to try to get through their thick skull.
He was merely trying to make a point to the customer who could not hear him that he would be happy to give the customer the 10%, but would have to charge what the other guy was to make it happen as his prices were ALREADY 10% or more lower.
This is not SOP, but is necessary sometimes to make a point. It has nothing to do with unfair pricing, gouging, ripping people off.

I almost ordered from Forrest this last time because of B3 outages, but I was not married to my original choices and found items that were on special. I will check out the membership and see how it plays for me in the NW.
 

Austinhomebrew

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That and bragging about how you ripped off a customer instead of educating them isn't really showing your awesome customer service skills.
I gave the customer a much better price than the other store's price with a 10% discount. I did educate the customer. I did not rip off anyone.

Forrest
 

Austinhomebrew

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Well-- there's this:


Customer asked for a discount. Instead of giving the customer the best price, the retailer says that what he did do is charged the customer more than his advertised price. Then he comes on the most popular homebrew board and brags about that.

What he could have done is this: worked up a verifiable quote using competitor's prices and then applied a discount to bring that price down to what he would have charged anyway. Then the customer would have been really happy--- he would have gotten a 20% discount instead of a 10% discount. Then he could come on here and bragged about how he exceeded his customer's expectations just like he always tries to do because he loves all his customers that much.
I can understand your confusion. I guess I didn't word it clear enough. I showed the customer that even with the 10% off at the other store we are cheaper. Sorry for the confusion.

Forrest
 

Tonedef131

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Midwest is the cheapest when it's all said and done every time I do price comparisons. They have a huge selection, 95% of the time they have exactly what I am looking for and I am a very specific and picky customer. The couple of times they have made errors on my orders they were very good about making it right. The 5% AHA membership discount doesn't hurt either.
 

Austinhomebrew

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Uh, I don't think he manipulated him. Sounded to me like he laid all the cards out on the table and the customer made a choice.

There's a difference between giving someone "the best price" and honoring a competitor's "% off" coupon when your stuff is already lower at retail price.

For example, let's say you sold dildos for a living. The Assreamer 5000 sold for $80 at your dildo shop. Down the street, at another dildo shop, they sell the same product for $100, but they have a 20% off coupon in the newspaper. Do you think it would be reasonable for a customer to come into your shop and demand that you "match" (not really matching) the competitor's 20% off coupon, applied to your already-low price, meaning they'd get the Assreamer 5000 for $64? Of course not. That's not "getting the best price", it's asking a retailer to honor a coupon from another store that has higher base prices to begin with...which, IMHO, is unreasonable. Again, Forrest laid the cards out on the table for the guy, you can't fault him for the dude being retarded.
Thanks for the illustrative explaination. That is what I meant.

Forrest
 

Austinhomebrew

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On the other hand, on my first (and only) order with AHS they shipped LME in a plastic bucket which exploded/leaked during shipping.
We ship approimately 20,000 extract buckets a year and so far this year we have had 3 buckets that did not make it intact. With any container there can be an occasional problem.

Forrest
 

Brew-boy

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I am not defending them in anyway but I really never had a problem with them. I once had an O2 regulator break on me about 4 months of using it. I emailed Chris G and he sent me out a new one no questions asked, so for me it was great. They do seem to be out of a lot of items like others have said. I do know when people order items that show in stock and they are out of stock they do not tell you which would make me mad as well. I mostly buy from Midwest and Northern brewer because they are closer to me. Although I did sell a junky car and Forrest got all that money for some stainless thing they call a conical.
 

DRoyLenz

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Midwest is the cheapest when it's all said and done every time I do price comparisons. They have a huge selection, 95% of the time they have exactly what I am looking for and I am a very specific and picky customer. The couple of times they have made errors on my orders they were very good about making it right. The 5% AHA membership discount doesn't hurt either.
I've done comparison pricing between Midwest and AHS (my most common vendors) a couple of times. Midwest consistently has lower prices, HOWEVER, when I include the flat rate shipping from AHS, and the estimated shipping cost from MW, it usually comes out pretty even, or in the case of my last order, slightly in favor of AHS. I can get my MW order in 2 days, and AHS usually in 3.

I love both company's, and will continue to shop with them in the future.

As far as MoreBeer, I've never ordered from them, but, even before reading this thread I knew they were not the company for me. I was waiting to order Jamil's Hazelnut Porter recipe for 3-4 weeks. They kept insisting that they would have the Hazelnut Extract in the next week, then the next week. When they finally did get it in, it was still listed as "Out of Stock," and when I called about it, they said "yeah, we finally have the extract, but we're out of something else now." Also, like many other posters here, I see "Out of Stock" all over there website. So I have no personal issue with them, and will continue to browse their site when I'm trying to find the best deal, I'm just going to think twice before hitting the "Confirm Order" button.
 
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