You can get a flow control faucet too, im sure you knew that already, with this type of beer i always bottle condition anyway, if i kegged this type of beer id probably be in prison
Mystery ingredient in Duvel?
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VikeMan
It ain't all burritos and strippers, my friend.
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Couple of choices if you want to do it:
- Swap out your regular line for a longer line for this beer. Beer line is cheap, generally speaking.
- Use a Flow Control faucet.
HB2 HughBHomeBrew
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Having a little "Duvel Clone" right now. It LOOKS a lot like Duvel with the foamy head. Tastes good, but it's not Duvel. This is from Northern Brewer's all grain kit - "Belgian Strong Golden." I used 2 packs of BE-256 for 5 gallon batch. 1.079 -> 1.006 ABV 9.6%. It's quite enjoyable but not Duvel. Nice head but not as fizzy or clear.
I wanted to try that kit, would you brew it again?
HB2 HughBHomeBrew
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Definitely!
I’m pretty sure there is a recipe for Duvel in the book “Clonebrews” which was a best seller in the 90s. Anybody have it or tried that one? Belgians are not my thing. I tried brewing Leffe a couple times for my dad because it became one of his favorites after I bought him a case one year around Christmas. Outside of that, I don’t brew belgians and haven’t for over a decade.
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1214 says Abbey Ale yeast, reputed to be Chimay? 3864 became private collection with limited availabilty, “Canadian/Belgian ale”. Now that couldn’t be Unibroue, could it? I’ve used 3864 in the past and I remember the beer (belgian strong golden) having almost a candy sweetness. Ymmv.
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This article from CB&B has some insight on how Duvel is made. I find it interesting that they use a combination of natural and forced carbonation.
https://beerandbrewing.com/giving-the-devil-its-due-brewing-it-golden-and-strong-the-duvel-way/
https://beerandbrewing.com/giving-the-devil-its-due-brewing-it-golden-and-strong-the-duvel-way/
I've tried and not replicated it, but the results were still excellent. I wouldn't discourage anyone from trying.
I agree if its a quest, go for it, i sure did. At the end of the day its just beer this is our hobby it’s supposed to be fun and enjoyable but get it out of your head that it will be a clone of duvel , it never will be and if i can save people from disappointment and get their expectations in line with reality thats a good thing, you can brew a very nice award winning BGSA for sure no question, but wont be duvel and truth is thats not a bad thing unless you are like how i was trying to nail it spot on homebrewed duvel, that will break your heart
Take this for what its worth or whatever you can get out of it. I have not run it through any calculators.
The recipe in Clonebrews says:
5 gallons
OG: 1.079-1.082
FG: 1.012-1.015
IBU: 31
SRM: 5
9.75 lb Belgian Pilsener malt
.5 lb German light crystal 2.5L *
.25 Belgian Aromatic malt
1 lb Belgian clear candi sugar
1.33 lb corn sugar
1.25 oz Styrian Goldings 5% 60 min
.5 oz Styrian Goldings 15 min
.5 oz Saaz 15 min
.5 oz Styrian Goldings 3 min
For yeast they say reculture it from a bottle or two of Duvel
They say after primary fermentation to transfer to secondary (the book is from 1998) and add 1 lb of corn sugar boiled in 1 pint of water and (seperately) 1 oz of pear flavoring.
When fermentation is complete, cold condition at 35 degrees F for 4 weeks before bottling.
* never heard of it nor do I have any idea where you would get such a thing
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And here’s what information Duvel’s website gives us:
Apart from pure spring water, which is the main ingredient of beer, barley is the most important raw material. Barley must germinate for five days in the malt house, after which malt remains. The colour of the malt and as a consequence also of the beer is determined by the temperature. Duvel obtains its typical bitterness by adding various varieties of aromatic Slovenian and Czech hops. We use only exclusive hops that are renowned for their constant, outstanding quality.
HOP
Saaz-Saaz & Styrian Golding
Duvel ferments for the first time in tanks at 20 to 26°C. The brewer uses his own culture for this. The original yeast strain, which Albert Moortgat himself selected in the 1920’s, originates from Scotland. After maturing in storage tanks in which the beer is cooled down to -2°C, the drink is ready for bottling. Thanks to the addition of extra sugars and yeast, the beer ferments again in the bottle. This occurs in warm cellars (24°C) and takes two weeks.
Then the beer is moved to cold cellars, where it continues to mature and stabilize for a further six weeks. This extra long maturation period is unique and contributes to the refined flavour and pure taste of Duvel.
Thanks to its surprisingly high alcohol content (8.5 %), enormous head, fine effervescence and silky smooth feel in the mouth, Duvel stands out clearly from other Belgian beers.
Apart from pure spring water, which is the main ingredient of beer, barley is the most important raw material. Barley must germinate for five days in the malt house, after which malt remains. The colour of the malt and as a consequence also of the beer is determined by the temperature. Duvel obtains its typical bitterness by adding various varieties of aromatic Slovenian and Czech hops. We use only exclusive hops that are renowned for their constant, outstanding quality.
HOP
Saaz-Saaz & Styrian Golding
Duvel ferments for the first time in tanks at 20 to 26°C. The brewer uses his own culture for this. The original yeast strain, which Albert Moortgat himself selected in the 1920’s, originates from Scotland. After maturing in storage tanks in which the beer is cooled down to -2°C, the drink is ready for bottling. Thanks to the addition of extra sugars and yeast, the beer ferments again in the bottle. This occurs in warm cellars (24°C) and takes two weeks.
Then the beer is moved to cold cellars, where it continues to mature and stabilize for a further six weeks. This extra long maturation period is unique and contributes to the refined flavour and pure taste of Duvel.
Thanks to its surprisingly high alcohol content (8.5 %), enormous head, fine effervescence and silky smooth feel in the mouth, Duvel stands out clearly from other Belgian beers.
I think I figured it out, just waiting for my simcoe hops and im all set probably step mash this one and ferment at around 98f (blood temp) to really bring out the esters
View attachment 770528
You just need a little pear flavoring and you will definitely nail it!
WLP400 makes its own pear esters. Try it.
Duvel has a unique perfumey aroma also and a unique mouthfeel, its like the carbonation explodes on your palate very soft zero bite its like a pillow
Gotta watch Karo - it has vanilla flavor in it. Says so right on the front of the labelI think I figured it out, just waiting for my simcoe hops and im all set probably step mash this one and ferment at around 98f (blood temp) to really bring out the esters
View attachment 770528
The vanilla is what gives duvel its lacing
monkeymath
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M. Night Shyamalan plot twist: it's pears. Harvested from pear trees that have been watered with Duvel by a paradoxon-defying time traveller.
I think you’re right and pretty sure moortgat uses the tears of tormented angels as its base water and sacrifices virgins and uses their blood to bring the mash ph down
I just realized all the old charts say WY1388 is Duvel (Moortgart).
Thats what they say
mashpaddled
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I wouldn't trust any of those recipes. Back in those days every recipe had an obligatory chunk of crystal malt and any Belgian recipe had candi sugar. The recipe might get you close but there are better clones out there.
I agree, fresh Duvel in Europe is in its own class. So much going on like many of the great Belgian beers. Matty, what has been your favorite Belgian yeast so far? Duvel or Tripel...
Dont have much experience with Belgian yeast other then 1388 and 570, its the only Belgian(duvel) i try to brew, predominately a German Pilsner and stout brewer 99% of the time
Edit: and a annual “lambic” only belgians i brew
Northern_Brewer
British - apparently some US company stole my name
They're not uncommon in British yeasts (noting where the Duvel yeast originally came from), the pear is quite prominent in eg bottled TT Boltmaker.
SRJHops
Why did the rabbit like NEIPA's so much?
Have you ever tried co-pitching with a Saison yeast? I do it for all my blonds, golden strongs, and tripels. Combined with low mash temps and lots of sugar, mine all finish under 1.005. Very dry.
Regarding carbonation, I feel like Duvel is over the top. Yes, these beers need high carbonation, but at some point it's all just for show.
I actually bet the OP has made a golden strong as good or better than Duvel.
I wish but never, i think i make great beer but not ashamed to admit my bgsa are pretty crappy and had made undrinkable and dumper level bgsa, i dont know why this style gives me a such a hard time probably cause im using duvel as a base line
SRJHops
Why did the rabbit like NEIPA's so much?
I think you should aspire to making one better than Duvel! Personally, I've had much tastier golden strongs. None have that foam, but who cares?
I can't remember if you posted a recipe, but I bet folks would be willing to help tweak it. One tip I would share is to co-pitch with a Saison strain to dry out the beer.
Maybe somebody has a clone for this? I like it better than Duvel.
My bgs are very simple recipe 85% Pilsner mash low 143f and step mash up to mash out over the coarse of 2 hours, 15% sugar, saaz hops ( styrian golding if i can get) also and 1388/570 but i came to the conclusion i really dislike these yeast strains need to sub with something else
I think making exact Belgian beer clones is kind of a fool's errand. Not because it is foolish but because all of these beers are designed to be unique to have a place in the market. That uniqueness is pretty much the yeast which we do not have access to. So focus on process and make your own unique Belgian inspired beer that is close but fresh compared to the beaten up examples we get in the states. Great hot and cold side technique will take you quite a lot of the way. Then try all of the yeasts out there and find your favorite and learn it.
It definitely is a fool’s errand, its like trying to make coca cola at home
Not to mention, a lot of breweries develop their own microbiome or microenvironment, some use foeders that are a couple hundred years old. A lot of beer character on some of those brands would be specific to that point of manufacture, not only yeast but process.
Craft Beer & Brewing just had an interesting guide on making Belgian Golden Strong Ales and Duvel in particular. There's lots of emphasis on thermal load in the article. I have a subscription but was not logged in, so I think this may not be behind the firewall. https://www.getdrip.com/broadcasts/755838424/cd4cc51c126d83d38f7aa.
VikeMan
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I just ran across some notes I took during a podcast with Duvel brewer Sven Dekleermaeker in February of last year.
- Water comes from their 60 ft well
- Pils Malt - 3 or 4 different maltster's malts in each batch
- Styrian Golding and Saaz Saaz Hops
- 32 IBUs
- 8.5% ABV
- 6 EBC (~3 SRM)
- 3 hour step mash, at 63C-64C (~146F) and 72C (~162F)
- Sugar is added, but NOT in the boil
- Avoid thermal load, e.g. cool wort fast, no whirlpool, to avoid picking up color
- Pitch at 20C (68F), free rise to 26C (~79F,no higher), ~5 days fermentation
- Avoid stressing yeast during fermentation - MILD temperature control (i.e. difference between fermenter temp and the temp of cooling medium as small as possible)
- Cool over 2-3 days to 0C (32F), lager for 20 days
- Bottling yeast is same strain as fermentation strain
- Avoid oxygen at bottling, because yeast only picks up a small amount of O2
- Bottle carbonation to 8.5 g/L (4.3 Volumes), 2 weeks in warm cellar, 6 weeks in cold cellar
- Water comes from their 60 ft well
- Pils Malt - 3 or 4 different maltster's malts in each batch
- Styrian Golding and Saaz Saaz Hops
- 32 IBUs
- 8.5% ABV
- 6 EBC (~3 SRM)
- 3 hour step mash, at 63C-64C (~146F) and 72C (~162F)
- Sugar is added, but NOT in the boil
- Avoid thermal load, e.g. cool wort fast, no whirlpool, to avoid picking up color
- Pitch at 20C (68F), free rise to 26C (~79F,no higher), ~5 days fermentation
- Avoid stressing yeast during fermentation - MILD temperature control (i.e. difference between fermenter temp and the temp of cooling medium as small as possible)
- Cool over 2-3 days to 0C (32F), lager for 20 days
- Bottling yeast is same strain as fermentation strain
- Avoid oxygen at bottling, because yeast only picks up a small amount of O2
- Bottle carbonation to 8.5 g/L (4.3 Volumes), 2 weeks in warm cellar, 6 weeks in cold cellar
Thanks for the info. Can you point to the podcast? Sounds like a great listen. I would also add that since Duvel is a decent sized operation, they are probably using large tanks so pressure during fermentation would probably factor into the equation.
